| Re: After the storm, hopefully [message #419367 is a reply to message #419366] |
Fri, 24 February 2023 05:52   |
Harry Vaderchi
Messages: 719
Registered: July 2012
Karma: 0
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On 24 Feb 2023 10:40:07 GMT
maus <maus@mail.com> wrote:
> On 2023-02-24, Ahem A Rivet's Shot <steveo@eircom.net> wrote:
>> On 24 Feb 2023 08:13:41 GMT
>> maus <maus@mail.com> wrote:
>>
>>> On 2023-02-23, Ahem A Rivet's Shot <steveo@eircom.net> wrote:
>>>> On Thu, 23 Feb 2023 07:45:52 -0700
>>>> Peter Flass <peter_flass@yahoo.com> wrote:
>>>>
>> cars this year - they seem to be exploring the load/range trade off.
>>
>> Long range is definitely where IC vehicles win, but unless you need
>> it the EV wins in every other respect apart from price!
>>
>
> I see the post office, which here is turning into a 4day service, has
> changed its vehicles. A big thing in the whole problem is tax. I think
> that if EV gets popular, the plugs will have to be different than
> ordinary household plugs to allow electricy to be taxed for vehicles
> like petrol and deisel presently is. Otherwise that tax will have to be
> raised elsewhere.
>
Tax Guinness! Ah, that's already been thought of.
> Yes, I agree, there are problems to be overcome under both systems (EV
> or direct fuel), but saying `It will be all right on the night' will not
> solve it.
>
>
> --
> greymausg@mail.com
> where is our money gone, Dude?
>
--
Bah, and indeed Humbug.
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| Re: After the storm, hopefully [message #419368 is a reply to message #419363] |
Fri, 24 February 2023 06:27 |
Ahem A Rivet's Shot
Messages: 4843
Registered: January 2012
Karma: 0
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On Fri, 24 Feb 2023 10:02:08 +0000
Vir Campestris <vir.campestris@invalid.invalid> wrote:
> If you have a system that will store electricity at grid scales we're
> all ears. The world really will beat a path to your door.
I don't, but:
There are several companies supplying lithium batteries at grid
scale for short term storage (and companies making a fortune filling them
with cheap electricity and selling it later at peak prices). While Tesla
got a lot of media coverage putting the first one in nobody bothered to
notice when they became a commodity item used by grid planners.
There are at least two companies supplying flow batteries at grid
scale, one supplying a vanadium based battery with 25 year electrodes the
other a ferric chloride based battery whose electrodes apparently do not
degrade. As far as I can tell they're both shipping batteries as fast as
they can build them (of course both have patents on their stable
electrodes). Both ship 'small' systems as a bunch of 40' containers and
talk in terms of gigawatt hours per acre for large installations.
There are a bunch of startups (it looks a bit like 1978 in the
micro business) going for the domestic scale flow battery market. I'll be
keeping a very close eye on these.
The current flow batteries will do the job if we build enough of
them (100K million litre tanks and a *lot* of electrodes to power the
world for a week or so) and there's plenty of raw materials for the
electrolytes (especially the ferric chloride one).
Something better would be nice, but good enough is available today
commercially. Building enough to ditch fossil fuels will take time and
money but it is technically possible and appears to be financially feasible
too judging by the way the battery makers are selling all they can make.
--
Steve O'Hara-Smith
Odds and Ends at http://www.sohara.org/
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| Re: After the storm, hopefully [message #419369 is a reply to message #419360] |
Fri, 24 February 2023 07:59 |
Peter Flass
Messages: 8375
Registered: December 2011
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Ahem A Rivet's Shot <steveo@eircom.net> wrote:
> On Thu, 23 Feb 2023 23:44:11 GMT
> Charlie Gibbs <cgibbs@kltpzyxm.invalid> wrote:
>
>> On 2023-02-23, Ahem A Rivet's Shot <steveo@eircom.net> wrote:
>>
>>> On Thu, 23 Feb 2023 07:45:52 -0700
>>> Peter Flass <peter_flass@yahoo.com> wrote:
>>>
>>>> Also did about 700 miles per day with one or two of those quick stops
>>>
>>> I can't think of anything that would persuade me to drive 700
>>> miles in a day.
>>
>> Been there, done that. It's doable, but tiring - especially solo.
>> Best done when you're in your 20s.
>>
>> Last summer we drove from Vancouver, B.C. to Moab, Utah,
>> a distance of about 1200 miles. We did it in two days,
>
> If I have to go that kind of distance I'll fly or if it's across
> mainland Europe I might take a train. Driving it would not enter
> consideration.
>
It’f fun to drive, and you get to see a lot more of the country than you do
from a plane.
--
Pete
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| Re: After the storm, hopefully [message #419370 is a reply to message #419365] |
Fri, 24 February 2023 07:59 |
Peter Flass
Messages: 8375
Registered: December 2011
Karma: 0
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Ahem A Rivet's Shot <steveo@eircom.net> wrote:
> On 24 Feb 2023 08:13:41 GMT
> maus <maus@mail.com> wrote:
>
>> On 2023-02-23, Ahem A Rivet's Shot <steveo@eircom.net> wrote:
>>> On Thu, 23 Feb 2023 07:45:52 -0700
>>> Peter Flass <peter_flass@yahoo.com> wrote:
>>>
>>>> Also did about 700 miles per day with one or two of those quick stops
>>>
>>> I can't think of anything that would persuade me to drive 700
>>> miles in a day.
>>>
>>
>>
>> Asides from anything else, In Ireland, you would be getting very wet.
>
> Nah, a trip from here up the west coast to Donegal or so then
> across to Belfast, down to Dublin and on to Wexford, across the bottom to
> Cork and back up to Kerry (taking in Dingle of course) would be way more
> than 700 miles.
>
> Doing it in a day would be positively heroic.
I’m trying to picture the roads there, and I doubt you have too many
superhighways (maybe “motorways” there?) If so, I agree with you. If you
can clock 75-80 mph regularly, it’s only a bother. Then , on back roads,
700 miles is often 800 or 900, with lots of traffic lights ( and flocks of
sheep?)
>
>> Consider deliveries, and the return journies
>
> I see all the van makers have electric versions with ranges in the
> 3-400km region - they have smaller batteries than some of the mid-range
> cars this year - they seem to be exploring the load/range trade off.
>
> Long range is definitely where IC vehicles win, but unless you need
> it the EV wins in every other respect apart from price!
>
--
Pete
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| Re: After the storm, hopefully [message #419371 is a reply to message #419364] |
Fri, 24 February 2023 08:57 |
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Originally posted by: Johnny Billquist
On 2023-02-24 11:12, Vir Campestris wrote:
> On 23/02/2023 15:51, Scott Lurndal wrote:
>> Vir Campestris <vir.campestris@invalid.invalid> writes:
>>> On 23/02/2023 11:05, maus wrote:
>>>> On 2023-02-23, Vir Campestris<vir.campestris@invalid.invalid> wrote:
>>>> >>
>>>> > OK, so it's not 45 minutes, it's only 25 minutes.
>>>> >
>>>> It will be shorter in future, actually, when you think of plugging it
>>>> in, it is already recharged :):}
>>>
>>> The smallest Tesla battery is 50kWh.
>>>
>>> Assume I want a 1-minute recharge and that will require 50*60 = 3000kW.
>>>
>>> Equivalent to a thousand electric fires.
>>>
>>> What kind of plug will I need for that?
