Relay-Version: version B 2.10 5/3/83; site utzoo.UUCP Posting-Version: version B 2.10.2 9/18/84; site watdcsu.UUCP Path: utzoo!linus!philabs!cmcl2!seismo!lll-crg!ucdavis!ucbvax!decvax!tektronix!uw-beaver!cornell!vax135!houxm!mhuxt!mhuxr!ulysses!burl!clyde!watmath!watnot!watdcsu!dmcanzi From: dmcanzi@watdcsu.UUCP (David Canzi) Newsgroups: net.religion,net.philosophy Subject: Re: God, Goedel, Wittgenstein Message-ID: <1791@watdcsu.UUCP> Date: Fri, 25-Oct-85 04:29:09 EST Article-I.D.: watdcsu.1791 Posted: Fri Oct 25 04:29:09 1985 Date-Received: Thu, 31-Oct-85 21:30:27 EST References: <10673@ucbvax.ARPA> <1744@akgua.UUCP> <788@cybvax0.UUCP> <613@spar.UUCP> Reply-To: dmcanzi@watdcsu.UUCP (David Canzi) Organization: U of Waterloo, Ontario Lines: 24 Xref: linus net.religion:7677 net.philosophy:2672 In article <613@spar.UUCP> ellis@spar.UUCP (Michael Ellis) writes: > I think Bob's notion of God as representing a higher level of truth than > can be verified within the system is very close to what mystics have > been saying for a long time. Mike, your objection is totally losing. A > `higher truth' that includes all truths perceivable from within a system > as well as those only perceivable from without IS TOTALLY logical. I have posted, separately, a proof that there is at least one true statement that God doesn't know. > Revelation is the only way to percieve a `higher truth' -- one that is > not observable from the axioms yet established. Normative assertions > (eg- It is wrong to gain enjoyment from the suffering of others), which > are required to establish ethics, are mundane examples of such `higher > truths'. They cannot be established from a logical empirical basis. "Ethics" is a word we use to describe a process in which humans evaluate the actions of themselves and others. Given that the human being performing these evaluations is a physical system, ethical evaluation is a physical activity. Rather than something "revealed", I think ethics is a matter of neural "wiring" and past experience. (Hardware & software, if you prefer.) -- David Canzi "Permission is not freedom."