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From: padraig@utastro.UUCP (Padraig Houlahan)
Newsgroups: net.origins
Subject: Re: The Scientific Case for Creation: (Part 45)
Message-ID: <348@utastro.UUCP>
Date: Sat, 13-Jul-85 10:58:49 EDT
Article-I.D.: utastro.348
Posted: Sat Jul 13 10:58:49 1985
Date-Received: Mon, 15-Jul-85 02:15:42 EDT
References: <403@iham1.UUCP> <799@sphinx.UChicago.UUCP>
Organization: U. Texas, Astronomy, Austin, TX
Lines: 46

> From: rck@iham1.UUCP (Ron Kukuk), Message-ID: <403@iham1.UUCP>:
> >       86.  Stars  that  are  moving  in   the   same   direction   at
> >            significantly   different   speeds  frequently  travel  in
> >            closely-spaced clusters [a]. This would not be the case if
> >            they had been traveling for billions of years because even
> >            the slightest difference in their velocities  would  cause
> >            their  dispersal after such great periods of time. Similar
> >            observations have been made of galaxy and of galaxy-quasar
> >            combinations   that   apparently   have  vastly  different
> >            velocities but which appear to be connected [b-d].
> 
> Cars travelling on interstates in the same direction at significantly
> different speeds tend to travel in closely-space clusters.  This would not
> be the case if they had been travelling for hundreds of miles because even
> the slightest difference in their velocities would cause their dispersal
> after such great periods of time/distance.  Obviously the cars have only
> been travelling a few minutes.
> 
> --JB                                 All we learn from history is that
>                                        we learn nothing from history.

Here are the ages of some clusters in our galaxy:

cluster       age( 1,000,000 yrs)

IC348         <  1
IC2994           1
NGC3572          1.3
M21              3
IC2395           4
M7              40
M23            160
NGC2300      1,200
NGC188      11,000

The point of all this is to emphasize that clusters do exist,  and 
are not just random associations, although such associations do exist. 
Furthermore, Ron's assertion
is falsified by the existence of the last two on the list. The quaser
problem rests on subjective interpretation as to whether galaxies
are indeed close together, and not just on the same line of sight.
Because the claim flies in the face of experiment and consistent
observations, the general consensus is that more evidence, that is not
subjective, needs to be gathered to counter the evidence against the claim.

Padraig Houlahan.