>>
>> https://electrek.co/2021/11/01/tesla-launches-new-home-charg er-that-works-j1772-all-electric-cars/
>>
> Try again.
>
> https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/SAE_J1772
>
> says "can deliver up to 19.2 kW"
>
> Not 3000kW.
>
> It also says there's an add on that takes it up to 350kW. A long way
> from a 1 minute charge, even if the batteries could take it.
>
> This implies we will need a lot more charging stations on big service
> areas compared to the number of fuel pumps - you don't just need enough
> so the queue doesn't get long, which is where we are on pumps, you need
> enough so there's almost never a queue.
>
> A guaranteed 25 minute charge on a long trip would be OK, time for a
> bite to eat. Not great, but OK.
>
> A 25 minute charge time with a queue of three before you get to the
> charge station would not be acceptable.
While I agree with that last bit, as far as I can tell, it sounds like
we might get something like 200 miles, or 300 km on one charge. Maybe a
bit less on that 25 minute charge.
One break to get a bite to eat is fine. Having to do one every 300
kilometers is not fine. I won't be grabbing a serious bite to eat every
2-3 hours.
Johnny
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| Re: After the storm, hopefully [message #419372 is a reply to message #419370] |
Fri, 24 February 2023 09:11 |
Ahem A Rivet's Shot
Messages: 4843
Registered: January 2012
Karma: 0
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Senior Member |
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On Fri, 24 Feb 2023 05:59:09 -0700
Peter Flass <peter_flass@yahoo.com> wrote:
> Ahem A Rivet's Shot <steveo@eircom.net> wrote:
>> On 24 Feb 2023 08:13:41 GMT
>> maus <maus@mail.com> wrote:
>>
>>> Asides from anything else, In Ireland, you would be getting very wet.
>>
>> Nah, a trip from here up the west coast to Donegal or so then
>> across to Belfast, down to Dublin and on to Wexford, across the bottom
>> to Cork and back up to Kerry (taking in Dingle of course) would be way
>> more than 700 miles.
>>
>> Doing it in a day would be positively heroic.
>
> I’m trying to picture the roads there, and I doubt you have too many
> superhighways (maybe “motorways” there?)
No, on that run there's some between Limerick and Donegal, Belfast
to Dublin and Dublin to Cork (and that's most of the network) but most of it
will be on single carriageway roads and some of it will be on windy bog
roads.
> If so, I agree with you. If you can clock 75-80 mph regularly, it’s
> only a bother.
Not a hope - 75-80 kph would be pushing your luck on the good bits
with short stretches of 120kph on the (few) motorways.
--
Steve O'Hara-Smith
Odds and Ends at http://www.sohara.org/
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| Re: After the storm, hopefully [message #419373 is a reply to message #419367] |
Fri, 24 February 2023 10:30 |
GreyMaus[1]
Messages: 1140
Registered: February 2013
Karma: 0
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On 2023-02-24, Kerr-Mudd, John <admin@127.0.0.1> wrote:
> On 24 Feb 2023 10:40:07 GMT
> maus <maus@mail.com> wrote:
>
>> On 2023-02-24, Ahem A Rivet's Shot <steveo@eircom.net> wrote:
>>> On 24 Feb 2023 08:13:41 GMT
>>> maus <maus@mail.com> wrote:
>>>
>>>> On 2023-02-23, Ahem A Rivet's Shot <steveo@eircom.net> wrote:
>>>> > On Thu, 23 Feb 2023 07:45:52 -0700
>>>> > Peter Flass <peter_flass@yahoo.com> wrote:
>>>> >
>>> cars this year - they seem to be exploring the load/range trade off.
>>>
>>> Long range is definitely where IC vehicles win, but unless you need
>>> it the EV wins in every other respect apart from price!
>>>
>>
>> I see the post office, which here is turning into a 4day service, has
>> changed its vehicles. A big thing in the whole problem is tax. I think
>> that if EV gets popular, the plugs will have to be different than
>> ordinary household plugs to allow electricy to be taxed for vehicles
>> like petrol and deisel presently is. Otherwise that tax will have to be
>> raised elsewhere.
>>
>
> Tax Guinness! Ah, that's already been thought of.
unlike electricity, tou can always make your own.
>
>> Yes, I agree, there are problems to be overcome under both systems (EV
>> or direct fuel), but saying `It will be all right on the night' will not
>> solve it.
>>
>>
>> --
>> greymausg@mail.com
>> where is our money gone, Dude?
>>
>
>
--
greymausg@mail.com
where is our money gone, Dude?
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| Re: After the storm, hopefully [message #419374 is a reply to message #419363] |
Fri, 24 February 2023 10:34 |
scott
Messages: 4237
Registered: February 2012
Karma: 0
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Senior Member |
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Vir Campestris <vir.campestris@invalid.invalid> writes:
> On 23/02/2023 15:41, Scott Lurndal wrote:
>> Are you sure about that? Can you point to some published work
>> on this? Airbus is spending large amounts of money researching
>> hydrogen as a replacement for JET-A. Storage capability is
>> correlated with the size of the H2 molecule, not to mention
>> where do you_get_ the hydrogen (solar electrolosis requires a whole
>> shitload of solar panels to replace any substantial fraction of
>> fossil fuels - and why not juststore and use the electricity directly then?)
>
> <snip>
>
> "why not juststore and use the electricity directly then?"
>
> The main current "green" power systems are solar (doesn't work at night)
> wind (only works when it's windy, and sometimes there are windless
> patches hundreds of miles across) and hydro (we've used all the good
> sites already). None of these will provide the power we want at the
> times we want it.
>
> If you have a system that will store electricity at grid scales we're
> all ears. The world really will beat a path to your door.
Do a google search on utility-scale storage. There are several systems
currently in operation, and a bunch more in various phases of investigation
from battery systems (li-ion and various flow batteries) to molten salt
systems and of course the standby pumped storage). There is plenty of
room for innovation in this segment.
>
> Storing hydrogen is one of the possible methods, but as we've discussed
> it has all sorts of problems.
You don't necessarily have to store it as molecular hydrogen.
https://www.iea.org/reports/grid-scale-storage
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| Re: After the storm, hopefully [message #419375 is a reply to message #419369] |
Fri, 24 February 2023 10:38 |
GreyMaus[1]
Messages: 1140
Registered: February 2013
Karma: 0
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Senior Member |
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On 2023-02-24, Peter Flass <peter_flass@yahoo.com> wrote:
> Ahem A Rivet's Shot <steveo@eircom.net> wrote:
>> On Thu, 23 Feb 2023 23:44:11 GMT
>> Charlie Gibbs <cgibbs@kltpzyxm.invalid> wrote:
>>
>>> On 2023-02-23, Ahem A Rivet's Shot <steveo@eircom.net> wrote:
>>>
>>>> On Thu, 23 Feb 2023 07:45:52 -0700
>>>> Peter Flass <peter_flass@yahoo.com> wrote:
>>>>
>>>> > Also did about 700 miles per day with one or two of those quick stops
>>>>
>>>> I can't think of anything that would persuade me to drive 700
>>>> miles in a day.
>>>
>>> Been there, done that. It's doable, but tiring - especially solo.
>>> Best done when you're in your 20s.
>>>
>>> Last summer we drove from Vancouver, B.C. to Moab, Utah,
>>> a distance of about 1200 miles. We did it in two days,
>>
>> If I have to go that kind of distance I'll fly or if it's across
>> mainland Europe I might take a train. Driving it would not enter
>> consideration.
