Relay-Version: version B 2.10 5/3/83; site utzoo.UUCP Path: utzoo!mnetor!seismo!lll-crg!ames!ucbcad!ucbvax!decvax!decwrl!hplabs!cae780!tektronix!teklds!zeus!tekla!dant From: dant@tekla.tek.com (Dan Tilque;1893;92-789;LP=A;60jB) Newsgroups: sci.misc Subject: Re: freshman physics Message-ID: <988@zeus.UUCP> Date: Fri, 12-Dec-86 19:35:49 EST Article-I.D.: zeus.988 Posted: Fri Dec 12 19:35:49 1986 Date-Received: Tue, 16-Dec-86 00:06:23 EST References: <4087@columbia.UUCP> Sender: rogers@zeus.UUCP Reply-To: dant@tekla.tek.com (Dan Tilque) Distribution: na Organization: Tektronix, Inc., Beaverton, OR. Lines: 44 In article <4087@columbia.UUCP> zdenek@heathcliff.columbia.edu.UUCP (Zdenek Radouch) writes: > I write: >>Consider the following thought experiment: >> >> Take 2 identical cars and place them nose to nose. Rig the >> accelerators of both so that you can give equal acceleration >> to each. Now slowly increase the accelerations of the two >> cars. Assuming that there is no slippage of the wheels, the >> cars will remain motionless.... > >Note that if the cars are nose to nose (or as you pointed out motionless) >you cannot "slowly increase the acceleration". They are not moving let alone >accelerating. If there was no slippage of the wheels the engine couldn't run. >You have to take care of conservation of energy even in a thought experiment. >The work output of the engine can't just disappear. The cars are not moving >so the energy delivered by the engine has to go somewhere else. The wheels >must slip but the car will be motionless because the forces are balanced. > >zdenek You're right. I'll change the experiment. Let the two cars bumpers which start to crumple as soon as the accelerator is pushed. The cars will then have very low velocities (like the continental plates I'm comparing them to). The rest of the engines energies go into crumpling the bumpers. My point was that the velocities (and thus kinetic energy) of the cars or continents cannot be used to determine how much crumpling should take place. (I have no doubt that you'll correct me if I'm wrong.) Dan Tilque dant@tekla.tek.com inews fodder inews fodder inews fodder inews fodder inews fodder inews fodder inews fodder inews fodder inews fodder inews fodder