| Re: car charging, was: Adobe oddity? [message #403459 is a reply to message #403440] |
Thu, 31 December 2020 17:07   |
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Originally posted by: J. Clarke
On Thu, 31 Dec 2020 13:04:17 -0700, Peter Flass
<peter_flass@yahoo.com> wrote:
> J. Clarke <jclarke.873638@gmail.com> wrote:
>> On Wed, 30 Dec 2020 15:02:25 +0200, Bud Spencer <bud@campo.verano.it>
>> wrote:
>>
>>> On Tue, 29 Dec 2020, J. Clarke wrote:
>>>
>>>> I don't think we should spend VAST amounts of money that we don't have
>>>> just because somebody thinks it might "do good".
>>>
>>> Oh, but we already are thanks to all those climate-zealots like greta and
>>> rest of the zombies. Not only that ... western dietary guidelines, all
>>> this nondemic nonsense and such are surely coming with a BIG pricetag!
>>
>> You know, that is something that strikes me as weird. Don't get me
>> wrong, I like Greta for standing up for what she believes in and
>> admire her ability to get people to listen to her. But in what
>> universe does a 15 year old know enough about anything other than the
>> life of a 15 year old for their opinion to be worth listening to when
>> deciding national environmental policy?
>>
>>> What comes to electric cars, those things surely aren't good for the
>>> environment.
>>
>> That's actually a good question. They do cut down on emissions while
>> in operation, for a variety of reasons, but how energy use in
>> construction of them compares I have no idea. My gut says that they
>> have about the same environmental signature in that regard as
>> conventional cars but my gut may be completely off-base.
>
> Plus the environmental cost of the batteries, which as of now require
> open-pit mining for rare earth metals (AFAIK), and then have a disposal
> problem.
Check again. The major use of rare earth elements in electric cars is
in magnets in the motors.
>>> Just like those wind powerplants they erect all over to ruin
>>> nature.
>>
>> That actually points out the insanity of the environmental movement.
>> One group of greenies agitates to get windmills built and then when
>> they start another group of greenies file suit to block the
>> construction.
>>
>>> Just to throw in couple things ...
>>
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| Re: Grid capacity was: car charging, was: Adobe oddity? [message #403460 is a reply to message #403452] |
Thu, 31 December 2020 17:15 |
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Originally posted by: J. Clarke
On Thu, 31 Dec 2020 14:54:19 -0700, Peter Flass
<peter_flass@yahoo.com> wrote:
> Ahem A Rivet's Shot <steveo@eircom.net> wrote:
>> On Thu, 31 Dec 2020 13:04:15 -0700
>> Peter Flass <peter_flass@yahoo.com> wrote:
>>
>>> Ahem A Rivet's Shot <steveo@eircom.net> wrote:
>>>> On Wed, 30 Dec 2020 11:31:07 -0000 (UTC)
>>>> Thomas Koenig <tkoenig@netcologne.de> wrote:
>>>>
>>>> > Nuclear combined with hydrogen generation from excess wind and
>>>> > solar power using steam electrolysis: Much better.
>>>>
>>>> This has much to recommend it in principle but hydrogen storage
>>>> is still tricky and the cycle efficiencies are pretty poor compared with
>>>> batteries. That's before you get to the hydrogen == Hindenburg
>>>> perception problem.
>>>>
>>>
>>> Fusion is on the way, real soon now ;-)
>>
>> It's still ten years away last I checked.
>>
>
> I think they’re saying 15 now. In 20 years it will probably be down to 10.
The people who have been working on it for decades say that they're
targeting around the end of the century for a working power plant.
A bunch of beltway bandits seeking to separate the taxpayer from his
wages are promising "right now". One example is Lockheed that in 2010
promised a test reactor in a year. We're still waiting.
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| Re: car charging, was: Adobe oddity? [message #403461 is a reply to message #403436] |
Thu, 31 December 2020 17:16 |
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Originally posted by: maus
On 2020-12-31, JimP <chucktheouch@gmail.com> wrote:
> On 31 Dec 2020 18:47:15 GMT, maus <maus@dmaus.org> wrote:
>> On 2020-12-31, JimP <chucktheouch@gmail.com> wrote:
>>> On Wed, 30 Dec 2020 11:22:37 -0500, J. Clarke
>>> <jclarke.873638@gmail.com> wrote:
>> beeen made of the Polish Army having taken over a small part of
>> Czechslovakia at the same time the germans did take over large bits.
>
> True, I did find an English translation of Guderian's book on the
> Eastern Front just recently. Not so much informative, but he doesn't
> mention several things. Like the gruppen that were not far behind the
> lines who murdered people.
>
>
yes. Grim stuff, the film ``Look and see'' (or similiar title) shows
what happened in Byelorussia.
A point to join the present theme to a more usefiul one, I read that the
polish crypt guys had broken a simpler machine code before 1939, and the
research had been smuggled to the British, which showed that breaking
the more complex ones that the Gerrmans switched to after the outbreak
of general war was possible.
--
greymausg@mail.com
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| Re: Grid capacity was: car charging, was: Adobe oddity? [message #403462 is a reply to message #403453] |
Thu, 31 December 2020 17:23 |
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Originally posted by: maus
On 2020-12-31, J Clarke <jclarke.873638@gmail.com> wrote:
> On Thu, 31 Dec 2020 13:04:16 -0700, Peter Flass
> <peter_flass@yahoo.com> wrote:
>
>> Bud Spencer <bud@campo.verano.it> wrote:
>>> On Wed, 30 Dec 2020, Thomas Koenig wrote:
>>>
>
> Radiation goes to rural areas, tightly focused, no humans in the way
> unless someone jumps the fence or flies into the beam. Even flying
> into the beam though, microwave is line of sight and the aircraft
> structure should provide shielding.
I love your `Logic' It may be time to diversify property investment away
from Tel Aviv or Tehran. The british Government recently allowed
fracking in the North East as `the population is so low'. Wrong area,
guys.
--
greymausg@mail.com
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| Re: car charging, was: Adobe oddity? [message #403463 is a reply to message #403455] |
Thu, 31 December 2020 17:23 |
Peter Flass
Messages: 8375
Registered: December 2011
Karma: 0
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Senior Member |
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J. Clarke <jclarke.873638@gmail.com> wrote:
> On Thu, 31 Dec 2020 13:04:21 -0700, Peter Flass
> <peter_flass@yahoo.com> wrote:
>
>> JimP <chucktheouch@gmail.com> wrote:
>>> On Thu, 31 Dec 2020 02:12:51 +0200, Bud Spencer <bud@campo.verano.it>
>>> wrote:
>>>> On Wed, 30 Dec 2020, J. Clarke wrote:
>>>>
>>>> > You know, that is something that strikes me as weird. Don't get me
>>>> > wrong, I like Greta for standing up for what she believes in and
>>>> > admire her ability to get people to listen to her. But in what
>>>> > universe does a 15 year old know enough about anything other than the
>>>> > life of a 15 year old for their opinion to be worth listening to when
>>>> > deciding national environmental policy?
>>>>
>>>> This poor abused girl doesn't "stand up for what she believes" she is
>>>> blatantly used by her parents and mad globalists who push this manmade
>>>> climate change nonsense. She is a tool nothing more. NOT a "rolemodel"
>>>> FFS!
>>>
>>> Climate changes whether you believe it does or not.
>>>
>>
>> I’m thinking we’re about one good volcanic eruption away from being back to
>> worrying about an oncoming ice age.
>
> In a way it would be nice if one happened--either it would bring on
> the cooling, or it would dump so much CO2 that whatever we're
> producing pales to insignificance.
>
Interestingly, apparently some volcanos at the east end of the Caribbean
(Leewards?) are starting to cook. Geologists say there’s no connection
between them, and no,significance to the fact that several are becoming
active at once... Also Hekla is still a potential problem.