>>
>
> It’f fun to drive, and you get to see a lot more of the country than you do
> from a plane.
>
It is in Ireland, with a beautiful view every mile, but in the US its a
matter of seen one cactus or field of corn, you have seen them all.
Memories come back. I walked a lot of them roads, moving animals, yonks
ago. That time you took every job offered. That gateway, overcome by ivy
that had collapsed the gateposts. I knew that, it lead to a wooded drive
up to the great house, where peasants were not really allowed. Who know
now the stories. Off topic.
--
greymausg@mail.com
where is our money gone, Dude?
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| Re: After the storm, hopefully [message #419376 is a reply to message #419370] |
Fri, 24 February 2023 10:40 |
GreyMaus[1]
Messages: 1140
Registered: February 2013
Karma: 0
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Senior Member |
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On 2023-02-24, Peter Flass <peter_flass@yahoo.com> wrote:
> Ahem A Rivet's Shot <steveo@eircom.net> wrote:
>> On 24 Feb 2023 08:13:41 GMT
>> maus <maus@mail.com> wrote:
>>
>>> On 2023-02-23, Ahem A Rivet's Shot <steveo@eircom.net> wrote:
>>>> On Thu, 23 Feb 2023 07:45:52 -0700
>>>> Peter Flass <peter_flass@yahoo.com> wrote:
>>>>
>>>> > Also did about 700 miles per day with one or two of those quick stops
>>>>
>>>> I can't think of anything that would persuade me to drive 700
>>>> miles in a day.
>>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> Asides from anything else, In Ireland, you would be getting very wet.
>>
>> Nah, a trip from here up the west coast to Donegal or so then
>> across to Belfast, down to Dublin and on to Wexford, across the bottom to
>> Cork and back up to Kerry (taking in Dingle of course) would be way more
>> than 700 miles.
>>
>> Doing it in a day would be positively heroic.
>
> I’m trying to picture the roads there, and I doubt you have too many
> superhighways (maybe “motorways” there?) If so, I agree with you. If you
> can clock 75-80 mph regularly, it’s only a bother. Then , on back roads,
> 700 miles is often 800 or 900, with lots of traffic lights ( and flocks of
> sheep?)
>>
>>> Consider deliveries, and the return journies
>>
>> I see all the van makers have electric versions with ranges in the
>> 3-400km region - they have smaller batteries than some of the mid-range
>> cars this year - they seem to be exploring the load/range trade off.
>>
>> Long range is definitely where IC vehicles win, but unless you need
>> it the EV wins in every other respect apart from price!
>>
>
>
>
--
greymausg@mail.com
where is our money gone, Dude?
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| Re: After the storm, hopefully [message #419377 is a reply to message #419372] |
Fri, 24 February 2023 10:45 |
GreyMaus[1]
Messages: 1140
Registered: February 2013
Karma: 0
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Senior Member |
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On 2023-02-24, Ahem A Rivet's Shot <steveo@eircom.net> wrote:
> On Fri, 24 Feb 2023 05:59:09 -0700
> Peter Flass <peter_flass@yahoo.com> wrote:
>
>> Ahem A Rivet's Shot <steveo@eircom.net> wrote:
>>> On 24 Feb 2023 08:13:41 GMT
>>> maus <maus@mail.com> wrote:
>>>
>>>> Asides from anything else, In Ireland, you would be getting very wet.
>>>
>>> Nah, a trip from here up the west coast to Donegal or so then
>>> across to Belfast, down to Dublin and on to Wexford, across the bottom
>>> to Cork and back up to Kerry (taking in Dingle of course) would be way
>>> more than 700 miles.
>>>
>>> Doing it in a day would be positively heroic.
>>
>> I’m trying to picture the roads there, and I doubt you have too many
>> superhighways (maybe “motorways” there?)
>
> No, on that run there's some between Limerick and Donegal, Belfast
> to Dublin and Dublin to Cork (and that's most of the network) but most of it
> will be on single carriageway roads and some of it will be on windy bog
> roads.
>
>> If so, I agree with you. If you can clock 75-80 mph regularly, it’s
>> only a bother.
>
> Not a hope - 75-80 kph would be pushing your luck on the good bits
> with short stretches of 120kph on the (few) motorways.
>
One sunday morning, I drove off the ferry at Rosslare and got to Carlow
without meeting a car. The Irish Government is extremely corrupt, and
depends on Kickbacks from road contractors to enrich the politicians.
Still the views are worth to. Sorry about Tammany Hall, dudes.
--
greymausg@mail.com
where is our money gone, Dude?
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| Re: After the storm, hopefully [message #419378 is a reply to message #419371] |
Fri, 24 February 2023 10:49 |
GreyMaus[1]
Messages: 1140
Registered: February 2013
Karma: 0
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Senior Member |
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On 2023-02-24, Johnny Billquist <bqt@softjar.se> wrote:
> On 2023-02-24 11:12, Vir Campestris wrote:
>> On 23/02/2023 15:51, Scott Lurndal wrote:
>>> Vir Campestris <vir.campestris@invalid.invalid> writes:
>>>> On 23/02/2023 11:05, maus wrote:
>>>> > On 2023-02-23, Vir Campestris<vir.campestris@invalid.invalid> wrote:
>>>> >>>
>>>> >> OK, so it's not 45 minutes, it's only 25 minutes.
>>>> >>
>> A guaranteed 25 minute charge on a long trip would be OK, time for a
>> bite to eat. Not great, but OK.
>>
>> A 25 minute charge time with a queue of three before you get to the
>> charge station would not be acceptable.
>
> While I agree with that last bit, as far as I can tell, it sounds like
> we might get something like 200 miles, or 300 km on one charge. Maybe a
> bit less on that 25 minute charge.
>
> One break to get a bite to eat is fine. Having to do one every 300
> kilometers is not fine. I won't be grabbing a serious bite to eat every
> 2-3 hours.
Add in no public toilets (There is an empty field, Dude!) and stops
become a big bummer. Some people resent two power lines where one
sufficed before as well.
--
greymausg@mail.com
where is our money gone, Dude?
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| Re: After the storm, hopefully [message #419379 is a reply to message #419311] |
Fri, 24 February 2023 11:03 |
D.J.
Messages: 821
Registered: January 2012
Karma: 0
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Senior Member |
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On Wed, 22 Feb 2023 18:23:02 -0500, Dan Espen <dan1espen@gmail.com>
wrote:
> Peter Flass <peter_flass@yahoo.com> writes:
>
>> maus <maus@mail.com> wrote:
>>> On 2023-02-22, Scott Lurndal <scott@slp53.sl.home> wrote:
>>>> Johnny Billquist <bqt@softjar.se> writes:
>>>> > On 2023-02-22 15:52, Scott Lurndal wrote:
>>>> >> Vir Campestris <vir.campestris@invalid.invalid> writes:
>>>> >>> On 19/02/2023 21:22, Carlos E.R. wrote:
>>>> So you stop and have lunch for 25 minutes along the way. Various
>>>> Tesla variants can reach 405 miles (Model S), as a google search
>>>> will confirm.
>>>>
>>>> In any case, choosing a vehicle based upon a one-time might-happen seems
>>>> counterintuitive - like someone is reaching for a reason to dislike
>>>> battery-electric vehicles.
>>>>
>>> Damn right I am opposed to battery-electric vehicles. When I think of
>>> all the unrenewable batteries that are going to have to dumped in the
>>> years to come, and the useless remainders of those vehicles. The whole
>>> plan to replace fossil fuels with renewables is fantasy, tosh.
