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From: fisher@dssdev.DEC (Gerry --- Hopelessly Obscure)
Newsgroups: net.motss
Subject: Celebrating Differences.
Message-ID: <1262@decwrl.UUCP>
Date: Tue, 5-Nov-85 11:22:06 EST
Article-I.D.: decwrl.1262
Posted: Tue Nov  5 11:22:06 1985
Date-Received: Fri, 8-Nov-85 04:41:21 EST
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> What's with this anti-heterosexual kick?  "Any derogatory signs, like
> 'breeder'"?!?

Mark, if you had been following the discussion concerning sign language, you 
would know that there are derogatory signs for gays and lesbians.  
This person was only curious if there were similar signs for straight 
people; she/he was not being anti-heterosexual.  Stop being so defensive!

No, calling straight people names is not the most mature response that
gays and lesbians can muster, but you have to keep in mind that many
straight people are oppressive threats to our health and well-being
(some gay and bisexual people are probably threats to our well-being,
as well). Calling straight people "breeders" is a harmless, childish
way to vent steam. I don't condone it, but worse evils demand my 
attention.


> "Well, they hate me, so I wanna hate them."  How fucking stupid.  What in

If you need to use this kind of language, take it to net.flame where 
it is appropriate.  How stupid?  Probably.  How human?  Definitely!


> Doing so says that homosexuals are not people ... are
> different ... want to be different, want to not fit in ... this isn't
> coming out right, it's simply deriding affecting a pose just because you
> think you should 

Are you referring to effeminacy in gay men?  Are you referring to 
masculine traits in lesbians?  Are you saying that all gays and 
lesbians "pose"?   How can you be so sure if it is a pose or if it is 
actually the way the person was meant to act?  Or, are you opposed to 
gay men acting different from straight men, lesbians acting different 
from straight women?

There is a school of gay thought that says that gay people *are* 
different.  We are the same as straights in our humanity, but different 
in our expression of that humanity.  Since we break societal mating 
norms, we are free to experiment with the male/female role 
models.  Hence, we have formed a distinct gay/lesbian subculture.  You 
can even make a good argument for a gay male subculture distinct from 
a lesbian subculture.

What's the matter, Mark, do our differences bother you?  If you are 
unable to celebrate differences, then you can concentrate on the many 
things that straight people, and gays and lesbians have in common.

> Anyhoo, the whole message is let's stop this differentiation on meaninless
> attributes ... sexual orientation, skin color, drug usage...
 
Gee, if you want to treat everyone the same, why shouldn't we stop the 
differentiation between gay "posers" and "masculine" gay men, between 
"butch" lesbians and "feminine" lesbians.  Why can't we celebrate 
these differences, or will celebrating these differences in gays and 
lesbians cause straight people to question their own male/female role 
models?

Just throwing out a few ideas.  Maybe someone else can take them and 
run with them...


			Gerry Fisher
                        ...decvax!decwrl!dec-rhea!dec-dssdev!fisher
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Nashua, NH: Where the men are men, and the sheep are nervous.