Relay-Version: version B 2.10 5/3/83; site utzoo.UUCP Path: utzoo!linus!genrad!decvax!harpo!seismo!uwvax!myers From: myers@uwvax.UUCP Newsgroups: net.politics Subject: Re: subsidies and morality Message-ID: <936@uwvax.UUCP> Date: Sun, 19-Jun-83 22:09:20 EDT Article-I.D.: uwvax.936 Posted: Sun Jun 19 22:09:20 1983 Date-Received: Tue, 21-Jun-83 00:12:11 EDT Lines: 40 Tom Craver's remarks: >Do you think that need is the correct basis for distribution of "consumer >goods"? Who is to determine what is needed for whom? Who is to determine >who is to pay? Who determines what to do about those who refuse to work? >Who do you feel is qualified to give away other people's money? You? The >UN? What if I disagree - should I be forced to go along, and pay "my share"? >Why am I not qualified make the determination for my own money? I do believe that I detect a hint of libertarian/anarchist here! I seem to recall that you have been rather heavily involved with a certain discussion on law. Who is to decide what laws are the correct and just ones? You? The Hague? The answer is that "the people" should be making all of these decisions thru a process that is as democratic and participatory as possible. I feel that governments are necessary to prevent the "war of all against all". However, they have a tenacious habit of losing real contact with those they are supposed to be representing. I'm afraid I don't have any simple answers (like a devout belief in laissez-faire capitalism), Tom. However, we must at all turns try to work towards a system which politicizes decision making as much as possible. A system which tells us that "political involvement" consists of voting twice a year breeds indifference, ignorance, and bureaucracy, whether one is speaking of a "democratic" government or labour union. A second point is that I've been detecting a decided "money fetish", to use Georg Simmel's term (which reminds me, I must check out Ayn Rand), in this newsgroup lately. It's important to keep in mind that money is nothing more than a piece of green toilet paper which has been societally defined to be useful as a medium of exchange. The important stuff is the hard tangible products which have use-value: a toothbrush, a lathe, a computer, etc. Take a moment and think how much effort our society puts into shuffling bits of paper or electrons which have "value" around. Banks, life-insurance companies, investment firms, ad nauseum. To be sure, some kind of coordination of distribution is absolutely necessary, but the contortions monopoly capitalism goes thru! (I can here the skirmishers advancing...) Jeff Myers ...seismo!uwvax!myers