--
Pete
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| Re: car charging, was: Adobe oddity? [message #403468 is a reply to message #403454] |
Thu, 31 December 2020 17:45 |
Ahem A Rivet's Shot
Messages: 4843
Registered: January 2012
Karma: 0
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Senior Member |
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On Thu, 31 Dec 2020 16:58:00 -0500
J. Clarke <jclarke.873638@gmail.com> wrote:
> Why is it an unreasonable estimate? Usage on electric cars is
Because electric cars won't suddenly make people drive tens times
as much as they do now. Your estimate was based on a full charge every
night which is over 350 miles per day while 35 miles per day is more
reasonable for average car use.
> different from gas cars. Instead of going to the gas station every so
> often, people come home and plug in. So every afternoon every car
> that was used for a daily commute will be plugged in and hit the grid.
Hopefully many will also be plugged in during the day in the office
car park, but that doesn't matter. My point is that 350 miles per day is a
massive overestimate of average car use and that's what you calculated the
energy use against - a full charge for a Tesla model 3 every day whereas in
reality it would take a week to ten days to use that much energy.
Yes an electric car gets charged every night with a charger capable
of providing a full charge in that time, but if only ten percent of the
charge has been used then that's all that needs drawing. You assumed a full
charge daily.
--
Steve O'Hara-Smith | Directable Mirror Arrays
C:\>WIN | A better way to focus the sun
The computer obeys and wins. | licences available see
You lose and Bill collects. | http://www.sohara.org/
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| Re: car charging, was: Adobe oddity? [message #403470 is a reply to message #403463] |
Thu, 31 December 2020 18:05 |
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Originally posted by: J. Clarke
On Thu, 31 Dec 2020 15:23:46 -0700, Peter Flass
<peter_flass@yahoo.com> wrote:
> J. Clarke <jclarke.873638@gmail.com> wrote:
>> On Thu, 31 Dec 2020 13:04:21 -0700, Peter Flass
>> <peter_flass@yahoo.com> wrote:
>>
>>> JimP <chucktheouch@gmail.com> wrote:
>>>> On Thu, 31 Dec 2020 02:12:51 +0200, Bud Spencer <bud@campo.verano.it>
>>>> wrote:
>>>> > On Wed, 30 Dec 2020, J. Clarke wrote:
>>>> >
>>>> >> You know, that is something that strikes me as weird. Don't get me
>>>> >> wrong, I like Greta for standing up for what she believes in and
>>>> >> admire her ability to get people to listen to her. But in what
>>>> >> universe does a 15 year old know enough about anything other than the
>>>> >> life of a 15 year old for their opinion to be worth listening to when
>>>> >> deciding national environmental policy?
>>>> >
>>>> > This poor abused girl doesn't "stand up for what she believes" she is
>>>> > blatantly used by her parents and mad globalists who push this manmade
>>>> > climate change nonsense. She is a tool nothing more. NOT a "rolemodel"
>>>> > FFS!
>>>>
>>>> Climate changes whether you believe it does or not.
>>>>
>>>
>>> I’m thinking we’re about one good volcanic eruption away from being back to
>>> worrying about an oncoming ice age.
>>
>> In a way it would be nice if one happened--either it would bring on
>> the cooling, or it would dump so much CO2 that whatever we're
>> producing pales to insignificance.
>>
>
> Interestingly, apparently some volcanos at the east end of the Caribbean
> (Leewards?) are starting to cook. Geologists say there’s no connection
> between them, and no,significance to the fact that several are becoming
> active at once... Also Hekla is still a potential problem.
And history has not experienced a _big_ eruption yet.
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| Re: Grid capacity was: car charging, was: Adobe oddity? [message #403471 is a reply to message #403469] |
Thu, 31 December 2020 18:13 |
Dan Espen
Messages: 3867
Registered: January 2012
Karma: 0
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Senior Member |
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Ahem A Rivet's Shot <steveo@eircom.net> writes:
> On Thu, 31 Dec 2020 17:07:02 -0500
> Dan Espen <dan1espen@gmail.com> wrote:
>
>> Ahem A Rivet's Shot <steveo@eircom.net> writes:
>>
>>> On Thu, 31 Dec 2020 13:04:15 -0700
>>> Peter Flass <peter_flass@yahoo.com> wrote:
>
>>>> Fusion is on the way, real soon now ;-)
>>>
>>> It's still ten years away last I checked.
>>
>> This was in the news recently:
>>
>> https://phys.org/news/2020-12-china-nuclear-powered-artifici al-sun.html
>>
>> My own personal opinion, it will never be practical.
>> But I'm 100% behind trying and I think sarcasm is uncalled for.
>
> I am also 100% behind trying but I have been hearing claims that it
> was ten years away (or thereabouts) for most of my life.
I think I've mostly heard 20.
Here's what Google says:
The joke about fusion energy is that it's 30 years away and always
will be. But significant recent advances in fusion science and
technology could potentially put the first fusion power on the grid as
soon as the 2040s.
I've heard 20, and always interpreted that as we have no clue but we
know it's a long way off.
--
Dan Espen
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| Re: thar she blows, car charging, was: Adobe oddity? [message #403473 is a reply to message #403470] |
Thu, 31 December 2020 21:26 |
John Levine
Messages: 1405
Registered: December 2011
Karma: 0
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Senior Member |
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In article <12msuftaq2qr6vkas5q9hqmve2ql04gnu0@4ax.com>,
J. Clarke <jclarke.873638@gmail.com> wrote:
>> Interestingly, apparently some volcanos at the east end of the Caribbean
>> (Leewards?) are starting to cook. Geologists say there’s no connection
>> between them, and no,significance to the fact that several are becoming
>> active at once... Also Hekla is still a potential problem.
>
> And history has not experienced a _big_ eruption yet.
Depends what you mean by big.
The volcano on Montserrat erupted in 1997, killed 19 people, and made
2/3 of the island uninhabitable. It's still erupting, and people still
aren't allowed back.
The volcano on Martinique erupted in 1902 and buried the largest city
on the island, St Pierre, killing about 30,000 people in a few
minutes. You can still see ruins poking out of the rock.
--
Regards,
John Levine, johnl@taugh.com, Primary Perpetrator of "The Internet for Dummies",
Please consider the environment before reading this e-mail. https://jl.ly
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| Re: polish enigmas, car charging, was: Adobe oddity? [message #403474 is a reply to message #403461] |
Thu, 31 December 2020 21:33 |
John Levine
Messages: 1405
Registered: December 2011
Karma: 0
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Senior Member |
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In article <slrnrusjdd.311.maus@dmaus.org>, maus <maus@dmaus.org> wrote:
> A point to join the present theme to a more usefiul one, I read that the
> polish crypt guys had broken a simpler machine code before 1939, and the
> research had been smuggled to the British, which showed that breaking
> the more complex ones that the Gerrmans switched to after the outbreak
> of general war was possible.
Yes, there is a memorial to them at Bletchley Park. Here's an article
with a picture of it:
https://www.bbc.com/news/uk-england-beds-bucks-herts-1414140 6
--
Regards,
John Levine, johnl@taugh.com, Primary Perpetrator of "The Internet for Dummies",
Please consider the environment before reading this e-mail. https://jl.ly
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| Re: thar she blows, car charging, was: Adobe oddity? [message #403476 is a reply to message #403473] |
Thu, 31 December 2020 23:12 |
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Originally posted by: J. Clarke
On Fri, 1 Jan 2021 02:26:46 -0000 (UTC), John Levine <johnl@taugh.com>
wrote:
> In article <12msuftaq2qr6vkas5q9hqmve2ql04gnu0@4ax.com>,
> J. Clarke <jclarke.873638@gmail.com> wrote:
>>> Interestingly, apparently some volcanos at the east end of the Caribbean
>>> (Leewards?) are starting to cook. Geologists say there’s no connection
>>> between them, and no,significance to the fact that several are becoming
>>> active at once... Also Hekla is still a potential problem.
