Relay-Version: version B 2.10 5/3/83; site utzoo.UUCP
Posting-Version: version B 2.10.3 alpha 5/22/85; site cbosgd.UUCP
Path: utzoo!linus!gatech!cbosgd!mark
From: mark@cbosgd.UUCP (Mark Horton)
Newsgroups: net.micro.att
Subject: Re: Re: instability in Berkeley versus AT&T releases
Message-ID: <1379@cbosgd.UUCP>
Date: Thu, 8-Aug-85 21:22:50 EDT
Article-I.D.: cbosgd.1379
Posted: Thu Aug  8 21:22:50 1985
Date-Received: Sun, 11-Aug-85 06:25:55 EDT
References: <521@osu-eddie.UUCP>
Followup-To: mod.unix
Organization: AT&T Bell Laboratories, Columbus, Oh
Lines: 53

In article <521@osu-eddie.UUCP> cbrma!kk@osu-eddie.UUCP writes:

Sheesh!  What does all this have to do with AT&T micros?
Can't we move this discussion to, say, mod.unix?

>the obvious case in point is that Mark Horton works (lives?) somewhere on the
>next floor down, and his department works primarily with BSD, I guess; knock
>off a dozen processors for those VAXen and SUNs,

Lest anyone get the wrong impression, we have only 4 4.2BSD machines in
our dept - one VAX, one Sun fileserver, and two Sun workstations.  The
rest of the machines mostly run System V (except for a Masscomp which is
SIII derived, two SIII based HP machines, and a 6300 that runs Xenix.)
Our project is committed to System V too.

And strangely enough, I do go home a lot.  Sometimes I get more work
done from home than my office (and sometimes vice versa.)  I can produce
a lot nicer environment in my office at home than AT&T provides there.
(Haven't figured out how to take my Sun workstation home yet, though.)

>I just want to question the
>statement that most UNICES are V7-derived.  This is basically
>numbers-juggling, since the complaint is based on `most UNICES.'

Well, I could probably say just about anything here and produce a
statistic to back it up.

In terms of pure numbers, my understanding is that over half of the
UNIX systems in the world today run Xenix.  Since Xenix is V7
derived (with lots of System III and V stuff added in later) it
can be reasonably said that ``most unices are V7-derived''
However, most Xenix machines are micros or even PC's, so this
number can be misleading.  Most of these machines don't connect
into the net as we see it.  (Whether such connection matters is
no doubt part of your definition of "real world", which is certainly
subject to some creative wording.)

Another way of looking at it is this.  Of about 2500 known machines
on the UUCP network (not counting the various machines that we've just
"heard of" but don't really know anything about), about half of them
are owned by AT&T, and about half are in the outside world.  And it's
certainly true that most of AT&T has System V colored glasses on
(internally it isn't even called System V, it's called "Standard UNIX",
at least when spoken this is the term I usually hear.)  There are a few
pockets of 4.2BSD, but even these pockets tend to have lots of System V
machines around too.  So, assuming there are even a few System V machines
outside AT&T, if you count the machines that are well enough known to
be on UUCP, System V would win (and System V is NOT V7-derived.)  Note
that the typical 3B2 or UNIX PC or Xenix machine is NOT on the map,
and believe me, there are gobs and gobs of them up and down the halls
(not to mention the 6300's that people use as terminals.)

	Mark Horton