>>>
>>> The only road forwards is heavy tax on fossil fuels to eke out what is
>>> remaining in the ground. Won't go down well with Bill Gates, with his
>>> four private jets, or that ilk
>>
>> Hydrogen is the only logical way to go. The problems with hydrogen are
>> slowly being solved, but the people pushing plug-in EVs are going to be
>> getting in the way of adoption.
>
> It degrades the container you store it in.
> It's highly explosive. If you think we have problems with mass
> shootings, start making H2 available in bulk. Accidents where
> the tank gets cracked will be heard for miles.
>
> Possibly someone will come up with practical chemistry to store the H2 in
> a fuel cell but I doubt it.
>
> It does burn cleanly and energetically.
Energetically, yeah, you could say that.
--
Jim
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| Re: After the storm, hopefully [message #419380 is a reply to message #419375] |
Fri, 24 February 2023 12:06 |
scott
Messages: 4237
Registered: February 2012
Karma: 0
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Senior Member |
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maus <maus@mail.com> writes:
> On 2023-02-24, Peter Flass <peter_flass@yahoo.com> wrote:
>> Ahem A Rivet's Shot <steveo@eircom.net> wrote:
>>> On Thu, 23 Feb 2023 23:44:11 GMT
>>> Charlie Gibbs <cgibbs@kltpzyxm.invalid> wrote:
>>>
>>>> On 2023-02-23, Ahem A Rivet's Shot <steveo@eircom.net> wrote:
>>>>
>>>> > On Thu, 23 Feb 2023 07:45:52 -0700
>>>> > Peter Flass <peter_flass@yahoo.com> wrote:
>>>> >
>>>> >> Also did about 700 miles per day with one or two of those quick stops
>>>> >
>>>> > I can't think of anything that would persuade me to drive 700
>>>> > miles in a day.
>>>>
>>>> Been there, done that. It's doable, but tiring - especially solo.
>>>> Best done when you're in your 20s.
>>>>
>>>> Last summer we drove from Vancouver, B.C. to Moab, Utah,
>>>> a distance of about 1200 miles. We did it in two days,
>>>
>>> If I have to go that kind of distance I'll fly or if it's across
>>> mainland Europe I might take a train. Driving it would not enter
>>> consideration.
>>>
>>
>> It’f fun to drive, and you get to see a lot more of the country than you do
>> from a plane.
>>
>
> It is in Ireland, with a beautiful view every mile, but in the US its a
> matter of seen one cactus or field of corn, you have seen them all.
It must suck to be such a bitter old man.
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| Re: After the storm, hopefully [message #419381 is a reply to message #419380] |
Fri, 24 February 2023 12:36 |
GreyMaus[1]
Messages: 1140
Registered: February 2013
Karma: 0
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Senior Member |
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On 2023-02-24, Scott Lurndal <scott@slp53.sl.home> wrote:
> maus <maus@mail.com> writes:
>> On 2023-02-24, Peter Flass <peter_flass@yahoo.com> wrote:
>>> Ahem A Rivet's Shot <steveo@eircom.net> wrote:
>>>> On Thu, 23 Feb 2023 23:44:11 GMT
>>>> Charlie Gibbs <cgibbs@kltpzyxm.invalid> wrote:
>>>>
>>>> > On 2023-02-23, Ahem A Rivet's Shot <steveo@eircom.net> wrote:
>>>> >
>>>> >> On Thu, 23 Feb 2023 07:45:52 -0700
>>>> >> Peter Flass <peter_flass@yahoo.com> wrote:
>>>> >>
>>>> >>> Also did about 700 miles per day with one or two of those quick stops
>>>> >>
>>>> >> I can't think of anything that would persuade me to drive 700
>>>> >> miles in a day.
>>>> >
>>>> > Been there, done that. It's doable, but tiring - especially solo.
>>>> > Best done when you're in your 20s.
>>>> >
>>>> > Last summer we drove from Vancouver, B.C. to Moab, Utah,
>>>> > a distance of about 1200 miles. We did it in two days,
>>>>
>>>> If I have to go that kind of distance I'll fly or if it's across
>>>> mainland Europe I might take a train. Driving it would not enter
>>>> consideration.
>>>>
>>>
>>> It’f fun to drive, and you get to see a lot more of the country than you do
>>> from a plane.
>>>
>>
>> It is in Ireland, with a beautiful view every mile, but in the US its a
>> matter of seen one cactus or field of corn, you have seen them all.
>
> It must suck to be such a bitter old man.
Mine's a Guiness.
--
greymausg@mail.com
where is our money gone, Dude?
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| Re: After the storm, hopefully [message #419385 is a reply to message #419349] |
Fri, 24 February 2023 15:36 |
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Originally posted by: Carlos E.R.
On 2023-02-23 22:22, Ahem A Rivet's Shot wrote:
> On Thu, 23 Feb 2023 21:23:15 +0100
> "Carlos E.R." <robin_listas@es.invalid> wrote:
>
>> The issue will then be the transmission lines to those fast charging
>> stations. Or the stations will have to keep a huge battery pack of their
>> own.
>
> Yep they'll need power like a large factory. Personally I expect
> that when my car is an EV it will get almost all its charging done at home
> and I'll only use public charge points very rarely.
Me too.
--
Cheers, Carlos.
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| Re: After the storm, hopefully [message #419386 is a reply to message #419380] |
Fri, 24 February 2023 15:54 |
D.J.
Messages: 821
Registered: January 2012
Karma: 0
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Senior Member |
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On Fri, 24 Feb 2023 17:06:02 GMT, scott@slp53.sl.home (Scott Lurndal)
wrote:
> maus <maus@mail.com> writes:
>> On 2023-02-24, Peter Flass <peter_flass@yahoo.com> wrote:
>>> Ahem A Rivet's Shot <steveo@eircom.net> wrote:
>>>> On Thu, 23 Feb 2023 23:44:11 GMT
>>>> Charlie Gibbs <cgibbs@kltpzyxm.invalid> wrote:
>>>>
>>>> > On 2023-02-23, Ahem A Rivet's Shot <steveo@eircom.net> wrote:
>>>> >
>>>> >> On Thu, 23 Feb 2023 07:45:52 -0700
>>>> >> Peter Flass <peter_flass@yahoo.com> wrote:
>>>> >>
>>>> >>> Also did about 700 miles per day with one or two of those quick stops
>>>> >>
>>>> >> I can't think of anything that would persuade me to drive 700
>>>> >> miles in a day.
>>>> >
>>>> > Been there, done that. It's doable, but tiring - especially solo.
>>>> > Best done when you're in your 20s.
>>>> >
>>>> > Last summer we drove from Vancouver, B.C. to Moab, Utah,
>>>> > a distance of about 1200 miles. We did it in two days,
>>>>
>>>> If I have to go that kind of distance I'll fly or if it's across
>>>> mainland Europe I might take a train. Driving it would not enter
>>>> consideration.
>>>>
>>>
>>> Itâf fun to drive, and you get to see a lot more of the country than you do
>>> from a plane.
>>>
>>
>> It is in Ireland, with a beautiful view every mile, but in the US its a
>> matter of seen one cactus or field of corn, you have seen them all.
>
> It must suck to be such a bitter old man.
Yeah, that doesn't describe much of the US.
--
Jim
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| Re: After the storm, hopefully [message #419389 is a reply to message #419371] |
Fri, 24 February 2023 17:03 |
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Originally posted by: Carlos E.R.