>>
>> And history has not experienced a _big_ eruption yet.
>
> Depends what you mean by big.
>
> The volcano on Montserrat erupted in 1997, killed 19 people, and made
> 2/3 of the island uninhabitable. It's still erupting, and people still
> aren't allowed back.
>
> The volcano on Martinique erupted in 1902 and buried the largest city
> on the island, St Pierre, killing about 30,000 people in a few
> minutes. You can still see ruins poking out of the rock.
27,000 years ago Taupo in New Zealand blew, releasing 1,170 cubic
kilometers of solid material, with ash 6 inches deep 600 miles away.
To put that in perspective, Tambora was the largest volcanic eruption
in recorded history, releasing somewhere around a tenth as much
material. And Tambora caused what is known in European history as
"the year without a summer"--that was 7,000 miles away.
And Taupo wasn't anything like a worst case--there have been explosive
eruptions more than 5 times that scale--Yellowstone is know to have
blown on that same scale as Taupo and another time about twice as
large.
And that's not even mentioning long term events--Ontong Java released
more than 20 cubic kilometers per year for 3 million years.
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| Re: thar she blows, car charging, was: Adobe oddity? [message #403477 is a reply to message #403476] |
Thu, 31 December 2020 23:41 |
danny burstein
Messages: 78
Registered: October 2012
Karma: 0
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Member |
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In <av6tuft0oks7ok67j7ack8oqil2svt928u@4ax.com> J. Clarke <jclarke.873638@gmail.com> writes:
[snip]
> 27,000 years ago Taupo in New Zealand blew, releasing 1,170 cubic
> kilometers of solid material, with ash 6 inches deep 600 miles away.
over a thousand cubic kilometres? No fucking
(clickety click...) dammit, you're absolutely right.
That calls for a giant *whew*...
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Taupo_Volcano
--
_____________________________________________________
Knowledge may be power, but communications is the key
dannyb@panix.com
[to foil spammers, my address has been double rot-13 encoded]
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| Re: car charging, was: Adobe oddity? [message #403489 is a reply to message #403463] |
Fri, 01 January 2021 08:29 |
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Originally posted by: Kerr-Mudd,John
On Thu, 31 Dec 2020 22:23:46 GMT, Peter Flass <peter_flass@yahoo.com>
wrote:
> J. Clarke <jclarke.873638@gmail.com> wrote:
>> On Thu, 31 Dec 2020 13:04:21 -0700, Peter Flass
>> <peter_flass@yahoo.com> wrote:
>>
>>> JimP <chucktheouch@gmail.com> wrote:
>>>> On Thu, 31 Dec 2020 02:12:51 +0200, Bud Spencer
>>>> <bud@campo.verano.it> wrote:
>>>> > On Wed, 30 Dec 2020, J. Clarke wrote:
>>>> >
>>>> >> You know, that is something that strikes me as weird. Don't get
>>>> >> me wrong, I like Greta for standing up for what she believes in
>>>> >> and admire her ability to get people to listen to her. But in
>>>> >> what universe does a 15 year old know enough about anything other
>>>> >> than the life of a 15 year old for their opinion to be worth
>>>> >> listening to when deciding national environmental policy?
>>>> >
>>>> > This poor abused girl doesn't "stand up for what she believes" she
>>>> > is blatantly used by her parents and mad globalists who push this
>>>> > manmade climate change nonsense. She is a tool nothing more. NOT a
>>>> > "rolemodel" FFS!
>>>>
>>>> Climate changes whether you believe it does or not.
>>>>
>>>
>>> I’m thinking we’re about one good volcanic eruption away from
>>> being back to worrying about an oncoming ice age.
>>
>> In a way it would be nice if one happened--either it would bring on
>> the cooling, or it would dump so much CO2 that whatever we're
>> producing pales to insignificance.
>>
>
> Interestingly, apparently some volcanos at the east end of the
> Caribbean (Leewards?) are starting to cook. Geologists say there’s
> no connection between them, and no,significance to the fact that
> several are becoming active at once... Also Hekla is still a potential
> problem.
>
Jelly^wYellowstone is the biggest elephant in the room for US purposes,
IIRC.
--
Bah, and indeed, Humbug.
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| Re: Grid capacity was: car charging, was: Adobe oddity? [message #403490 is a reply to message #403439] |
Fri, 01 January 2021 08:35 |
Anssi Saari
Messages: 327
Registered: January 2012
Karma: 0
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Senior Member |
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Peter Flass <peter_flass@yahoo.com> writes:
> I worry about wireless energy. There’s now talk about large solar arrays in
> orbit beaming power back to earth.
I remember reading about that from a cereal box when I was a kid. Pretty
picture with cows on a pasture and the fence around them acting as the
antenna. It would probably need cheap space capability which we don't
have. Probably has the same timetable as working fusion to me.
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| Re: car charging, was: Adobe oddity? [message #403491 is a reply to message #403489] |
Fri, 01 January 2021 08:54 |
Dan Espen
Messages: 3867
Registered: January 2012
Karma: 0
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Senior Member |
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"Kerr-Mudd,John" <notsaying@127.0.0.1> writes:
> On Thu, 31 Dec 2020 22:23:46 GMT, Peter Flass <peter_flass@yahoo.com>
> wrote:
>
>> J. Clarke <jclarke.873638@gmail.com> wrote:
>>> On Thu, 31 Dec 2020 13:04:21 -0700, Peter Flass
>>> <peter_flass@yahoo.com> wrote:
>>>
>>>> JimP <chucktheouch@gmail.com> wrote:
>>>> > On Thu, 31 Dec 2020 02:12:51 +0200, Bud Spencer
>>>> > <bud@campo.verano.it> wrote:
>>>> >> On Wed, 30 Dec 2020, J. Clarke wrote:
>>>> >>
>>>> >>> You know, that is something that strikes me as weird. Don't get
>>>> >>> me wrong, I like Greta for standing up for what she believes in
>>>> >>> and admire her ability to get people to listen to her. But in
>>>> >>> what universe does a 15 year old know enough about anything other
>>>> >>> than the life of a 15 year old for their opinion to be worth
>>>> >>> listening to when deciding national environmental policy?
>>>> >>
>>>> >> This poor abused girl doesn't "stand up for what she believes" she
>>>> >> is blatantly used by her parents and mad globalists who push this
>>>> >> manmade climate change nonsense. She is a tool nothing more. NOT a
>>>> >> "rolemodel" FFS!
>>>> >
>>>> > Climate changes whether you believe it does or not.
>>>> >
>>>>
>>>> I’m thinking we’re about one good volcanic eruption away from
>>>> being back to worrying about an oncoming ice age.
>>>
>>> In a way it would be nice if one happened--either it would bring on
>>> the cooling, or it would dump so much CO2 that whatever we're
>>> producing pales to insignificance.
>>>
>>
>> Interestingly, apparently some volcanos at the east end of the
>> Caribbean (Leewards?) are starting to cook. Geologists say there’s
>> no connection between them, and no,significance to the fact that
>> several are becoming active at once... Also Hekla is still a potential
>> problem.
>>
> Jelly^wYellowstone is the biggest elephant in the room for US purposes,
> IIRC.
There was an article about it and Tambora recently.
Based on what happened at Tambora, what would happen on the East coast
of the USA is that everyone would hear the loudest sound they ever heard
and would then be permanently deaf.
Other bad things would happen, like large quantities of ash falling and
collapsing buildings.
