Relay-Version: version B 2.10 5/3/83; site utzoo.UUCP Path: utzoo!linus!genrad!decvax!harpo!floyd!vax135!ariel!houti!hogpc!houxm!mhuxa!mhb5b!smb From: smb@mhb5b.UUCP Newsgroups: net.flame,net.politics Subject: Re: racism and hi-tech Message-ID: <442@mhb5b.UUCP> Date: Mon, 13-Jun-83 10:14:48 EDT Article-I.D.: mhb5b.442 Posted: Mon Jun 13 10:14:48 1983 Date-Received: Wed, 15-Jun-83 03:03:18 EDT Lines: 37 I don't necessarily agree that all of what mhb5b!smb calls "statistical discrimination patterns" are really discrimination or that they need to be remedied. It is possible that some form of affirmative action is needed to insure promotion of deserving women and minorities. However, if more men than women want to be police officers and more women want to be dress designers, what compelling reason is there to try to change such "societal patterns"? I don't believe that we have to force the composition of every workplace to reflect the composition of society in order to solve the problem of discrimination. I never advocated matching the composition of every workplace to that of society; I'm fully aware of restrictions (such as interest and qualifications) that would make such a goal impractical even if I felt it desirable. But one of the studies I had in mind when I wrote my note was about promotion and pay patterns among women scientists. *After* correcting for age, experience, specialty, etc., the researchers found that women were promoted less often, and even at comparable ranks received salaries that were 80% of what their male colleagues received. (This study was conducted by the U.S. Department of Labor, and mentioned in Science News a few years ago. I can dig up the precise reference if anyone is interested.) Because affirmative action programs provide little incentive for giving full education and training to minorities, minority unemployment continues to be high; this allows minorities to allege that racism is rampant and allows bigots to allege that minorities are lazy and stupid. I believe that the best solution to problems of discrimination is to give various elements of society a positive incentive to help *all* people those whose abilities are going to waste because of a lack of education and/or training. On the contrary -- affirmative action provides plenty of incentive to supply education and training; if you're going to hire someone anyway, wouldn't you prefer that they were able to do the work?