Relay-Version: version B 2.10 5/3/83; site utzoo.UUCP Posting-Version: version B 2.10.3 4.3bsd-beta 6/6/85; site ucbvax.BERKELEY.EDU Path: utzoo!watmath!clyde!burl!ulysses!ucbvax!ucbarpa!fair From: fair@ucbarpa.BERKELEY.EDU (Erik E. &) Newsgroups: net.news,net.news.group,net.flame Subject: Re: Fear and Loathing on the Clouds Message-ID: <10819@ucbvax.BERKELEY.EDU> Date: Sun, 27-Oct-85 14:03:58 EST Article-I.D.: ucbvax.10819 Posted: Sun Oct 27 14:03:58 1985 Date-Received: Mon, 28-Oct-85 04:10:00 EST References: <614@h-sc1.UUCP> <1817@hao.UUCP> <326@pedsgd.UUCP> Sender: usenet@ucbvax.BERKELEY.EDU Organization: University of California at Berkeley Lines: 29 Xref: watmath net.news:4168 net.news.group:4024 net.flame:12521 Let's get something straight: while the USENET has been discussed at BOF meetings at the various USENIX Conferences, there has NEVER been an action taken on the network with out the usual procedure of building consensus on the network itself. One such discussion which received notice was the one regarding the proposed removal of net.general. A vote was taken at the meeting in which the majority of people present were in favor of removal. However, it was put to the network itself in net.news.group thereafter, and the result was that we still have net.general. No UNIX conference (be it EUUG or USENIX or /usr/group) is large enough that it can constitute a quorum of USENET members, and therefore no such meeting can make decisions for the network. The people that you could call the `leading citizens' of the network have always been cognizant of this, and submitted proposals to the network at large, regardless of the outcome of any vote at any specific meeting. As an aside, even if we codified rules for such meetings, there would always be someone feeling disenfranchised because they didn't get their two cents in; this has been my personal observation of several cooperative and volunteer organizations over the last five years. On the other hand, if people don't pay attention to the designated newsgroup for meta-discussions of the network (e.g. net.news.group), then they have only themselves to blame for the state of the network as a whole. Erik E. Fair ucbvax!fair fair@ucbarpa.BERKELEY.EDU