--
Dan Espen
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| Re: car charging, was: Adobe oddity? [message #403497 is a reply to message #403445] |
Fri, 01 January 2021 12:26 |
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Originally posted by: JimP
On Thu, 31 Dec 2020 13:04:21 -0700, Peter Flass
<peter_flass@yahoo.com> wrote:
> JimP <chucktheouch@gmail.com> wrote:
>> On Thu, 31 Dec 2020 02:12:51 +0200, Bud Spencer <bud@campo.verano.it>
>> wrote:
>>> On Wed, 30 Dec 2020, J. Clarke wrote:
>>>
>>>> You know, that is something that strikes me as weird. Don't get me
>>>> wrong, I like Greta for standing up for what she believes in and
>>>> admire her ability to get people to listen to her. But in what
>>>> universe does a 15 year old know enough about anything other than the
>>>> life of a 15 year old for their opinion to be worth listening to when
>>>> deciding national environmental policy?
>>>
>>> This poor abused girl doesn't "stand up for what she believes" she is
>>> blatantly used by her parents and mad globalists who push this manmade
>>> climate change nonsense. She is a tool nothing more. NOT a "rolemodel"
>>> FFS!
>>
>> Climate changes whether you believe it does or not.
>>
>
> Im thinking were about one good volcanic eruption away from being back to
> worrying about an oncoming ice age.
There are several possibilities for that. Son of Krakatoa, Yosemite,
and one in the Azores. The large area of lava flows in Siberia
millienia ago, if that restarts, could have a major effect as well.
--
Jim
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| Re: Grid capacity was: car charging, was: Adobe oddity? [message #403498 is a reply to message #403450] |
Fri, 01 January 2021 12:27 |
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Originally posted by: JimP
On Thu, 31 Dec 2020 21:25:21 +0000, Ahem A Rivet's Shot
<steveo@eircom.net> wrote:
> On Thu, 31 Dec 2020 13:04:15 -0700
> Peter Flass <peter_flass@yahoo.com> wrote:
>
>> Ahem A Rivet's Shot <steveo@eircom.net> wrote:
>>> On Wed, 30 Dec 2020 11:31:07 -0000 (UTC)
>>> Thomas Koenig <tkoenig@netcologne.de> wrote:
>>>
>>>> Nuclear combined with hydrogen generation from excess wind and
>>>> solar power using steam electrolysis: Much better.
>>>
>>> This has much to recommend it in principle but hydrogen storage
>>> is still tricky and the cycle efficiencies are pretty poor compared with
>>> batteries. That's before you get to the hydrogen == Hindenburg
>>> perception problem.
>>>
>>
>> Fusion is on the way, real soon now ;-)
>
> It's still ten years away last I checked.
China has claimed they got 22 seconds out of their equipment. This was
in the last week or so.
--
Jim
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| Re: car charging, was: Adobe oddity? [message #403499 is a reply to message #403461] |
Fri, 01 January 2021 12:32 |
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Originally posted by: JimP
On 31 Dec 2020 22:16:13 GMT, maus <maus@dmaus.org> wrote:
> On 2020-12-31, JimP <chucktheouch@gmail.com> wrote:
>> On 31 Dec 2020 18:47:15 GMT, maus <maus@dmaus.org> wrote:
>>> On 2020-12-31, JimP <chucktheouch@gmail.com> wrote:
>>>> On Wed, 30 Dec 2020 11:22:37 -0500, J. Clarke
>>>> <jclarke.873638@gmail.com> wrote:
>>> beeen made of the Polish Army having taken over a small part of
>>> Czechslovakia at the same time the germans did take over large bits.
>>
>> True, I did find an English translation of Guderian's book on the
>> Eastern Front just recently. Not so much informative, but he doesn't
>> mention several things. Like the gruppen that were not far behind the
>> lines who murdered people.
>>
>>
>
> yes. Grim stuff, the film ``Look and see'' (or similiar title) shows
> what happened in Byelorussia.
>
> A point to join the present theme to a more usefiul one, I read that the
> polish crypt guys had broken a simpler machine code before 1939, and the
> research had been smuggled to the British, which showed that breaking
> the more complex ones that the Gerrmans switched to after the outbreak
> of general war was possible.
Yes, and some of the Polish security people who had cracked thast, and
sent off the examples to England, were captured, tortured, but never
let on what they had done.
--
Jim
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| Re: car charging, was: Adobe oddity? [message #403500 is a reply to message #403470] |
Fri, 01 January 2021 13:12 |
Peter Flass
Messages: 8375
Registered: December 2011
Karma: 0
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Senior Member |
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J. Clarke <jclarke.873638@gmail.com> wrote:
> On Thu, 31 Dec 2020 15:23:46 -0700, Peter Flass
> <peter_flass@yahoo.com> wrote:
>
>> J. Clarke <jclarke.873638@gmail.com> wrote:
>>> On Thu, 31 Dec 2020 13:04:21 -0700, Peter Flass
>>> <peter_flass@yahoo.com> wrote:
>>>
>>>> JimP <chucktheouch@gmail.com> wrote:
>>>> > On Thu, 31 Dec 2020 02:12:51 +0200, Bud Spencer <bud@campo.verano.it>
>>>> > wrote:
>>>> >> On Wed, 30 Dec 2020, J. Clarke wrote:
>>>> >>
>>>> >>> You know, that is something that strikes me as weird. Don't get me
>>>> >>> wrong, I like Greta for standing up for what she believes in and
>>>> >>> admire her ability to get people to listen to her. But in what
>>>> >>> universe does a 15 year old know enough about anything other than the
>>>> >>> life of a 15 year old for their opinion to be worth listening to when
>>>> >>> deciding national environmental policy?
>>>> >>
>>>> >> This poor abused girl doesn't "stand up for what she believes" she is
>>>> >> blatantly used by her parents and mad globalists who push this manmade
>>>> >> climate change nonsense. She is a tool nothing more. NOT a "rolemodel"
>>>> >> FFS!
>>>> >
>>>> > Climate changes whether you believe it does or not.
>>>> >
>>>>
>>>> I’m thinking we’re about one good volcanic eruption away from being back to
>>>> worrying about an oncoming ice age.
>>>
>>> In a way it would be nice if one happened--either it would bring on
>>> the cooling, or it would dump so much CO2 that whatever we're
>>> producing pales to insignificance.
>>>
>>
>> Interestingly, apparently some volcanos at the east end of the Caribbean
>> (Leewards?) are starting to cook. Geologists say there’s no connection
>> between them, and no,significance to the fact that several are becoming
>> active at once... Also Hekla is still a potential problem.
>
> And history has not experienced a _big_ eruption yet.
>
Good thing, because a big eruption such was have occurred several times in
the past would cause mass extinctions (possibly including us), ocean
acidification, and plunge earth into a major ice age.
--
Pete
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| Re: car charging, was: Adobe oddity? [message #403501 is a reply to message #403275] |
Fri, 01 January 2021 13:12 |
Peter Flass
Messages: 8375
Registered: December 2011
Karma: 0
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Senior Member |
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Andreas Kohlbach <ank@spamfence.net> wrote:
> On Thu, 31 Dec 2020 16:58:00 -0500, J. Clarke wrote:
>>
>> On Thu, 31 Dec 2020 13:04:14 -0700, Peter Flass
>> <peter_flass@yahoo.com> wrote:
>>
>>>> Or five times a more reasonable estimate meaning that a 20%
>>>> increase would cover it - which doesn't sound unreasonable even if you
>>>> push it to 30% and have people averaging 50 miles a day.
>>
>> Why is it an unreasonable estimate? Usage on electric cars is
>> different from gas cars. Instead of going to the gas station every so
>> often, people come home and plug in. So every afternoon every car
>> that was used for a daily commute will be plugged in and hit the grid.
>
> And while you're shopping, many malls provide a charging station. For
> most people, unless they live in the Death Valley or other very remote
> areas, driving an EV should not cause fears anymore "running out of juice".