On 2023-02-24 14:57, Johnny Billquist wrote:
> On 2023-02-24 11:12, Vir Campestris wrote:
>> On 23/02/2023 15:51, Scott Lurndal wrote:
>>> Vir Campestris <vir.campestris@invalid.invalid> writes:
>>>> On 23/02/2023 11:05, maus wrote:
>>>> > On 2023-02-23, Vir Campestris<vir.campestris@invalid.invalid> wrote:
>>>> >>>
>>>> >> OK, so it's not 45 minutes, it's only 25 minutes.
>>>> >>
>>>> > It will be shorter in future, actually, when you think of plugging it
>>>> > in, it is already recharged :):}
>>>>
>>>> The smallest Tesla battery is 50kWh.
>>>>
>>>> Assume I want a 1-minute recharge and that will require 50*60 = 3000kW.
>>>>
>>>> Equivalent to a thousand electric fires.
>>>>
>>>> What kind of plug will I need for that?
>>>
>>> https://electrek.co/2021/11/01/tesla-launches-new-home-charg er-that-works-j1772-all-electric-cars/
>>>
>> Try again.
>>
>> https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/SAE_J1772
>>
>> says "can deliver up to 19.2 kW"
>>
>> Not 3000kW.
>>
>> It also says there's an add on that takes it up to 350kW. A long way
>> from a 1 minute charge, even if the batteries could take it.
>>
>> This implies we will need a lot more charging stations on big service
>> areas compared to the number of fuel pumps - you don't just need
>> enough so the queue doesn't get long, which is where we are on pumps,
>> you need enough so there's almost never a queue.
>>
>> A guaranteed 25 minute charge on a long trip would be OK, time for a
>> bite to eat. Not great, but OK.
>>
>> A 25 minute charge time with a queue of three before you get to the
>> charge station would not be acceptable.
They might have shared charging spots. Ie, connect those three waiting
cars to the cable, but charge them slower. Ok, it will not be 25
minutes, but at least you do not need to stay in the car waiting for the
line to advance. You can have three coffees inside :-D
>
> While I agree with that last bit, as far as I can tell, it sounds like
> we might get something like 200 miles, or 300 km on one charge. Maybe a
> bit less on that 25 minute charge.
>
> One break to get a bite to eat is fine. Having to do one every 300
> kilometers is not fine. I won't be grabbing a serious bite to eat every
> 2-3 hours.
I never do more than 250 Km on a seating. Ok, I might if my favourite
stop place, which is at 230 Km, is closed. I never have a normal lunch,
but what would count as half a lunch.
--
Cheers, Carlos.
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| Re: After the storm, hopefully [message #419391 is a reply to message #419375] |
Fri, 24 February 2023 19:14 |
Peter Flass
Messages: 8375
Registered: December 2011
Karma: 0
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Senior Member |
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maus <maus@mail.com> wrote:
> On 2023-02-24, Peter Flass <peter_flass@yahoo.com> wrote:
>> Ahem A Rivet's Shot <steveo@eircom.net> wrote:
>>> On Thu, 23 Feb 2023 23:44:11 GMT
>>> Charlie Gibbs <cgibbs@kltpzyxm.invalid> wrote:
>>>
>>>> On 2023-02-23, Ahem A Rivet's Shot <steveo@eircom.net> wrote:
>>>>
>>>> > On Thu, 23 Feb 2023 07:45:52 -0700
>>>> > Peter Flass <peter_flass@yahoo.com> wrote:
>>>> >
>>>> >> Also did about 700 miles per day with one or two of those quick stops
>>>> >
>>>> > I can't think of anything that would persuade me to drive 700
>>>> > miles in a day.
>>>>
>>>> Been there, done that. It's doable, but tiring - especially solo.
>>>> Best done when you're in your 20s.
>>>>
>>>> Last summer we drove from Vancouver, B.C. to Moab, Utah,
>>>> a distance of about 1200 miles. We did it in two days,
>>>
>>> If I have to go that kind of distance I'll fly or if it's across
>>> mainland Europe I might take a train. Driving it would not enter
>>> consideration.
>>>
>>
>> It’f fun to drive, and you get to see a lot more of the country than you do
>> from a plane.
>>
>
> It is in Ireland, with a beautiful view every mile, but in the US its a
> matter of seen one cactus or field of corn, you have seen them all.
I recall driving thru Kansas and seeing sunflowers as far as I could see.
Beautiful view!
My feeling was that you had to get thru Missouri (from the northeast)
before there was anything worth seeing, but then there are a lot of
worthwhile sights - Painted Desert, mesas in New Mexico, etc.
> Memories come back. I walked a lot of them roads, moving animals, yonks
> ago. That time you took every job offered. That gateway, overcome by ivy
> that had collapsed the gateposts. I knew that, it lead to a wooded drive
> up to the great house, where peasants were not really allowed. Who know
> now the stories. Off topic.
>
>
--
Pete
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| Re: After the storm, hopefully [message #419393 is a reply to message #419375] |
Fri, 24 February 2023 21:00 |
Dan Espen
Messages: 3867
Registered: January 2012
Karma: 0
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Senior Member |
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maus <maus@mail.com> writes:
> On 2023-02-24, Peter Flass <peter_flass@yahoo.com> wrote:
>> Ahem A Rivet's Shot <steveo@eircom.net> wrote:
>>> On Thu, 23 Feb 2023 23:44:11 GMT
>>> Charlie Gibbs <cgibbs@kltpzyxm.invalid> wrote:
>>>
>>>> On 2023-02-23, Ahem A Rivet's Shot <steveo@eircom.net> wrote:
>>>>
>>>> > On Thu, 23 Feb 2023 07:45:52 -0700
>>>> > Peter Flass <peter_flass@yahoo.com> wrote:
>>>> >
>>>> >> Also did about 700 miles per day with one or two of those quick stops
>>>> >
>>>> > I can't think of anything that would persuade me to drive 700
>>>> > miles in a day.
>>>>
>>>> Been there, done that. It's doable, but tiring - especially solo.
>>>> Best done when you're in your 20s.
>>>>
>>>> Last summer we drove from Vancouver, B.C. to Moab, Utah,
>>>> a distance of about 1200 miles. We did it in two days,
>>>
>>> If I have to go that kind of distance I'll fly or if it's across
>>> mainland Europe I might take a train. Driving it would not enter
>>> consideration.
>>>
>>
>> It’f fun to drive, and you get to see a lot more of the country than you do
>> from a plane.
>>
>
> It is in Ireland, with a beautiful view every mile, but in the US its a
> matter of seen one cactus or field of corn, you have seen them all.
No place nice to drive in the USA?
You're nuts.
I'm on the east coast, it may not be as spectacular as the Rockies,
but there is fantastic stuff everywhere.
--
Dan Espen
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| Re: After the storm, hopefully [message #419396 is a reply to message #419391] |
Sat, 25 February 2023 03:24 |
GreyMaus[1]
Messages: 1140
Registered: February 2013
Karma: 0
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Senior Member |
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On 2023-02-25, Peter Flass <peter_flass@yahoo.com> wrote:
> maus <maus@mail.com> wrote:
>> On 2023-02-24, Peter Flass <peter_flass@yahoo.com> wrote:
>>> Ahem A Rivet's Shot <steveo@eircom.net> wrote:
>>>> On Thu, 23 Feb 2023 23:44:11 GMT
>>>> Charlie Gibbs <cgibbs@kltpzyxm.invalid> wrote:
>>>>
>>>> > On 2023-02-23, Ahem A Rivet's Shot <steveo@eircom.net> wrote:
>>>> >
>>>> >> On Thu, 23 Feb 2023 07:45:52 -0700
>>>> >> Peter Flass <peter_flass@yahoo.com> wrote:
>>>> >>
>>>> >>> Also did about 700 miles per day with one or two of those quick stops
>>>> >>
>>>> >> I can't think of anything that would persuade me to drive 700
>>>> >> miles in a day.
