Xref: utzoo news.admin:3470 news.misc:1815 Path: utzoo!utgpu!water!watmath!clyde!att!osu-cis!tut.cis.ohio-state.edu!rutgers!cmcl2!lanl!unm-la!unmvax!nmtsun!caasnsr From: caasnsr@nmtsun.nmt.edu (Clifford Adams) Newsgroups: news.admin,news.misc Subject: Opinion on a "problem" Message-ID: <1169@nmtsun.nmt.edu> Date: 22 Sep 88 02:41:54 GMT Reply-To: caasnsr@nmtsun.nmt.edu (Clifford Adams) Organization: New Mexico Tech, Socorro NM Lines: 86 Some members of a group do X. User Y is a member of the group above. Does not imply: User Y does X. Some users of Portal post inappropriately. User Y is a user of Portal. Does not imply: User Y posts inappropriately. Does a user's site have anything to do with the relevance of the user's articles (individually, not statistically)? ****** The arguments sound a lot like this: "I have been on this net for (months/years) and I don't like the influence Portal has had on the net. There have been a lot of Portal morons who have disobeyed the rules, and have not shown decent respect for the purpose of the net. The lousy editors that some posters use just clutter the net and make it look bad." "I think we should just ignore what they say. Sysadmins can also install scripts to keep all Portal postings from the users of their systems. After all, it is *my* system, and I can keep what I want on it." ...Which is very similar to arguments often heard earlier (and still today)... "I have been in this town for years, and I don't like the influence {ethnics} have had on the town. There have been a lot of {ethnic} morons who have disobeyed the rules, and have not shown decent respect for the traditions of the town. The shabby homes that some {ethnics} use just clutter the town and make it look bad." "I think we should just ignore what they say. Local politicians can keep others from attending meetings of {ethnics}. After all, it is their job to keep the community looking nice." ****** There are some users of Portal who detract from USENET. There are also some who benefit the net. Do you let "From: xxx@cup.portal.com" decide the quality of an article? I definitely favor KILL files for individuals, to "remove" a troublesome person. KILLing a group of people based on a few is counter to many of the dreams of USENET. Wasn't the Net supposed to be the "great electronic anarchy", where everyone could speak, without censorship or repression (at least in alt. groups)? A community where all can share ideas, speaking the same language (ASCII), without arbitrary differences like race or gender. A form of racism has come to USENET. Sites leaving (like AT&T) will not kill the net. This form of racism (siteism?) might do so. Some people are in favor of creating a ghetto of those sites which have a few troublesome people. [The ghetto analogy is especially apt, as some of the users of Portal are not able to afford other resources.] Some people have said that the Portal posters are making the net a giant BBS (Bulletin Board System). In fact, it is the detractors of Portal who are furthering the trend towards a BBS environment. These people want to act like the sysadmin of the USENET, deciding what other people should read. The net should not be a matter of a few people's opinions. To repeat, I don't really care what goes on in *your own, individual,* KILL file. You are free to read what you want. But for sysadmins to censor the news, or call for cutting off the feed to Portal, is not what USENET is about. I hope that the net will continue to grow into a mature electronic community, free from some of the problems of our current society. Like racism/siteism. Thank you for reading this opinion. -- Clifford A. Adams --- "I understand only inasmuch as I become." ForthLisp Project Programmer (Goal: LISP interpreter in Forth) caasnsr@nmtsun.nmt.edu ...cmcl2!lanl!unm-la!unmvax!nmtsun!caasnsr (505) 835-6104 | US Mail: Box 2439 Campus Station / Socorro, NM 87801