I’ve seen a few charging stations, but IME just a few in a parking lot big
enough for hundreds of cars. It’s ALMOST like no one in government has
thought this thru.
--
Pete
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| Re: thar she blows, car charging, was: Adobe oddity? [message #403502 is a reply to message #403473] |
Fri, 01 January 2021 13:12 |
Peter Flass
Messages: 8375
Registered: December 2011
Karma: 0
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Senior Member |
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John Levine <johnl@taugh.com> wrote:
> In article <12msuftaq2qr6vkas5q9hqmve2ql04gnu0@4ax.com>,
> J. Clarke <jclarke.873638@gmail.com> wrote:
>>> Interestingly, apparently some volcanos at the east end of the Caribbean
>>> (Leewards?) are starting to cook. Geologists say there’s no connection
>>> between them, and no,significance to the fact that several are becoming
>>> active at once... Also Hekla is still a potential problem.
>>
>> And history has not experienced a _big_ eruption yet.
>
> Depends what you mean by big.
>
> The volcano on Montserrat erupted in 1997, killed 19 people, and made
> 2/3 of the island uninhabitable. It's still erupting, and people still
> aren't allowed back.
>
> The volcano on Martinique erupted in 1902 and buried the largest city
> on the island, St Pierre, killing about 30,000 people in a few
> minutes. You can still see ruins poking out of the rock.
Siberian Traps: 300,000 sq. miles of lava, Deccan Traps: 200,000,
Yellowstone: ?
--
Pete
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| Re: car charging, was: Adobe oddity? [message #403503 is a reply to message #403501] |
Fri, 01 January 2021 13:28 |
Dan Espen
Messages: 3867
Registered: January 2012
Karma: 0
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Senior Member |
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Peter Flass <peter_flass@yahoo.com> writes:
> Andreas Kohlbach <ank@spamfence.net> wrote:
>> On Thu, 31 Dec 2020 16:58:00 -0500, J. Clarke wrote:
>>>
>>> On Thu, 31 Dec 2020 13:04:14 -0700, Peter Flass
>>> <peter_flass@yahoo.com> wrote:
>>>
>>>> > Or five times a more reasonable estimate meaning that a 20%
>>>> > increase would cover it - which doesn't sound unreasonable even if you
>>>> > push it to 30% and have people averaging 50 miles a day.
>>>
>>> Why is it an unreasonable estimate? Usage on electric cars is
>>> different from gas cars. Instead of going to the gas station every so
>>> often, people come home and plug in. So every afternoon every car
>>> that was used for a daily commute will be plugged in and hit the grid.
>>
>> And while you're shopping, many malls provide a charging station. For
>> most people, unless they live in the Death Valley or other very remote
>> areas, driving an EV should not cause fears anymore "running out of juice".
>
> I’ve seen a few charging stations, but IME just a few in a parking lot big
> enough for hundreds of cars. It’s ALMOST like no one in government has
> thought this thru.
I'm not aware the government has anything to do with charging stations.
I thought I just read about a new station with 73 stalls, but all
I could find is this one with 56 stalls:
https://electrek.co/2020/09/15/tesla-building-new-worlds-lar gest-supercharger-station/
I've seen charging stations along the NJ Garden State Parkway. That's not the
government either.
The government provides a tax incentive:
Federal Tax Credits
The federal government provides a substantial tax credit for new battery
electric and plug-in hybrid EVs, ranging from $2,500 - $7,500, depending
on the capacity of the EV's battery.
Of course we all know the government provides incentives to the gas
industry too.
--
Dan Espen
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| Re: car charging, was: Adobe oddity? [message #403507 is a reply to message #403461] |
Fri, 01 January 2021 14:22 |
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Originally posted by: antispam
maus <maus@dmaus.org> wrote:
> On 2020-12-31, JimP <chucktheouch@gmail.com> wrote:
>> On 31 Dec 2020 18:47:15 GMT, maus <maus@dmaus.org> wrote:
>>> On 2020-12-31, JimP <chucktheouch@gmail.com> wrote:
>>>> On Wed, 30 Dec 2020 11:22:37 -0500, J. Clarke
>>>> <jclarke.873638@gmail.com> wrote:
>>> beeen made of the Polish Army having taken over a small part of
>>> Czechslovakia at the same time the germans did take over large bits.
>>
>> True, I did find an English translation of Guderian's book on the
>> Eastern Front just recently. Not so much informative, but he doesn't
>> mention several things. Like the gruppen that were not far behind the
>> lines who murdered people.
>>
>>
>
> yes. Grim stuff, the film ``Look and see'' (or similiar title) shows
> what happened in Byelorussia.
>
> A point to join the present theme to a more usefiul one, I read that the
> polish crypt guys had broken a simpler machine code before 1939, and the
> research had been smuggled to the British, which showed that breaking
> the more complex ones that the Gerrmans switched to after the outbreak
> of general war was possible.
That is rather inaccurate. Polish cryptographers broke Enigma
code in 1932. In particular reverse-engineered machine connections
and principles of operations. Some basic informations were
obtained from public data and spies (in particular a French
spy provided user manual and some info about keys (machine settings)).
However, main info came from intercepted encrypted messages.
Enigma contained 3 movable and exchangable discs each realizing
a permutation of alphabet. In later periods Germans added
more discs, at given time machine used 3 of them, but from
late 1938 they were taken from set of 5. Also around 1936
Germans repleced on non-moving disc by a new one. Polish
were able to reconstruct connections of added discs.
Another problem are keys. Discs could be put is several
positions, rotations produced 26^3 different positions.
Discs could be permuted which initially gave 3! = 6
combinations, later 5 over 3 = 60 combinations. There
was also a switchboard adding extra permutation of the
alphabet. Initially Germans limited number of switched
connections so also number of permutations, later become
more flexible. To be able to decrypt one had to reconstruct
current keys (machine settings).
Anyway, there is really no "pre war version" and "war version".
Rather, Germans regularly made changes intened to strengthen
the system. Most changes were to operationg procedures
and cumulatively made process of reconstructing keys much
harder. There were less frequent disruptive changes like
introduction of new discs. However my sources say that
after change in 1938 for the first two years of war Germans
used the same set of discs.
In summer of 1939 Polish inteligence realized that war is
inevitable and decided to share secrets of Enigma with
French and British. At the end of July 1939 Polish
gave to French and British copies of machine (one for French
and one for British). Simultanously Polish described
procedure used to reconstruct machine and key recovery
procedure. As I wrote hardware was actual for the
next two years. In August 1939 Germans again changed
operating procedures, so key recovery procedure had
to be changed (and required more work). There was
a meeting in Poland, machines and printed material was
transferred using diplomatic post (no smuggling involved).
After Poland lost in 1939 Polish cryptographers managed to
escape to France (with no notes/secret material) and
continued work there. In particular still in Poland
they modifed decription procedures to deal with
changes from August. As first thing in France they
re-did this work. After Britsh received material from
Poland they were able to decrypt Enigma. In early
period there was exchange of information (mostly
exchange of broken keys) between British and
Polish/French group (cryptographers were mainly
Polish, French provided needed support). Later British
greatly expanded their part and developed new
methods and no longer needed Polish. After 1942
Polish were no longer involved in breaking Enigma.
There is a book which describes Polish part, in particular
short but understandable explanation of procedure
used to break Enigma. As a little remark, few scraps
on info from British side that I found contain essentialy
only handwaving, but no detail. My guess is that methods
moved from smart use of weaknesses of Enigma toward
more brute-force (as changes eliminated several
weaknesses). To be more precise, machine connections
represent about 5 permutations, that is more than
400 bits of information. This was impossible to
brute-force and will be impossible to brute-force
for long time. But thanks to inital break this part
was known. Switchboard represents about 43 bits
of informations and probably would be impossible
to brute-force during WWII. But Polish cyptographers
invented tricks which effectively neutralised
switchboard, allowing finding positions (and
combination) of discs in use independent of switchboard.
