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From: welsch@houxu.UUCP
Newsgroups: net.flame
Subject: Reply to Laura (more on AAP)
Message-ID: <118@houxu.UUCP>
Date: Sat, 18-Jun-83 10:12:22 EDT
Article-I.D.: houxu.118
Posted: Sat Jun 18 10:12:22 1983
Date-Received: Tue, 21-Jun-83 10:29:48 EDT
Organization: Bell Labs, Holmdel NJ
Lines: 77

I decided to post my reply to Laura because I don't know if a
mail path exists between us and I wish to publicly defend my
earlier statements.  Besides this is net.flame and this is a
flame!


Laura,

I read your reply with interest. I do not think that you are
singling me out as the "... only person person making ...
sweeping and largely inaccurate generalizations." I do believe
that you are reading more into what I write than what was
written. Let's deal with the statement that I originally wrote:


						Given the assumption
	that intelligence does not recognize race then it is reasonable
	to expect that within a given job category the races would have
	roughly (within 2 standard deviations) the same proportions as
	in the population.

Further, let's divide the statement into two parts:

	Intelligence does not recognize race


and

	it is reasonable to expect that within a given job
	category the races would have roughly  (within 2 standard
	deviations) the same proportions as in the population.

I interpret your statement:

					NOWHERE HAVE I EVER
	SAID THAT ANY RACE IS INFERIOR TO ANY OTHER WITH RESPECT TO
	INTELLIGENCE. EVER. THIS IS NOT TRUE AND I DONT BELIEVE IT AND I WILL
	PRODUCE STATISTICS TO BACK MYSELF UP ON THIS TO ANYONE WHO DISAGREES.

that you agree with my premise. "Intelligence does not recognize
race." This was not clear to me in your first article. I deduce
you are disagreeing that the conclusion:

	it is reasonable to expect that within a given job
	category the races would have roughly  (within 2 standard
	deviations) the same proportions as in the population.

necessarily follows from the premise.

First, I believe that in chosing a person for employment
intelligence is a key factor. Even the army is willing to
overlook many factors, but if a person is retarded then the army
just won't employ her/him. Take fire fighting or police work as
other examples. The first qualification test given in New York
and New Jersey is an intelligence test.  Only those bright
enough go on to take physicals.  Those jobs that are highly
rewarded such as MD's, Dentists, etc. require proof by degrees
of a person's intelligence.  

Second, I believe when looking at a race where there are a large
number of people that there will be a large number of individual
differences, wishes, wants and desires. When a there is
significant factor that almost totally prevents members of a
race from desiring a particular profession, (An event that is
not within 2 standard deviations of the norm is unusual.) then
the factor is interfering with an individual's freedom of choice
and that factor should be changed.

Based on the arguments in the previous paragraphs I believe my
conclusion follows from my premise.

What I see is happening is that you, Laura, are saying that if
a person's freedom of choice in limited by her culture then that
is okay.  I disagree.  I think the culture should be modified.

					Larry Welsch
					houxu!welsch