>>>> >
>>>> > Been there, done that. It's doable, but tiring - especially solo.
>>>> > Best done when you're in your 20s.
>>>> >
>>>> > Last summer we drove from Vancouver, B.C. to Moab, Utah,
>>>> > a distance of about 1200 miles. We did it in two days,
>>>>
>>>> If I have to go that kind of distance I'll fly or if it's across
>>>> mainland Europe I might take a train. Driving it would not enter
>>>> consideration.
>>>>
>>>
>>> It’f fun to drive, and you get to see a lot more of the country than you do
>>> from a plane.
>>>
>>
>> It is in Ireland, with a beautiful view every mile, but in the US its a
>> matter of seen one cactus or field of corn, you have seen them all.
>
> I recall driving thru Kansas and seeing sunflowers as far as I could see.
> Beautiful view!
>
> My feeling was that you had to get thru Missouri (from the northeast)
> before there was anything worth seeing, but then there are a lot of
> worthwhile sights - Painted Desert, mesas in New Mexico, etc.
>
>> Memories come back. I walked a lot of them roads, moving animals, yonks
>> ago. That time you took every job offered. That gateway, overcome by ivy
>> that had collapsed the gateposts. I knew that, it lead to a wooded drive
>> up to the great house, where peasants were not really allowed. Who know
>> now the stories. Off topic.
>>
>>
>
>
>
Apologies for insulting your country, You are correct, of course.
--
greymausg@mail.com
where is our money gone, Dude?
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| Re: After the storm, hopefully [message #419397 is a reply to message #419393] |
Sat, 25 February 2023 03:25 |
GreyMaus[1]
Messages: 1140
Registered: February 2013
Karma: 0
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Senior Member |
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On 2023-02-25, Dan Espen <dan1espen@gmail.com> wrote:
> maus <maus@mail.com> writes:
>
>> On 2023-02-24, Peter Flass <peter_flass@yahoo.com> wrote:
>>> Ahem A Rivet's Shot <steveo@eircom.net> wrote:
>>>> On Thu, 23 Feb 2023 23:44:11 GMT
>>>> Charlie Gibbs <cgibbs@kltpzyxm.invalid> wrote:
>>>>
>>>> > On 2023-02-23, Ahem A Rivet's Shot <steveo@eircom.net> wrote:
>>>> >
>>>> >> On Thu, 23 Feb 2023 07:45:52 -0700
>>>> >> Peter Flass <peter_flass@yahoo.com> wrote:
>>>> >>
>>>> >>> Also did about 700 miles per day with one or two of those quick stops
>>>> >>
>>>> >> I can't think of anything that would persuade me to drive 700
>>>> >> miles in a day.
>>>> >
>>>> > Been there, done that. It's doable, but tiring - especially solo.
>>>> > Best done when you're in your 20s.
>>>> >
>>>> > Last summer we drove from Vancouver, B.C. to Moab, Utah,
>>>> > a distance of about 1200 miles. We did it in two days,
>>>>
>>>> If I have to go that kind of distance I'll fly or if it's across
>>>> mainland Europe I might take a train. Driving it would not enter
>>>> consideration.
>>>>
>>>
>>> It’f fun to drive, and you get to see a lot more of the country than you do
>>> from a plane.
>>>
>>
>> It is in Ireland, with a beautiful view every mile, but in the US its a
>> matter of seen one cactus or field of corn, you have seen them all.
>
> No place nice to drive in the USA?
>
> You're nuts.
>
> I'm on the east coast, it may not be as spectacular as the Rockies,
> but there is fantastic stuff everywhere.
>
Again, as above, apologies
--
greymausg@mail.com
where is our money gone, Dude?
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| Re: After the storm, hopefully [message #419399 is a reply to message #419386] |
Sat, 25 February 2023 04:57 |
Harry Vaderchi
Messages: 719
Registered: July 2012
Karma: 0
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Senior Member |
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On Fri, 24 Feb 2023 14:54:27 -0600
D.J. <chucktheouch@gmnol.com> wrote:
> On Fri, 24 Feb 2023 17:06:02 GMT, scott@slp53.sl.home (Scott Lurndal)
> wrote:
>> maus <maus@mail.com> writes:
>>> On 2023-02-24, Peter Flass <peter_flass@yahoo.com> wrote:
>>>> Ahem A Rivet's Shot <steveo@eircom.net> wrote:
>>>> > On Thu, 23 Feb 2023 23:44:11 GMT
>>>> > Charlie Gibbs <cgibbs@kltpzyxm.invalid> wrote:
>>>> >
>>>> >> On 2023-02-23, Ahem A Rivet's Shot <steveo@eircom.net> wrote:
>>>> >>
>>>> >>> On Thu, 23 Feb 2023 07:45:52 -0700
>>>> >>> Peter Flass <peter_flass@yahoo.com> wrote:
>>>> >>>
>>>> >>>> Also did about 700 miles per day with one or two of those quick stops
>>>> >>>
>>>> >>> I can't think of anything that would persuade me to drive 700
>>>> >>> miles in a day.
>>>> >>
>>>> >> Been there, done that. It's doable, but tiring - especially solo.
>>>> >> Best done when you're in your 20s.
>>>> >>
>>>> >> Last summer we drove from Vancouver, B.C. to Moab, Utah,
>>>> >> a distance of about 1200 miles. We did it in two days,
>>>> >
>>>> > If I have to go that kind of distance I'll fly or if it's across
>>>> > mainland Europe I might take a train. Driving it would not enter
>>>> > consideration.
>>>> >
>>>>
>>>> Itâf fun to drive, and you get to see a lot more of the country than you do
>>>> from a plane.
>>>>
>>>
>>> It is in Ireland, with a beautiful view every mile, but in the US its a
>>> matter of seen one cactus or field of corn, you have seen them all.
>>
>> It must suck to be such a bitter old man.
>
> Yeah, that doesn't describe much of the US.
Just to be contrary; I bet you^one could compose a substantial (is 500km
the target?) route across the cornbelt with a reasonably monotonous view.
Bill Bryson describes (or doesn't) part of his US trip by skipping forward
3 hours, so we didn't have to. AIUI Oz has similar long strteches, replace
the view with gum trees & red dirt.
--
Bah, and indeed Humbug.
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| Re: After the storm, hopefully [message #419401 is a reply to message #419369] |
Sat, 25 February 2023 05:33 |
Ahem A Rivet's Shot
Messages: 4843
Registered: January 2012
Karma: 0
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Senior Member |
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On Fri, 24 Feb 2023 05:59:08 -0700
Peter Flass <peter_flass@yahoo.com> wrote:
> It’f fun to drive, and you get to see a lot more of the country than you
> do from a plane.
Your superhighways must be very different to our motorways - most
of the time on a motorway I see concrete, cars, trucks and the sides of the
cutting or other barrier used to direct the sound away from the residents.