So, positions of discs could be done by brute force.
Once positions of discs were known switchboard
could be broken by statistical method from 19-th
century.
Also, early Polish methods were cryptotext only.
IIUC British moved toward known-plaintext approach:
content of some messages were easily guessable
and recoverd keys could be used to decrypt other
messages.
Before WWII Polish build few machines (called "bomb")
to do brute-forcing. British build more and bigger.
Polish machines were electro-mechanical. Later
British ones are described as electronic (but details
are scarce). I found an intersting tidbit: around
1942 Americans build their electro-mechanical machines.
One technical detail I found was that they operated
at 1500 RPM. My understanding is that single rotation
goes trough 26 machine positions, so the American machine
could go trough (check) 650 position per second. That
looks like impressive speed for electro-mechanical device.
--
Waldek Hebisch
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| Re: Grid capacity was: car charging, was: Adobe oddity? [message #403508 is a reply to message #403448] |
Fri, 01 January 2021 15:44 |
Charlie Gibbs
Messages: 5313
Registered: January 2012
Karma: 0
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Senior Member |
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On 2020-12-31, Dan Espen <dan1espen@gmail.com> wrote:
> Peter Flass <peter_flass@yahoo.com> writes:
>
>> Do you remember the early days of the US space program? It seemed like
>> more boosters blew up spectacularly than actually got off the ground.
>
> I thought the Vanguard was really cool looking.
> Then it did as you mention,
> it blew up spectacularly.
Meanwhile, the Army's Juno (Jupiter-C) beat it to orbit,
despite not looking nearly as cool.
--
/~\ Charlie Gibbs | "Some of you may die,
\ / <cgibbs@kltpzyxm.invalid> | but it's a sacrifice
X I'm really at ac.dekanfrus | I'm willing to make."
/ \ if you read it the right way. | -- Lord Farquaad (Shrek)
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| Re: Grid capacity was: car charging, was: Adobe oddity? [message #403509 is a reply to message #403451] |
Fri, 01 January 2021 15:44 |
Charlie Gibbs
Messages: 5313
Registered: January 2012
Karma: 0
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Senior Member |
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On 2020-12-31, J Clarke <jclarke.873638@gmail.com> wrote:
> Best summary of thermodynamics that I ever saw: "You can't win,
> you can't break even, and you can't get out of the game".
This is also known as Ginsberg's Theorem.
Freeman's Commentary on Ginsberg's Theorem:
Every major philosophy that attempts to make life seem meaningful
is based on the negation of one part of Ginsberg's Theorem.
To wit:
1. Capitalism is based on the assumption that you can win.
2. Socialism is based on the assumption that you can break even.
3. Mysticism is based on the assumption that you can quit the game.
--
/~\ Charlie Gibbs | "Some of you may die,
\ / <cgibbs@kltpzyxm.invalid> | but it's a sacrifice
X I'm really at ac.dekanfrus | I'm willing to make."
/ \ if you read it the right way. | -- Lord Farquaad (Shrek)
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| Re: thar she blows, car charging, was: Adobe oddity? [message #403510 is a reply to message #403502] |
Fri, 01 January 2021 16:17 |
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Originally posted by: JimP
On Fri, 1 Jan 2021 11:12:11 -0700, Peter Flass <peter_flass@yahoo.com>
wrote:
> John Levine <johnl@taugh.com> wrote:
>> In article <12msuftaq2qr6vkas5q9hqmve2ql04gnu0@4ax.com>,
>> J. Clarke <jclarke.873638@gmail.com> wrote:
>>>> Interestingly, apparently some volcanos at the east end of the Caribbean
>>>> (Leewards?) are starting to cook. Geologists say theres no connection
>>>> between them, and no,significance to the fact that several are becoming
>>>> active at once... Also Hekla is still a potential problem.
>>>
>>> And history has not experienced a _big_ eruption yet.
>>
>> Depends what you mean by big.
>>
>> The volcano on Montserrat erupted in 1997, killed 19 people, and made
>> 2/3 of the island uninhabitable. It's still erupting, and people still
>> aren't allowed back.
>>
>> The volcano on Martinique erupted in 1902 and buried the largest city
>> on the island, St Pierre, killing about 30,000 people in a few
>> minutes. You can still see ruins poking out of the rock.
>
> Siberian Traps: 300,000 sq. miles of lava, Deccan Traps: 200,000,
> Yellowstone: ?
The Yellowstone park is inside the cauldera. And the hot spot moves.
There is a huge, I forget how many cubic miles, lake of lava beneath
that park.
--
Jim
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| Re: Grid capacity was: car charging, was: Adobe oddity? [message #403513 is a reply to message #403451] |
Fri, 01 January 2021 16:44 |
Ahem A Rivet's Shot
Messages: 4843
Registered: January 2012
Karma: 0
|
Senior Member |
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On Thu, 31 Dec 2020 16:50:47 -0500
J. Clarke <jclarke.873638@gmail.com> wrote:
> Best summary of thermodynamics that I ever saw: "You can't win, you
> can't break even, and you can't get out of the game".
The laws can be rendered thus:
You can't win you can only break even
You can only break even at absolute zero
You can't get to absolute zero
--
Steve O'Hara-Smith | Directable Mirror Arrays
C:\>WIN | A better way to focus the sun
The computer obeys and wins. | licences available see
You lose and Bill collects. | http://www.sohara.org/
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| Re: car charging, was: Adobe oddity? [message #403514 is a reply to message #403501] |
Fri, 01 January 2021 17:37 |
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Originally posted by: J. Clarke
On Fri, 1 Jan 2021 11:12:11 -0700, Peter Flass <peter_flass@yahoo.com>
wrote:
> Andreas Kohlbach <ank@spamfence.net> wrote:
>> On Thu, 31 Dec 2020 16:58:00 -0500, J. Clarke wrote:
>>>
>>> On Thu, 31 Dec 2020 13:04:14 -0700, Peter Flass
>>> <peter_flass@yahoo.com> wrote:
>>>
>>>> > Or five times a more reasonable estimate meaning that a 20%
>>>> > increase would cover it - which doesn't sound unreasonable even if you
>>>> > push it to 30% and have people averaging 50 miles a day.
>>>
>>> Why is it an unreasonable estimate? Usage on electric cars is
>>> different from gas cars. Instead of going to the gas station every so
>>> often, people come home and plug in. So every afternoon every car
>>> that was used for a daily commute will be plugged in and hit the grid.
>>
>> And while you're shopping, many malls provide a charging station. For
>> most people, unless they live in the Death Valley or other very remote
>> areas, driving an EV should not cause fears anymore "running out of juice".
>
> I’ve seen a few charging stations, but IME just a few in a parking lot big
> enough for hundreds of cars. It’s ALMOST like no one in government has
> thought this thru.
And people who have chargers at home tend not to use pay chargers
unless they're on a trip or otherwise find themselves in urgent need
of a charge.
It's not a matter of "fears", it's a matter of "it costs me pennies to
charge at home or dollars to charge at a kiosk".
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| Re: thar she blows, car charging, was: Adobe oddity? [message #403521 is a reply to message #403510] |
Fri, 01 January 2021 21:46 |
Dan Espen
Messages: 3867
Registered: January 2012
Karma: 0
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Senior Member |
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JimP <chucktheouch@gmail.com> writes:
> On Fri, 1 Jan 2021 11:12:11 -0700, Peter Flass <peter_flass@yahoo.com>
> wrote:
>> John Levine <johnl@taugh.com> wrote:
>>> In article <12msuftaq2qr6vkas5q9hqmve2ql04gnu0@4ax.com>,
>>> J. Clarke <jclarke.873638@gmail.com> wrote:
>>>> > Interestingly, apparently some volcanos at the east end of the Caribbean
>>>> > (Leewards?) are starting to cook. Geologists say there’s no connection
>>>> > between them, and no,significance to the fact that several are becoming
>>>> > active at once... Also Hekla is still a potential problem.
