Relay-Version: version B 2.10 5/3/83; site utzoo.UUCP Path: utzoo!mnetor!uunet!seismo!gatech!bloom-beacon!oberon!cit-vax!elroy!ames!ucbcad!ucbvax!SMITH.BITNET!MANAGER From: MANAGER@SMITH.BITNET (Mary Malmros) Newsgroups: comp.os.vms Subject: 8xxx system problems Message-ID: <8707110150.AA27978@ucbvax.Berkeley.EDU> Date: Thu, 9-Jul-87 14:38:00 EDT Article-I.D.: ucbvax.8707110150.AA27978 Posted: Thu Jul 9 14:38:00 1987 Date-Received: Sun, 12-Jul-87 14:10:05 EDT Sender: daemon@ucbvax.BERKELEY.EDU Distribution: world Organization: The ARPA Internet Lines: 44 Paul Clayton listed a number of problems that he's experienced with his 8500 since Jan 1. We got an 8500 shortly before that. I haven't run up against any of the problems that he mentioned EXCEPT the crashes that are associated with doing things to/with the console. Specifically, I have crashed my system while doing the following three things: 1. Doing CONNECT CONSOLE -- system crashed about 5-10 minutes following the command. 2. Scanning console log -- system crashed sometime within 15 minutes of when I started looking at the log. 3. Using the console as a terminal to do TYPE and EDT -- console got hung up totally when it received several quick XOFF/XON combinations while typing a file. Similar behavior in EDT when receiving several PAGE commands (or other commands requiring a screen redraw) in rapid succession. I did this about five times in two days last December, right after we had got it out of the box, and the console was the only thing that could talk to the CPU, so I really don't know if it crashed the system, hung the system, or just confused the console such that it would eventually have crashed. I would really like to hear from other people with bothersome consoles because I don't know a)what it is or b)what comprehensive steps I can take to avoid it, short of never touching the console at all. Someone told me once that it had something to do with the very small bus connecting the console to the CPU. Because the bus is small, it can't handle too much stuff going in both directions, and it gets confused and the system crashes. Aside from the lack of detail, I don't like that explanation because at least in case 2, stuff should only be going in one direction (CPU to console). Maybe it's got something to do with acknowledgements--CPU is trying to send stuff to console, console is busy doing something else and can't accept new stuff or acknowledge that it got it. Anyway...I'm almost inclined to think that the problem runs a little deeper than the operating system and that 4.6 won't fix it. Warning for all others with 8500/8530 systems: STABACKIT does a CONNECT CONSOLE. I found this out when I had to rebuild my standalone kit following a microcode upgrade (8500 to 8530). I called DEC and the answer I got was that you can't get there from here, and that I would have to build a standalone kit on something else. I built the kit on the system disk, so it's no big deal, but I don't think DEC warns you about this explicitly (just "don't CONNECT CONSOLE). I really don't get it because I did do STABACKIT once before and I got away with it...maybe I just got lucky :)