Relay-Version: version B 2.10 5/3/83; site utzoo.UUCP Path: utzoo!mnetor!seismo!rutgers!topaz!christian From: homeier@aero.UUCP Newsgroups: mod.religion.christian Subject: Re: Romans 9 Message-ID: <7385@topaz.RUTGERS.EDU> Date: Sat, 29-Nov-86 07:39:12 EST Article-I.D.: topaz.7385 Posted: Sat Nov 29 07:39:12 1986 Date-Received: Sat, 29-Nov-86 20:55:18 EST Sender: hedrick@topaz.RUTGERS.EDU Organization: Rutgers Univ., New Brunswick, N.J. Lines: 75 Keywords: free will,predestination Approved: christian@topaz.UUCP [... but grace and truth came by Jesus Christ ...] There has been a lot of discussion of what Paul was talking about when he compared man arguing with God to a pot arguing with the potter. I think that we first have to realize something of the disparity that Paul was illustrating here. We are not God. We do not have the intelligence that God has. We do not have the insight and wisdom that God has. We could never design something as delicate and as complex as a leaf, let alone a forest with wildlife, let alone a human being. In all this we need to learn humility, to accept that He is far greater than we are, and that there are some things that God does and is that are beyond our ability to understand and comprehend. I have come to believe that God has many truths that seem to our limited intellects to be contradictory, yet in Him they form a harmonious whole. Free will and predestination are often held by human philosophers to be in conflict, yet I believe that they both reveal God's purpose towards us, but from different viewpoints. Clearly we all have free will, for we all make decisions every day, both good decision and bad decisions, and we find out which they were sooner or later. The fact that we are influenced in our decisions by our background, our friends, and our circumstances in no way takes away our responsibility for our own choices. The most fundamentally important choice any man or woman makes is whether to accept Christ as their Lord and Savior. We are all responsible for this choice, and on this choice rests our eternal destination, whether that is the glories of heaven or the horror of hell. "I call heaven and earth as witnesses today against you, that I have set before you life and death, blessing and cursing; therefore choose life, that both you and your descendants may live." (Deut. 30:19) This views the question of how man is saved from man's perspective, that as far as he can see, he is completely free to choose either alternative. And indeed this is so, that although we may bring up cases of confusion or delusion, many people (including several on this network) have heard all they need to come to Jesus and find forgiveness. But there is another perspective to consider, and that is God's. What I believe Paul is speaking of is how salvation looks to God. God is not surprised when people come to Him for salvation, nor is He anxiously biting His nails waiting to find out what each person will decide. God sees all of time before Him, and knows now what each person's decision will be. And yet He does not use that knowledge to prejudice Himself against any person, but treats every single one the same way, for as the Word says, "God desires that all should repent and come to the knowledge of God." In the end it will be seen that God did not treat unfairly or unjustly any person on earth, but they of their own evil hearts and selfish cruelty cut themselves off from Him and turned to their own way, the way of destruction and death, despite every appeal that their Creator could call out after them. Their hearts became hardened because they decided to harden them, from man's perspective. Their hearts became hardened because God gave them over to a hardened heart, from God's perspective. Both are true, and keeping both in mind brings a balanced understanding of our place. We have a enourmous privilige in our free will, and a tremendous responsibility in correctly submitting our free will to God. At the same time, we need to realize that we do not have God over a barrel, that nothing of what we do is ever out of His hands, that it solely by His grace that we are drawn to respond to Him as we do. It is He who is the Lord of all, and we exercise our free wills under Him and by His grace. As you enter the door into the sanctuary, you notice the word "choice" above the lintel; after passing through, you look up and see the word "chosen". --------------------------------------- Peter Homeier ______ Arpanet: homeier@aerospace / o \_/ UUCP: ..!ihnp4!trwrb!aero!homeier \___)__/ \ The Aerospace Corporation, M1-108 El Segundo, CA 90245 Disclaimer: Anything expressed above is my personal opinion, and not the position of the Aerospace Corporation.