>>>>
>>>> And history has not experienced a _big_ eruption yet.
>>>
>>> Depends what you mean by big.
>>>
>>> The volcano on Montserrat erupted in 1997, killed 19 people, and made
>>> 2/3 of the island uninhabitable. It's still erupting, and people still
>>> aren't allowed back.
>>>
>>> The volcano on Martinique erupted in 1902 and buried the largest city
>>> on the island, St Pierre, killing about 30,000 people in a few
>>> minutes. You can still see ruins poking out of the rock.
>>
>> Siberian Traps: 300,000 sq. miles of lava, Deccan Traps: 200,000,
>> Yellowstone: ?
>
> The Yellowstone park is inside the cauldera. And the hot spot moves.
> There is a huge, I forget how many cubic miles, lake of lava beneath
> that park.
The caldera is 34x45 miles.
The chamber is 50x12 miles the volume is 960 cubic miles.
The chamber mostly empty right now.
The last eruption ejected 240 cubic miles of rock.
(All from Wikipedia.)
Wikipedia also assures us that we have nothing to fear.
I feel a certain comfort that I'll know how to recognize
a surprise eruption. As I said before deafening noise then
I won't be able to hear anything. Aha, Yellowstone went,
put the ladder up, get the shovels ready.
--
Dan Espen
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| Re: car charging, was: Adobe oddity? [message #403525 is a reply to message #403524] |
Fri, 01 January 2021 23:29 |
Dan Espen
Messages: 3867
Registered: January 2012
Karma: 0
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Senior Member |
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danny burstein <dannyb@panix.com> writes:
> In <rsolh1$5df$1@dont-email.me> Dan Espen <dan1espen@gmail.com> writes:
>
>> danny burstein <dannyb@panix.com> writes:
>>> A hefty number of the charging stations are courtesy of
>>> the (so-called) Dieselgate settlement with VW.
>>>
>>> for example:
>>>
>>> https://listen.sdpb.org/post/volkswagen-scandal-brings-elect ric-car-charging-stations-sd
>
>> "Hefty" number in South Dakota?
>
>> Really?
>
> It's national. That just happened to be a SD news clip.
>
> There's a parking lot near me that has a dozen electical
> charging stations courtesy of this.
>
> http://www.dburstein.com/images/ev.png
>
> - from another thread elsewhere:
>
> "Electrify America" is the company that VW was forced to create
> as part of the two billion dollar settlement for faking their
> diesel emissions output.
Okay I read about VW going into the charging station business.
I didn't see any references to the reason why, but it makes
sense that they should somehow pay for cheating.
Are they forbidden from making a profit? Nope, below.
I didn't read that any hefty numbers were involved.
I see, 500 locations, 2200 units.
Tesla has a pretty big network, 2000 stations,
20,000 superchargers worldwide. 1000 stations in North America.
It doesn't look like this charity from VW:
Why is electrify America so expensive?
That's the “what.” The “why” is that Charge America is in the business
of selling electricity to cars. Tesla says Superchargers, like repairs,
are not a profit center. Also Tesla owners for the first 5+ years
subsidized building the Supercharger network through the cost of their
cars.
--
Dan Espen
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| Re: car charging, was: Adobe oddity? [message #403529 is a reply to message #403507] |
Sat, 02 January 2021 06:26 |
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Originally posted by: maus
On 2021-01-01, antispam@math.uni.wroc.pl <antispam@math.uni.wroc.pl> wrote:
> maus <maus@dmaus.org> wrote:
>> On 2020-12-31, JimP <chucktheouch@gmail.com> wrote:
>>> On 31 Dec 2020 18:47:15 GMT, maus <maus@dmaus.org> wrote:
>>>> On 2020-12-31, JimP <chucktheouch@gmail.com> wrote:
>>>> > On Wed, 30 Dec 2020 11:22:37 -0500, J. Clarke
>>>> ><jclarke.873638@gmail.com> wrote:
>>>> beeen made of the Polish Army having taken over a small part of
>>>> Czechslovakia at the same time the germans did take over large bits.
>>>
>>> True, I did find an English translation of Guderian's book on the
>>> Eastern Front just recently. Not so much informative, but he doesn't
> content of some messages were easily guessable
> and recoverd keys could be used to decrypt other
> messages.
>
> Before WWII Polish build few machines (called "bomb")
> to do brute-forcing. British build more and bigger.
> Polish machines were electro-mechanical. Later
> British ones are described as electronic (but details
> are scarce). I found an intersting tidbit: around
> 1942 Americans build their electro-mechanical machines.
> One technical detail I found was that they operated
> at 1500 RPM. My understanding is that single rotation
> goes trough 26 machine positions, so the American machine
> could go trough (check) 650 position per second. That
> looks like impressive speed for electro-mechanical device.
>
>
We are in general agreement, I think, that it took several countries to
decypher the variety of machines that the Germns were so confident of
being secure.
I have heard that why the weakness of the Enigmas was hiddent for so
many years was that a company in Switzerland made and sold Enigmas
after the war, and supplied those things to various governments,
including the Irish, which used them.
There is the story that the british destroyed their bombes at wars end.
Why?.. destroying them meant that the Briotish never caught up with the
Americans in developing Computers.
(I am also aware that many of those who worked at Enigma decryption went
on to work at general development. )
At the present time I would think that there is no reason to bother much
with encryptation, as the various government can read such messages
easily
--
greymausg@mail.com
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| Re: car charging, was: Adobe oddity? [message #403531 is a reply to message #403503] |
Sat, 02 January 2021 08:02 |
Peter Flass
Messages: 8375
Registered: December 2011
Karma: 0
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Senior Member |
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Dan Espen <dan1espen@gmail.com> wrote:
> Peter Flass <peter_flass@yahoo.com> writes:
>
>> Andreas Kohlbach <ank@spamfence.net> wrote:
>>> On Thu, 31 Dec 2020 16:58:00 -0500, J. Clarke wrote:
>>>>
>>>> On Thu, 31 Dec 2020 13:04:14 -0700, Peter Flass
>>>> <peter_flass@yahoo.com> wrote:
>>>>
>>>> >> Or five times a more reasonable estimate meaning that a 20%
>>>> >> increase would cover it - which doesn't sound unreasonable even if you
>>>> >> push it to 30% and have people averaging 50 miles a day.
>>>>
>>>> Why is it an unreasonable estimate? Usage on electric cars is
>>>> different from gas cars. Instead of going to the gas station every so
>>>> often, people come home and plug in. So every afternoon every car
>>>> that was used for a daily commute will be plugged in and hit the grid.
>>>
>>> And while you're shopping, many malls provide a charging station. For
>>> most people, unless they live in the Death Valley or other very remote
>>> areas, driving an EV should not cause fears anymore "running out of juice".
>>
>> I’ve seen a few charging stations, but IME just a few in a parking lot big
>> enough for hundreds of cars. It’s ALMOST like no one in government has
>> thought this thru.
>
> I'm not aware the government has anything to do with charging stations.
> I thought I just read about a new station with 73 stalls, but all
> I could find is this one with 56 stalls:
>
> https://electrek.co/2020/09/15/tesla-building-new-worlds-lar gest-supercharger-station/
>
> I've seen charging stations along the NJ Garden State Parkway. That's not the
> government either.
>
> The government provides a tax incentive:
>
> Federal Tax Credits
>
> The federal government provides a substantial tax credit for new battery
> electric and plug-in hybrid EVs, ranging from $2,500 - $7,500, depending
> on the capacity of the EV's battery.
>
> Of course we all know the government provides incentives to the gas
> industry too.
