Relay-Version: version B 2.10 5/3/83; site utzoo.UUCP
Path: utzoo!mnetor!seismo!rutgers!ames!amdahl!amdcad!phil
From: phil@amdcad.UUCP (Phil Ngai)
Newsgroups: comp.mail.headers
Subject: Another example of smail routing
Message-ID: <14267@amdcad.UUCP>
Date: Fri, 9-Jan-87 16:20:04 EST
Article-I.D.: amdcad.14267
Posted: Fri Jan  9 16:20:04 1987
Date-Received: Sat, 10-Jan-87 02:05:27 EST
Organization: AMDCAD, Sunnyvale, CA
Lines: 61

Ok, there has been some criticism of my use of decwrl as an example of
how smail doesn't work even with a well run site. I still think decwrl
is a good example despite Mark's claims that they are an ENET site
first, ARPA second, and only third for UUCP. It is true that decwrl is
all three of those and probably more. But decwrl is (as far as I know)
THE corporate mail gateway. I see it as saying the front wheels on my
car come first and if my back wheels malfunction, well they're not as
important. I don't think that's how DEC does it. And any other
problems I have brought to the attention of the decwrl staff have been
resolved.  Except for this one.

So you don't like decwrl. How about ucbvax? I even looked at its
sendmail.cf. It has a special case for amdcad. But it still likes to
take that extra hop through sun. Am I to believe that ucbvax is poorly
run too? If neither DEC nor Berkeley can get it right, what about the
rest of the world? I can't believe anyone would say "oh that extra hop
over the ARPAnet doesn't matter." It seems like a very poor design to
me.

I would like to understand the nature of this problem a bit better.
Is there something that DEC and Berkeley are supposed to do to their
sendmail.cf? Would it be possible for the implementors of smail to
write this down and tell the respective postmasters? Or do the
postmasters know it already and reject the smail way of doing things?
Who's right, a site like decwrl that has to actually move the mail, or
the smail implementors.  Or is the name server in need of an update?
Or is this extra hop just part of the smail design? Will sun go nova
because of all these extra hops? What's going to happen to the speed
of my mail delivery as everyone starts pouring all their ARPA mail
through sun?

Here's the test mail:

From kbh@ucbvax.Berkeley.EDU Fri Jan  9 00:30:44 1987
Received: by amdcad.AMD.COM (4.12/smail2.1/11-19-86)
	id AA18226; Fri, 9 Jan 87 00:30:39 pst
Received: from Sun.COM (arpa-dev) by sun.Sun.COM (3.2/SMI-3.2)
	id AA25990; Fri, 9 Jan 87 00:05:09 PST
Received: from ucbvax.Berkeley.EDU by Sun.COM (3.2/SMI-3.2)
	id AA03324; Fri, 9 Jan 87 00:05:18 PST
Received: by ucbvax.Berkeley.EDU (5.53/1.20)
	id AA25107; Fri, 9 Jan 87 00:05:54 PST
Date: Fri, 9 Jan 87 00:05:54 PST
From: kbh@ucbvax.Berkeley.EDU (P. Ngai)
Message-Id: <8701090805.AA25107@ucbvax.Berkeley.EDU>
To: phil@amdcad.amd.com
Subject: testing
Cc: kiefer@decwrl.dec.com
Status: RO

Does ucbvax do it right? Or will this get routed through
sun like decwrl does?

	Phil Ngai

-- 
 

 Phil Ngai +1 408 749 5720
 UUCP: {ucbvax,decwrl,hplabs,allegra}!amdcad!phil
 ARPA: amdcad!phil@decwrl.dec.com