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From: hollombe@ttidcc.UUCP (The Polymath)
Newsgroups: net.singles
Subject: Re: self-actualization
Message-ID: <671@ttidcc.UUCP>
Date: Tue, 13-Aug-85 15:07:28 EDT
Article-I.D.: ttidcc.671
Posted: Tue Aug 13 15:07:28 1985
Date-Received: Wed, 14-Aug-85 23:46:37 EDT
References: <1744@reed.UUCP> <621@ttidcc.UUCP> <1680@hao.UUCP> <313@tove.UUCP> <1690@hao.UUCP>
Reply-To: hollombe@ttidcc.UUCP (The Polymath)
Organization: The Cat Factory
Lines: 105
Summary: 

In article <1690@hao.UUCP> woods@hao.UUCP (Greg Woods) writes:
>> >... The Lifespring course, and other awareness training courses, are
>> >designed for people whose lives basically work, but somehow know they
>> >could have it better than they do ...
>> 
>> So is therapy.
>
>  That's not what I learned when I was a Psych major in college. Therapy is
>for treating things defined as "disorders" or, in extreme cases, "diseases".

I don't know when or where you were a Psych major, but, as of 5  years  ago
at  least,  this  idea  was  considered  old fashioned at best and outright
counter-productive at worst. (5 years ago is when I completed  my  Master's
in Community/Clinical Psychology at CSU, Northridge).

"Personal growth" is a very common reason for seeing a therapist.  One need
not be suicidally depressed or murderously paranoid to want to explore past
the boundaries of one's everyday thought patterns.  Such exploration  can't
be  done  in  a room with several hundred other people, though small groups
can be useful.

In fact, it is the seminars like est and Lifespring that  explicitly  offer
to show people how to make their lives better (with the implicit assumption
that their lives need improving or they wouldn't be there).

> To each their own. If therapy works for them, great. A lot of it, of course,
>has to do with your expectations. If you expect therapy to work for you,
>then it probably will, no matter what your "problem" is. 

Sadly, not true.  Many people enter therapy with  unrealistic  expectations
of  what  it  "should"  be  like  and  what they're going to get out of it.
Usually one of the first things a therapist has  to  do  is  educate  their
client  as  to  what therapy really is and how the process works.  A lot of
people quit right then or shortly thereafter when they find out the kind of
hard, painfull work they're expected to do.

>> In my opinion, many people go into groups like Lifespring with expectations
>> of achieving some of the growth that they might achieve in therapy--but with
>> hopes of avoiding the stigma that some people (apparently including you!)
>> associate with therapy.  
>
>  Expectations, expectations. Much pain in this world is caused by comparing
>expectations to reality. It is this comparison that causes the damage, not
>Lifespring or bad therapists....

I think this is the Lifespring "line" as  it  were.  I'm  not  saying  it's
right  or  wrong, but you might at least label it as such, given the nature
of the discussion.

>I associate no stigma with therapy. Being sick happens to all of us
>and is not a "bad" thing, whether physical or psychological in origin. It is
>a fact of life that illness happens.

See my remarks about personal growth therapy.  The concept that anyone  who
needs or wants therapy must be "sick" stems from the obsolete medical model
of psychotherapy.  By labeling someone "sick" because  they're  in  therapy
you let them in for all kinds of social stigma even if you personally claim
not to attatch any. (The very fact that you refer to such people as  "sick"
would  seem  to indicate otherwise).  There is also the implicit assumption
that the  therapist  is  responsible  for  "curing"  the  client  of  their
"sickness",  just  as  medical  doctors are responsible for their patients'
cures.  This gives a completely false picture of  how  psychotherapy  works
and leads to unrealistic expectations and disappointment.

>In the case of Lifespring, there is no "advertising" at all, except through
>word-of-mouth from those who graduated from the course and felt that it was
>sufficiently valuable for them that they want to encourage those they care
>about to have that experience too.

I haven't come across any advertisments for Lifespring that  I  recall.  On
the   other   hand  est  used  to  advertise  fairly  extensively  and  the
Scientologists have been known to  stand  on  street  corners  and,  almost
literally,  drag  people  in  their  door for an introductory session (they
tried this on me several times).

>                                     ... I'm sure some people (particularly
>those who have strong negative beliefs about awareness trainings) would not
>get much out of a Lifespring-like course. But *I* happen to know lots
>of people who benefitted more from Lifespring than they did from previous
>therapy, so it just goes to show that it can go either way depending on the
>person.

All very true.  In fact, some people go into  such  courses  with  negative
attitudes  and  derive  benefits  anyway.  Different  people have different
needs.  I can think of very few people to whom I'd recommend  the  kind  of
therapy  I've  been  through (a mixture of Neo-reichian and Perls Gestalt).
It did me a lot of good, but I also  saw  some  people  run  out  of  group
sessions  because  they  couldn't  tolerate  the  levels  of  emotion being
expressed by others.  Some people can't even handle a few  gentle  Rogerian
sessions.  Others  have turned their lives around after attending an est or
Lifespring weekend.  There are many paths up the mountain.

To get back to what started this whole discussion, several articles ago,  I
don't necessarily disapprove of Lifespring per se.  My disapproval is aimed
at  those  programs  which  do  little  or  no  screening  and/or  have  no
professional  staff  standing  by  to  handle psychological emergencies.  I
don't know whether Lifespring is one of these or not.

-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_
The Polymath (aka: Jerry Hollombe)
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