Relay-Version: version B 2.10 5/3/83; site utzoo.UUCP Posting-Version: version B 2.10.2 9/5/84; site ssc-vax.UUCP Path: utzoo!watmath!clyde!burl!ulysses!mhuxr!mhuxt!houxm!vax135!cornell!uw-beaver!fluke!ssc-vax!eder From: eder@ssc-vax.UUCP (Dani Eder) Newsgroups: net.space Subject: Re: Private Space Message-ID: <333@ssc-vax.UUCP> Date: Fri, 1-Nov-85 19:43:09 EST Article-I.D.: ssc-vax.333 Posted: Fri Nov 1 19:43:09 1985 Date-Received: Sun, 3-Nov-85 09:35:15 EST References: <8510291721.AA00286@s1-b.ARPA> Organization: Boeing Aerospace Co., Seattle, WA Lines: 35 > rockets. Two companies are now backed with large amounts of money to develop > private launch vehicles, one of which is a manned vehicle with the intent of > taking tourists into space for two day trips. The scuttlebut is that Soceity > Expeditions has agreed to set up a funding package of up to $280M to back > Pacific American Launch Services (Gary Hudsen) in design and construction of > the reusable VTVL-SSTO Phoenix. Vessel is modular and refuelable, so unlike > the shuttle, it can leave LEO. A Phoenix is projected to cost about the same > as a 747. Completion supposedly by the early 1990's. Maybe you can book a > flight to watch NASA put up it's space station. > > Actually, I don't honestly know how real the funding is. I've been trying to > get hold of Gary to find out, but I haven't gotten a call back yet. I'd also > guess the first flight will be several years late and will cost twice as > much as expected to develop, build and operate. But even then, it will fly > economic circles around anything the turkeys at NASA or DOD are up to. > Having reviewed the Phoenix reference design, I can say several things about it. For a vehicle that has several new technologies in the design (aerospike engine, oxidizer rich combustor, transpiration cooled heat shield), he is carrying a very low weight growth margin . The figure in Hudson's weight statement is about 5% of inert weight (weight without propellant). It should be more like 20%. After proving the new technologies, we estimate it would cost Boeing $2.7 Billion to build a vehicle like the Phoenix, and that the first one off the assembly line would cost about $300 million (3 times a 747). Considering that we can use existing manufacturing and assembly plants, with experienced people , whereas Pacific American would be starting from scratch, I find it doubtful they could build it for less than we can. There might be some advantage in engineering if they go 100% CAD, but on the other hand, we own a CRAY to do number crunching. We don't yet have a keyboard for every engineer, its more like one/three. Dani Eder/Advanced Space Transportation/Boeing/ssc-vax!eder