It may be the most beautiful country in the world just a few metres away
but a motorway is always ugly.
Driving through country roads, villages, small towns, mountain
passes ... that can be fun sure but not hundreds of miles a day of it.
Anywhere with a decent high speed network trains win hands down,
even the worst train catering is way better than planes, the view is
usually better than from a road *and* I can look at it comfortably because
I'm not piloting a tonne of metal and plastic at over 100kph.
--
Steve O'Hara-Smith
Odds and Ends at http://www.sohara.org/
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| Re: After the storm, hopefully [message #419403 is a reply to message #419369] |
Sat, 25 February 2023 08:33 |
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Originally posted by: Andy Walker
On 24/02/2023 12:59, Peter Flass wrote:
> It’f fun to drive, and you get to see a lot more of the country than you do
> from a plane.
Actually [if it's daylight and you have a window seat] you see a
lot more from the plane. But it's all a long way away, whereas in a car
you may get to see things close up. OTOH, if you're driving, your eyes
should be on the road, not peering at the houses you're going past.
OTTH, flying is horrible. Not so much the actual flight, but getting
to/from the airport and waiting around.
--
Andy Walker, Nottingham.
Andy's music pages: www.cuboid.me.uk/andy/Music
Composer of the day: www.cuboid.me.uk/andy/Music/Composers/Sinding
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| Re: After the storm, hopefully [message #419404 is a reply to message #419403] |
Sat, 25 February 2023 10:07 |
GreyMaus[1]
Messages: 1140
Registered: February 2013
Karma: 0
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Senior Member |
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On 2023-02-25, Andy Walker <anw@cuboid.co.uk> wrote:
> On 24/02/2023 12:59, Peter Flass wrote:
>> It’f fun to drive, and you get to see a lot more of the country than you do
>> from a plane.
> Actually [if it's daylight and you have a window seat] you see a
> lot more from the plane. But it's all a long way away, whereas in a car
> you may get to see things close up. OTOH, if you're driving, your eyes
> should be on the road, not peering at the houses you're going past.
> OTTH, flying is horrible. Not so much the actual flight, but getting
> to/from the airport and waiting around.
>
I get someone to drive me so I can look out to see how things have
changed over the years. That is the old roads. My big problem is to pay
attention to the road when I am driving myself. everything is gone out
of the cars that will divert from that, route finders, desktop cameras.
A book on tape perhaps. I am told that the area around Pittsburg is very
scenic, and the real deep south is worth visiting.
Probably never now.
--
greymausg@mail.com
where is our money gone, Dude?
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| Re: After the storm, hopefully [message #419406 is a reply to message #419398] |
Sat, 25 February 2023 11:17 |
scott
Messages: 4237
Registered: February 2012
Karma: 0
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Senior Member |
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"Kerr-Mudd, John" <admin@127.0.0.1> writes:
> On Fri, 24 Feb 2023 19:11:21 GMT
> scott@slp53.sl.home (Scott Lurndal) wrote:
>
>> maus <maus@mail.com> writes:
>>> On 2023-02-24, Scott Lurndal <scott@slp53.sl.home> wrote:
>>>
>>>
>>> Mine's a Guiness.
>>
> Guinness
>
>> So's mine. Slainte!
>
> I'd rather a Wickwar Station Porter, or a a Titanic Vanilla Stout.
I did acquire a taste for Abbot Ale when I was last in
Milton Keynes, but that's much harder to find on this side
of the pond.
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| Re: After the storm, hopefully [message #419407 is a reply to message #419401] |
Sat, 25 February 2023 11:27 |
scott
Messages: 4237
Registered: February 2012
Karma: 0
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Senior Member |
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Ahem A Rivet's Shot <steveo@eircom.net> writes:
> On Fri, 24 Feb 2023 05:59:08 -0700
> Peter Flass <peter_flass@yahoo.com> wrote:
>
>> It’f fun to drive, and you get to see a lot more of the country than you
>> do from a plane.
>
> Your superhighways must be very different to our motorways - most
> of the time on a motorway I see concrete, cars, trucks and the sides of the
> cutting or other barrier used to direct the sound away from the residents.
> It may be the most beautiful country in the world just a few metres away
> but a motorway is always ugly.
That depends on location, location, location.
Take Interstate 80, for example; Starts in Teaneck New Jersey and
ends in downtown San Franscisco. 2,900 miles (4,668 km). A wide
variety of everything, from the relatively densely populated
eastern New Jersey, through wooded, hilly Pennsylvania, into the
flat farmlands of the midwest from Ohio, Indiana, Illinois, Iowa
and Nebraska, entering the intermountain west, the deserts west
of Utah's Salt Lake, into the high deserts of Nevada, the Sierra
Nevada Mountains (Donner pass, Lake Tahoe), the agricultural
mecca of the central valleys of California terminating in
beautiful San Francisco.
Or you can take the much slower US Route 66 more leisurely.
> Anywhere with a decent high speed network trains win hands down,
> even the worst train catering is way better than planes, the view is
> usually better than from a road *and* I can look at it comfortably because
> I'm not piloting a tonne of metal and plastic at over 100kph.
I don't necessarily disagree, but we have a lot more area to cover,
here and there doesn't seem to be much emphasis on long-range passenger
rail travel. There are scenic train routes, albeit mostly north of
the Canadian border sadly.
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| Re: After the storm, hopefully [message #419408 is a reply to message #419406] |
Sat, 25 February 2023 12:00 |
D.J.
Messages: 821
Registered: January 2012
Karma: 0
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Senior Member |
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On Sat, 25 Feb 2023 16:17:21 GMT, scott@slp53.sl.home (Scott Lurndal)
wrote:
> "Kerr-Mudd, John" <admin@127.0.0.1> writes:
>> On Fri, 24 Feb 2023 19:11:21 GMT
>> scott@slp53.sl.home (Scott Lurndal) wrote:
>>
>>> maus <maus@mail.com> writes:
>>>> On 2023-02-24, Scott Lurndal <scott@slp53.sl.home> wrote:
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> Mine's a Guiness.
>>>
>> Guinness
>>
>>> So's mine. Slainte!
>>
>> I'd rather a Wickwar Station Porter, or a a Titanic Vanilla Stout.
>
> I did acquire a taste for Abbot Ale when I was last in
> Milton Keynes, but that's much harder to find on this side
> of the pond.
Yuck indeed. I prefer rum.
--
Jim
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| Re: After the storm, hopefully [message #419409 is a reply to message #419399] |
Sat, 25 February 2023 12:02 |
D.J.
Messages: 821
Registered: January 2012
Karma: 0
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Senior Member |
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On Sat, 25 Feb 2023 09:57:24 +0000, "Kerr-Mudd, John"
<admin@127.0.0.1> wrote:
> On Fri, 24 Feb 2023 14:54:27 -0600
> D.J. <chucktheouch@gmnol.com> wrote:
>
>> On Fri, 24 Feb 2023 17:06:02 GMT, scott@slp53.sl.home (Scott Lurndal)
>> wrote:
>>> maus <maus@mail.com> writes:
>>>> On 2023-02-24, Peter Flass <peter_flass@yahoo.com> wrote:
>>>> > Ahem A Rivet's Shot <steveo@eircom.net> wrote:
>>>> >> On Thu, 23 Feb 2023 23:44:11 GMT
>>>> >> Charlie Gibbs <cgibbs@kltpzyxm.invalid> wrote:
>>>> >>
>>>> >>> On 2023-02-23, Ahem A Rivet's Shot <steveo@eircom.net> wrote:
>>>> >>>
>>>> >>>> On Thu, 23 Feb 2023 07:45:52 -0700
>>>> >>>> Peter Flass <peter_flass@yahoo.com> wrote:
>>>> >>>>
>>>> >>>>> Also did about 700 miles per day with one or two of those quick stops
>>>> >>>>
>>>> >>>> I can't think of anything that would persuade me to drive 700
>>>> >>>> miles in a day.
