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From: dje@5941ux.UUCP
Newsgroups: net.flame,net.politics
Subject: Re: A Flame at Affirmative Action
Message-ID: <286@5941ux.UUCP>
Date: Tue, 14-Jun-83 09:21:33 EDT
Article-I.D.: 5941ux.286
Posted: Tue Jun 14 09:21:33 1983
Date-Received: Wed, 15-Jun-83 02:55:23 EDT
Lines: 64

ssc-vax!jobe asks:
 
	Where *were* you people when it was minority people that were being 
	discriminated against?  Why is it that you will only complain about it 
	when it seems to threaten *you*??

	It seems to me that discrimination isn't discrimination; only *reverse*
	discrimination is discrimination....

I'm not going to play down the history or effects of racial discrimination.
Discrimination is indeed real, and more than just the "designated" minority
groups are affected by it.  Let me cite some examples of anti-Jewish
discrimination.

A generation ago, my mother applied for a clerical position with New York
Telephone.  She wore a Jewish star pendant to the interview.  The job
required only a 30 wpm typing skill, but the employment representative told
her she had to type 50 wpm to get the job.  Well, she *could* type 50 wpm,
so he replied that she couldn't be hired unless she knew steno.  She told him 
she could do steno, and he now said she had to be fluent in Spanish.  When she 
explained to him that Spanish was her undergraduate major, he had no more 
excuses.  "Look, lady," he said, staring at her pendant, "You don't understand.
No matter how qualified you are, you just aren't qualified."

Well, things are different now, or are they?  A friend of mine got his Master's
degree from MIT in Chemical Engineering, and applied to a large and very well
known Ohio-based corporation that makes detergents and other household 
products.  At the end of the interview, he was asked about his surname:
"Dershowitz... now what kind of name is that?"  The interviewer followed up
with "You realize we can't hire you; you just wouldn't fit in."  My friend
told him that this kind of discrimination was illegal, only to be informed
that the corporation would categorically deny that any such exchange had ever
taken place.  Applicants who don't get the job make all kinds of false and
defamatory accusations that could get them into serious trouble...

Another example, this time from my personal experience.  I was once told in
private by a manager who participates in my merit evaluation that Jews are
articulate and forceful in their conversation, which tends to put other people
off.  It was just an offhand, casual remark, probably long forgotten by the
other party.  But the message was not lost on me.

Now, another example to show how affirmative action affects the picture.  My
wife held a six-month temporary teaching job, at which she performed well.
When she applied for a permanent slot, she was passed up so that the school
could hire a minority applicant.  The person hired had less teaching experience
than my wife, and he lacked the college degree that was allegedly a requirement
for the position.  But he got the position, and my wife was left without a job.

"We people" suffer from discrimination too, and we're getting it from
both sides, forward *and* reverse.  Discrimination is wrong, even if it is
sponsored with the best of intentions.

Finally, where were "we" when "you" were being discriminated against?  Jews
were in the forefront of the civil rights movement from its beginning.  Who
still remembers Schwerner, Cheney and Goodman?  And what is the predominant
attitude "we" see from minorities?  Hostility towards Zionism, our own
national movement.  Accusations that we are racist and insensitive.

You say you are "still trying to understand you people."  I hope this article
contributes to that understanding.  There's a lot of common ground between
us.  I can only hope for more understanding and cooperation in the future.

Dave Ellis / Bell Labs, Piscataway NJ
...!{ariel,lime}!houti!hogpc!houxm!5941ux!dje