Relay-Version: version B 2.10 5/3/83; site utzoo.UUCP Path: utzoo!mnetor!uunet!seismo!husc6!think!ames!ucbcad!ucbvax!ADS.ARPA!Info-Graphics-Request From: Info-Graphics-Request@ADS.ARPA (Info-Graphics moderator Andy Cromarty) Newsgroups: comp.graphics.digest Subject: Info-Graphics Digest Message-ID: <8707121415.AA22257@ucbvax.Berkeley.EDU> Date: Sun, 12-Jul-87 06:00:18 EDT Article-I.D.: ucbvax.8707121415.AA22257 Posted: Sun Jul 12 06:00:18 1987 Date-Received: Mon, 13-Jul-87 01:17:01 EDT Sender: daemon@ucbvax.BERKELEY.EDU Reply-To: Info-Graphics@ADS.ARPA Distribution: world Organization: The ARPA Internet Lines: 181 Approved: info-graphics@ads.arpa Info-Graphics Digest Sun Jul 12 03:00:19 PDT 1987 - Send submissions to Info-Graphics@ADS.ARPA - Send requests for list membership to Info-Graphics-Request@ADS.ARPA Today's Topics: UNIX(tm) Graphics DRAWING Systems Submission for comp-graphics-digest Re: PAL video boards Re: Info-Graphics Digest ADD TO MAILING LIST ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Path: whuts!cr From: ihnp4!whuts!cr@ucbvax.Berkeley.EDU (RAMOS) Subject: UNIX(tm) Graphics DRAWING Systems Keywords: graphics, drawing Date: 7 Jul 87 13:26:25 GMT Distribution: na Organization: AT&T Bell Laboratories Lines: 41 <*> Hope you can help, I am looking for Graphics Systems that allows the user to: 1) DRAW, not program (e.g. mouse/bit map, light pen/vector) 2) combine one or more graphics into an 11x17 inch fold-out sheet 3) use various font types and sizes (ala "troff") 4) runs on a UNIX machine or is "troff" compatible Color graphics would be welcome, if feasible, but are not necessary. Some packages/systems that I already know about and have evaluated are below. I am providing them along with "problems" to ensure that you know the status of the search to date, and the impact of the evaluation criteria: 1) "xcip" (including "aded" and "sdled") PROBLEM: How to produce 11x17 fold-out graphics 2) "ped" PROBLEM: How to produce 11x17 fold-out graphics 3) MAGIC PROBLEM: Requires phototypesetting (chemical) facilities, including: a) a small dark room for the phototypesetter b) available water supply to the phototypesetter c) chemical disposal and possible silver recovery of phototypesetter (C/A/T) waste, no imagen/XRX support d) a full time operator at a technically proficient level (eg. STA) Please let me know if you can give me any information (affirmative or negative) regarding the problems above and if you know of any graphics packages that fit some of the specs outlined. I need the info by Thursday, so I can provide a prelimary report to my sup by Friday. Thank you. Catalina Ramos {clyde|harvard|cbosgd|allegra|ulysses|ihnp4}!whuts!cr 1-201-386-2899 8-232-2899 ------------------------------ Tue, 7 Jul 87 11:33:12 PDT From: papa%uscacsc.USC.EDU@sdcsvax.ucsd.edu (Marco Papa) Date: 7 Jul 87 18:28:58 GMT Subject: Submission for comp-graphics-digest Responding-System: uscacsc.UUCP Path: uscacsc!papa From: papa@uscacsc.UUCP (Marco Papa) Subject: Re: PAL video boards Date: 7 Jul 87 18:28:57 GMT References: <8707070349.AA22852@ucbvax.Berkeley.EDU> Distribution: world Organization: Felsina Software, Los Angeles Lines: 11 I don't know about PC boards, but the Commodore Amiga computers sold in Europe are PAL-compatible. The Amiga gives you a choice of up to 16 colors in high-res (640x400 NTSC, more om PAL), 32 colors in low-res (320x200 NTSC) and a full 4096 colors in HAM mode (320x400 NTSC). Since the output is PAL compatible, it can be dumped directly onto video-tape of fed into a TV studio input through an optional genlock. I believe that now all three AMiga models (500, 1000, and 2000) are sold in Europe. -- Marco Papa Felsina Software ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 8 Jul 87 13:26:29 PDT From: hplabs!bnrmtv!perkins@ucbvax.Berkeley.EDU (Henry Perkins) Subject: Re: Info-Graphics Digest Advice to Willaim Lord Hayward re: graphics in games -- 1. Get a faster computer, with a hard disk. You'll have to put in thousands of edit-assemble-link-test cycles; the time spent waiting for a stock IBM PC with floppy disks will literally add up to months. Almost any investment in high-performance gear (hardware or software) for development will pay for itself. 2. Watch out for IBM screen snow. Your Hercules color card doesn't put noise on the screen when you access video memory at the same time as screen refresh, but the standard IBM card does. You'll need an IBM card for testing, lest your program be unacceptable on IBM hardware. 3. Graphics texts won't be of great use to you, because the machine lacks the capability to do anything fancy in real time. You'll need a book specific to IBM PC graphics with assembly-language examples [avoid the BASIC books], plus one regular text to learn the fundamentals -- Foley & Van Dam or Newton & Sproull (titles are Principals of Interactive Graphics & Fundamentals of I. G.). 4. You'll need to do most of your programming in assembly language. 4.77 MHz 8088-based machines don't have the horsepower to do animation any other way, and even then you'll spend hundreds of hours optimizing your code and re-thinking your algorithms to make things more efficient. Get a good reference for 8086 assembly language -- either Intel's book or Rector & Alexy's "The 8086 Book". You'll have memorized the cycle counts for most of the instructions by the time you get your animation code fast enough. 5. General tips -- do as much of your animation by table look-up as you can. You've got about enough power to draw lines and circles on the fly (using fine-tuned Bresenham's routines), but most everything else needs to be pre-computed. Hire a graphic designer (a specialized artist) with computer experience to do your images. Expect everything to take much longer than seems reasonable. What makes me so opinionated? I did the animation for "Championship Golf", published by Activision's GameStar division. It took me 3 years, half of that working full time on the program. My co-author spent even longer modeling the golf course. You may want to check our program out to get an idea of what's just barely possible on a floppy-based IBM PC. Real-time animation on a stock IBM PC is an exercise best suited to highly talented masochists. --- {hplabs,amdahl,3comvax}!bnrmtv!perkins --Henry Perkins It is better never to have been born. But who among us has such luck? One in a million, perhaps. ------------------------------ Date: 09 JUL 87 14:29 CET From: U16D%CBEBDA3T.BITNET@wiscvm.wisc.edu Subject: ADD TO MAILING LIST Please add me to your mailing list. Thanks! J.S. Shiner ------------------------------ End of INFO-GRAPHICS ********************