>>>> >>>
>>>> >>> Been there, done that. It's doable, but tiring - especially solo.
>>>> >>> Best done when you're in your 20s.
>>>> >>>
>>>> >>> Last summer we drove from Vancouver, B.C. to Moab, Utah,
>>>> >>> a distance of about 1200 miles. We did it in two days,
>>>> >>
>>>> >> If I have to go that kind of distance I'll fly or if it's across
>>>> >> mainland Europe I might take a train. Driving it would not enter
>>>> >> consideration.
>>>> >>
>>>> >
>>>> > Itâf fun to drive, and you get to see a lot more of the country than you do
>>>> > from a plane.
>>>> >
>>>>
>>>> It is in Ireland, with a beautiful view every mile, but in the US its a
>>>> matter of seen one cactus or field of corn, you have seen them all.
>>>
>>> It must suck to be such a bitter old man.
>>
>> Yeah, that doesn't describe much of the US.
>
> Just to be contrary; I bet you^one could compose a substantial (is 500km
> the target?) route across the cornbelt with a reasonably monotonous view.
> Bill Bryson describes (or doesn't) part of his US trip by skipping forward
> 3 hours, so we didn't have to. AIUI Oz has similar long strteches, replace
> the view with gum trees & red dirt.
The Great Plains of the US is corn, wheat, and cattle. But there are
other parts with oak and pine forests, cities and towns, amusement
parks, the grand canyon, etc.
--
Jim
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| Re: After the storm, hopefully [message #419410 is a reply to message #419401] |
Sat, 25 February 2023 12:06 |
D.J.
Messages: 821
Registered: January 2012
Karma: 0
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Senior Member |
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On Sat, 25 Feb 2023 10:33:08 +0000, Ahem A Rivet's Shot
<steveo@eircom.net> wrote:
> On Fri, 24 Feb 2023 05:59:08 -0700
> Peter Flass <peter_flass@yahoo.com> wrote:
>
>> Itf fun to drive, and you get to see a lot more of the country than you
>> do from a plane.
>
> Your superhighways must be very different to our motorways - most
> of the time on a motorway I see concrete, cars, trucks and the sides of the
> cutting or other barrier used to direct the sound away from the residents.
> It may be the most beautiful country in the world just a few metres away
> but a motorway is always ugly.
>
> Driving through country roads, villages, small towns, mountain
> passes ... that can be fun sure but not hundreds of miles a day of it.
>
> Anywhere with a decent high speed network trains win hands down,
> even the worst train catering is way better than planes, the view is
> usually better than from a road *and* I can look at it comfortably because
> I'm not piloting a tonne of metal and plastic at over 100kph.
I can drive down an Interstate highway and be going through pine
forests, the Painted Desert, marshes, the Hoover dam, lots of scenic
places. The US east coast from Atlanta up past New Yorkk City all runs
together. But you can still see rivers and forests.
--
Jim
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| Re: After the storm, hopefully [message #419411 is a reply to message #419404] |
Sat, 25 February 2023 12:08 |
Dan Espen
Messages: 3867
Registered: January 2012
Karma: 0
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Senior Member |
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maus <maus@mail.com> writes:
> On 2023-02-25, Andy Walker <anw@cuboid.co.uk> wrote:
>> On 24/02/2023 12:59, Peter Flass wrote:
>>> It’f fun to drive, and you get to see a lot more of the country than you do
>>> from a plane.
>> Actually [if it's daylight and you have a window seat] you see a
>> lot more from the plane. But it's all a long way away, whereas in a car
>> you may get to see things close up. OTOH, if you're driving, your eyes
>> should be on the road, not peering at the houses you're going past.
>> OTTH, flying is horrible. Not so much the actual flight, but getting
>> to/from the airport and waiting around.
>>
>
> I get someone to drive me so I can look out to see how things have
> changed over the years. That is the old roads. My big problem is to pay
> attention to the road when I am driving myself. everything is gone out
> of the cars that will divert from that, route finders, desktop cameras.
> A book on tape perhaps. I am told that the area around Pittsburg is very
> scenic, and the real deep south is worth visiting.
>
> Probably never now.
On the east coast peak driving is probably Skyline Drive.
NH and VT are something to see in the fall.
--
Dan Espen
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| Re: After the storm, hopefully [message #419412 is a reply to message #419411] |
Sat, 25 February 2023 13:00 |
scott
Messages: 4237
Registered: February 2012
Karma: 0
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Senior Member |
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Dan Espen <dan1espen@gmail.com> writes:
> maus <maus@mail.com> writes:
>
>> On 2023-02-25, Andy Walker <anw@cuboid.co.uk> wrote:
>>> On 24/02/2023 12:59, Peter Flass wrote:
>>>> It’f fun to drive, and you get to see a lot more of the country than you do
>>>> from a plane.
>>> Actually [if it's daylight and you have a window seat] you see a
>>> lot more from the plane. But it's all a long way away, whereas in a car
>>> you may get to see things close up. OTOH, if you're driving, your eyes
>>> should be on the road, not peering at the houses you're going past.
>>> OTTH, flying is horrible. Not so much the actual flight, but getting
>>> to/from the airport and waiting around.
>>>
>>
>> I get someone to drive me so I can look out to see how things have
>> changed over the years. That is the old roads. My big problem is to pay
>> attention to the road when I am driving myself. everything is gone out
>> of the cars that will divert from that, route finders, desktop cameras.
>> A book on tape perhaps. I am told that the area around Pittsburg is very
>> scenic, and the real deep south is worth visiting.
>>
>> Probably never now.
>
> On the east coast peak driving is probably Skyline Drive.
On the west coast, try Skyline Boulevard (CA35) in the Santa
Cruz mountains, year 'round.
>
> NH and VT are something to see in the fall.
As are Wisconsin and Minnesota, particularly along
the Mississippi river valley from Hudson Wi to
Dubuque, Iowa.
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| Re: After the storm, hopefully [message #419414 is a reply to message #419411] |
Sat, 25 February 2023 13:37 |
GreyMaus[1]
Messages: 1140
Registered: February 2013
Karma: 0
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Senior Member |
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On 2023-02-25, Dan Espen <dan1espen@gmail.com> wrote:
> maus <maus@mail.com> writes:
>
>> On 2023-02-25, Andy Walker <anw@cuboid.co.uk> wrote:
>>> On 24/02/2023 12:59, Peter Flass wrote:
>>>> It’f fun to drive, and you get to see a lot more of the country than you do
>>>> from a plane.
>> attention to the road when I am driving myself. everything is gone out
>> of the cars that will divert from that, route finders, desktop cameras.
>> A book on tape perhaps. I am told that the area around Pittsburg is very
>> scenic, and the real deep south is worth visiting.
>>
>> Probably never now.
>
> On the east coast peak driving is probably Skyline Drive.
>
> NH and VT are something to see in the fall.
>
Yes, I have heard the joke, "Summer in NH is nice, if it falls on a
weekend."
--
greymausg@mail.com
where is our money gone, Dude?
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