>
>
Government’s part should be to develop a plan that takes into account all
aspects of a conversion to mostly EVs. Maybe I’m just not up on the
literature, but someone should figure out how many charging stations are
needed, where they’re needed, and how they are going to be powered, and how
they’re hoing to be indtalled and paid for.
Before EVs can be widely used in a particular area there have to be enough
stations. They also have to be accessible from the interstates. I have
driven cross-country several times, and some parts are pretty sparsely
inhabited. In a day’s drive I’d have to be able to recharge at least once
en route. This assumes the motel has a charger available per room for an
overnight charge. I’m not going to take a long trip unless I know charging
is as quick and convenient as getting gas.
I also keep bringing up,the problem of condo/apartment dwellers. I don’t
have a garage, and where I am there is no on-street parking or meters. I
don’t work, so, I can’t recharge there. Installing chargers at every
parking place would be fantastically expensive for any expected return.
When I shop, assuming there was an available charger, I’m not usually in
the store long enough.
--
Pete
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| Re: car charging, was: Adobe oddity? [message #403534 is a reply to message #403531] |
Sat, 02 January 2021 08:50 |
Dan Espen
Messages: 3867
Registered: January 2012
Karma: 0
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Senior Member |
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Peter Flass <peter_flass@yahoo.com> writes:
> Dan Espen <dan1espen@gmail.com> wrote:
>> Peter Flass <peter_flass@yahoo.com> writes:
>>
>>> Andreas Kohlbach <ank@spamfence.net> wrote:
>>>> On Thu, 31 Dec 2020 16:58:00 -0500, J. Clarke wrote:
>>>> >
>>>> > On Thu, 31 Dec 2020 13:04:14 -0700, Peter Flass
>>>> > <peter_flass@yahoo.com> wrote:
>>>> >
>>>> >>> Or five times a more reasonable estimate meaning that a 20%
>>>> >>> increase would cover it - which doesn't sound unreasonable even if you
>>>> >>> push it to 30% and have people averaging 50 miles a day.
>>>> >
>>>> > Why is it an unreasonable estimate? Usage on electric cars is
>>>> > different from gas cars. Instead of going to the gas station every so
>>>> > often, people come home and plug in. So every afternoon every car
>>>> > that was used for a daily commute will be plugged in and hit the grid.
>>>>
>>>> And while you're shopping, many malls provide a charging station. For
>>>> most people, unless they live in the Death Valley or other very remote
>>>> areas, driving an EV should not cause fears anymore "running out of juice".
>>>
>>> I’ve seen a few charging stations, but IME just a few in a parking lot big
>>> enough for hundreds of cars. It’s ALMOST like no one in government has
>>> thought this thru.
>>
>> I'm not aware the government has anything to do with charging stations.
>> I thought I just read about a new station with 73 stalls, but all
>> I could find is this one with 56 stalls:
>>
>> https://electrek.co/2020/09/15/tesla-building-new-worlds-lar gest-supercharger-station/
>>
>> I've seen charging stations along the NJ Garden State Parkway. That's not the
>> government either.
>>
>> The government provides a tax incentive:
>>
>> Federal Tax Credits
>>
>> The federal government provides a substantial tax credit for new battery
>> electric and plug-in hybrid EVs, ranging from $2,500 - $7,500, depending
>> on the capacity of the EV's battery.
>>
>> Of course we all know the government provides incentives to the gas
>> industry too.
>
> Government’s part should be to develop a plan that takes into account all
> aspects of a conversion to mostly EVs. Maybe I’m just not up on the
> literature, but someone should figure out how many charging stations are
> needed, where they’re needed, and how they are going to be powered, and how
> they’re hoing to be indtalled and paid for.
Not sure I agree.
> Before EVs can be widely used in a particular area there have to be enough
> stations. They also have to be accessible from the interstates. I have
> driven cross-country several times, and some parts are pretty sparsely
> inhabited. In a day’s drive I’d have to be able to recharge at least once
> en route. This assumes the motel has a charger available per room for an
> overnight charge. I’m not going to take a long trip unless I know charging
> is as quick and convenient as getting gas.
>
> I also keep bringing up,the problem of condo/apartment dwellers. I don’t
> have a garage, and where I am there is no on-street parking or meters. I
> don’t work, so, I can’t recharge there. Installing chargers at every
> parking place would be fantastically expensive for any expected return.
> When I shop, assuming there was an available charger, I’m not usually in
> the store long enough.
Sounds like you want to have the government plan things instead of
what we are doing now, letting the free market do the planning.
Tesla knew it had to have a certain number of chargers around in order
to sell cars. If they want to sell more cars, they need more chargers.
For apartment dwellers, the self driving vehicle may come into play.
You get out of the car and it goes and finds it's charger.
For apartment dwellers, the self driving vehicle may come into play.
You get out of the car and it goes and finds it's charger.
I've read about people taking cross country trips in their Teslas.
It sounds like it's quite easy. The car tells you how much charge you
have and where you should go next for your charge. Except for the
longer stay at the charging point, it sounds even easier than it is
for a gas vehicle. It's certainly easier if you are heading to
a hotel/motel for the night. Instead of having to go to a gas station
then the motel, it directs you to a motel with a charging station.
One stop instead of 2.
I still don't accept that having lots of street chargers is
fantastically expensive. This will be done over a long period of time.
California's plan sets 2035 as the goal year. When I hear plans like
this I know some people see doom. I figure if there are problems,
the plan changes. Just a question of outlook I suppose.
--
Dan Espen
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| Re: car charging, was: Adobe oddity? [message #403535 is a reply to message #403531] |
Sat, 02 January 2021 09:06 |
Ahem A Rivet's Shot
Messages: 4843
Registered: January 2012
Karma: 0
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Senior Member |
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On Sat, 2 Jan 2021 06:02:37 -0700
Peter Flass <peter_flass@yahoo.com> wrote:
> Government’s part should be to develop a plan that takes into account all
> aspects of a conversion to mostly EVs. Maybe I’m just not up on the
Perhaps, but this is likely to be a lengthy process and technology
is not going to stand still in the meantime.
> literature, but someone should figure out how many charging stations are
> needed, where they’re needed, and how they are going to be powered, and
> how they’re hoing to be indtalled and paid for.
I think it more prudent to take an approach that takes into account
the limited availability of EVs and the rate of uptake (which will no
doubt be an accelerating one) and tries to stay just a little ahead of the
curve with infrastructure support so as not to be caught flat footed if
someone develops something unexpected (think CFL rollout punctuated by LEDs
suddenly getting good).
--
Steve O'Hara-Smith | Directable Mirror Arrays
C:\>WIN | A better way to focus the sun
The computer obeys and wins. | licences available see
You lose and Bill collects. | http://www.sohara.org/
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| Re: Grid capacity was: car charging, was: Adobe oddity? [message #403536 is a reply to message #403407] |
Sat, 02 January 2021 10:17 |
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Originally posted by: Bud Spencer
On Wed, 30 Dec 2020, J. Clarke wrote:
> That is what Tesla was pushing. If you mean some scheme other than
> Tesla's what do you have in mind, specifically?
No. Energy transfer was what Tesla was talking about. Energy that can be
converted to electricity. Different things.
> Of course there is "energy transfer". You think that generators
> create energy from nothing? You might want to take a thermodynamics
> course.
Wind, water current etc are not _energy_ ... Generators are creating
_electricity_ ... and nothing can be created out of nothing ...
If wind, water current etc was indeed "energy", then you would not need
strator and rotor in your generator now, wouldn't you?
Rotating turbines are not generating anything, right?
--
B̵̶̷̢⃨̺̠̐͆̀̈́̾̽U̸̶̷⃨̝͍͓̔́̔̈́̈́͋D⃨ ̸̶̷̫̟̔̀̀̔͛͛
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