Relay-Version: version B 2.10 5/3/83; site utzoo.UUCP
Posting-Version: version B 2.10.2 9/18/84 exptools; site iham1.UUCP
Path: utzoo!watmath!clyde!burl!ulysses!mhuxr!mhuxt!houxm!ihnp4!iham1!gjphw
From: gjphw@iham1.UUCP (wyant)
Newsgroups: net.physics,net.research,net.misc
Subject: Re: Newman's Energy Machine (2)
Message-ID: <474@iham1.UUCP>
Date: Tue, 5-Nov-85 11:28:46 EST
Article-I.D.: iham1.474
Posted: Tue Nov  5 11:28:46 1985
Date-Received: Thu, 7-Nov-85 04:28:02 EST
References: <175@tulane.UUCP> <471@iham1.UUCP> <536@talcott.UUCP>
Organization: AT&T Bell Laboratories
Lines: 42
Xref: watmath net.physics:3499 net.research:316 net.misc:8841


    Since this seems to be a juicy new topic, I will go ahead and bite.

 >                                .... since the potential energy stored
 > in something CONTRIBUTES TO ITS RESTMASS.

    It is unclear to me how potential energy contributes to an object's rest
 mass.  All of the cases known to me, small though that may be, show that
 mechanical potential energy is due solely to the location of an object within
 some force field.  Potential energy is due to location and not the mass of an
 object.  Examples include gravitational potential energy (an object above some
 reference level within a gravitational field), electrostatic potential energy
 (a charged object in an electric field), and harmonic or spring potential
 energy (an object away from the equilibrium position of a spring).  Since the
 potential energy, compared to some reference, is due to location, there would
 seem to be no necessity to treat it as part of the rest mass.  This also
 violates my naive concept that the rest mass, like electric charge, is a
 constant property of an object independent of location and velocity.

    Some of the rest mass of the (atomic) nucleus is stored as binding energy
 to overcome the electrostatic or coulomb repulsion.  But this reduces the rest
 mass of the nucleus from its component parts, not increases it.  I remain
 confused...

 > You are evidently thinking of the annihilation of electrons, protons,
 > and neutrons by antimatter.

    Being a mere mortal, I am not knowledgeable of many other mechanisms for
 mass to energy conversion except by mass annihilation (however, if you
 consider potential energy to be stored as part of the rest mass, then other
 means of mass conversion do suggest themselves).  However, you may wish to
 argue either that I am simply unaware of other known mechanisms for mass
 conversion (certainly possible)  or that Mr. Newman has discovered a different
 mechanism (which is not yet recognized).  Another mechanism for converting
 mass into energy is nuclear fusion, but that was not mentioned as being
 utilized in the Newman machine (and the device was primarily composed of
 copper).  Fusion is also accompanied by some energetic radiation.


                             Patrick Wyant
                             AT&T Bell Laboratories (Naperville, IL)
                             *!ihwld!gjphw