Relay-Version: version B 2.10 5/3/83; site utzoo.UUCP
Posting-Version: version B 2.10.2 9/18/84; site peora.UUCP
Path: utzoo!linus!philabs!cmcl2!seismo!lll-crg!dual!qantel!ihnp4!drutx!mtuxo!mtunh!mtung!mtunf!ariel!vax135!petsd!peora!jer
From: jer@peora.UUCP (J. Eric Roskos)
Newsgroups: net.singles
Subject: Dogs for defense against attackers
Message-ID: <1453@peora.UUCP>
Date: Thu, 8-Aug-85 10:05:49 EDT
Article-I.D.: peora.1453
Posted: Thu Aug  8 10:05:49 1985
Date-Received: Tue, 13-Aug-85 01:06:09 EDT
References: <597@wdl1.UUCP>
Organization: Perkin-Elmer SDC, Orlando, Fl.
Lines: 63

>       I learned how to do this late in life, when training an enormous
> black horse (a Percheron) as a riding animal.  This monster had a strong
> personality and bucked off several riders, but by refusing to back down when
> he challenged me and being more stubborn than he was, I was able to make him
> obey me.  Since facing down that sixteen hundred pound beast, people just
> don't seem intimidating any more.

This story reminds me of something that used to bother me a great deal, and
of an anecdote related to it; while it has nothing to do with the current
discussions, I can see that it might well provoke some new discussion,
eventhough I am not entirely sure of the point of the story.

Before I came to Orlando, I lived in a downtown, very urban area of Nashville,
TN.  This area had many single college students living in it, including many
single women.  There was also a fairly high crime rate (I eventually moved
from there due to that, in fact).

Many of these women, in order to defend themselves from potential attackers,
would bring very large dogs with them whenever they would go out anywhere.

Now, this in itself is no problem; it seems like a good idea to me.
However, I observed that some of these women would NOT keep their dogs on a
leash, and some would even seem to take great satisfaction in the fact that
they would go rushing up barking at any solitary male person who happened
to have the audacity to walk on the same sidewalk as them.  This always
annoyed me, since I have always felt bad to observe that the state of
society exists in which I cannot go walking alone without women acting like
I am a criminal, crossing the street to avoid me, acting nervous, etc.,
especially since I tend to be very reserved, and thus don't often even
speak to people if I am thinking about something else, thus not appearing
as much of a threat to any observant person at all.  And because I don't
like people letting their dogs loose to bark at me.

However, I discovered rather quickly (having lived with very large dogs
most of my life until I went away to college) that these big dogs, like
most dogs I had known, were basically afraid of strangers!  You could point
your finger at them, and yell "you keep quiet!", and they would cringe and
hide behind the person they were supposed to be protecting!  I only did
this once or twice, with particularly threatening dogs, but it was
interesting to observe the reaction of the dog's owner, since they both
seemed to feel that the dog was serving a useful purpose by barking at me
in that way, and that it had revealed some major shortcoming by hiding when
pointed at. (Note: you have to beware, when confronted by a hostile dog,
since some dogs will bite you if you point at them; it depends on the
personality of the dog.  Also, dogs frightened in this manner tend to want
to get back at you if you turn your back on them.  Thus, I don't recommend
doing such a thing, unless you are in a confrontational situation with a
hostile dog.)

I am not sure what the moral of this story is; it just seems to involve a lot
of complex, interesting, and in some ways worrisome issues.  The most
superficial point, I guess, is that I think it is not good to let dogs
run around loose to defend you; it works just as well to keep them on a
leash (if an attacker gets close to you he will obviously have to get in
range of the leash, and also you can let go of it).  But another point is
that, considering the nature of dogs, I wonder if it is good to rely on them
that much.  (I do think, though, that a loyal dog will defend the person
who cares for him/her if that person is actually being attacked.)
-- 
Shyy-Anzr:  J. Eric Roskos
UUCP:       ..!{decvax,ucbvax,ihnp4}!vax135!petsd!peora!jer
US Mail:    MS 795; Perkin-Elmer SDC;
	    2486 Sand Lake Road, Orlando, FL 32809-7642