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From: tan@ihlpg.UUCP (Bill Tanenbaum - AT&T Bell Labs - Naperville IL)
Newsgroups: net.women,net.politics,net.social
Subject: Re: Discrimination against women (and teaching's rewards)
Message-ID: <706@ihlpg.UUCP>
Date: Tue, 25-Jun-85 14:09:55 EDT
Article-I.D.: ihlpg.706
Posted: Tue Jun 25 14:09:55 1985
Date-Received: Wed, 26-Jun-85 07:24:33 EDT
References: <482@ttidcc.UUCP> <8203@ucbvax.ARPA>  <457@unc.UUCP> <278@mss.UUCP>
Organization: AT&T Bell Laboratories
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Xref: watmath net.women:6080 net.politics:9581 net.social:737

>> is Frank Silbermann
> is Jim Jenal

> >One other factor is that women tend to choose occupations with greater
> >NONMONETARY benefits which may compensate for the lower pay scales.  That is,
> >women more often choose occupations which center around helping other people
> >and cooperating with them (TEACHER, nurse, secretary, social worker).
> >The direct gratitude from the helpee satisfies some of the woman's social
> >needs.
> >
> >Men more often find themselves in occupations which either isolate them
> >from other people, or pits them in anxiety-provoking competition.
> >Some of these higher paying "men's jobs" are dirty and dangerous as well.
> >
> >The fallacy of the equal-pay-for-equal-work idea is that it compares
> >only the paychecks and level of skill and training required.  If we do not
> >also factor in the safety, pleasantness, and emotional effects of the job,
> >then this plan is likely to create more unfairness than it rectifies.
> >
> >	Frank Silbermann
------begin Jenal
> 
> As a former MTS at Bell Labs and now a veteran of 3 years of teaching at
> the high school level I would have to disagree with the above statements.
> While it may be true that some women do choose occupations such as teaching
> out of a desire to help others, it is wishful thinking on the part of society
> to think that such desires are compensation for the extremely hard work
> involved in such careers.
> 
>  (several more paragraphs about teaching hardships and meager earnings)
> 
> Of course the bottom line for me is that I love teaching and I do derive
> much greater satisfaction from what I am doing now.  But I believe that
> what I am doing now is also of much greater value to society as a whole and
> I think that it is wrong for society to take advantage of the dedication of
> its teachers.  The imbalance between the work required and the compensation
> provided is one reason why so many teachers feel taken for granted, burnout,
> and quit - a situation that society really cannot afford.
> 	Jim Jenal		(aka ...!scgvaxd!mss!jpj)
> 	Mayfield Senior School	( "  ...!ihnp4!mss!jpj)
------------------------------------------------
Begin Tanenbaum:
Jim Jenal is certainly correct in everything he says about teaching.  I too
am a Bell Labs MTS and my wife is a high school math teacher.  When she
was working full time she worked much harder than me for much less money.
However, I think all this just confirms Silbermann's point, i.e., that the
non-monetary compensations of teaching and other "helping" professions
appeal to many women (and some men too, but alas fewer).
However, for the teaching profession, this appeal has been weakening, and
shortages of qualified teachers are fast approaching (and already here in
some subjects).  As shortages worsen, there should be a strong upward pressure
on salaries.
My feelings on comparative worth are that it would be a disaster if it were
imposed on the private sector by government, as some are advocating.  The
idea of government setting relative wage scales for private industry ought
to send shudders through anyone who thinks through the implications.  (I know
about the minimum wage, but thats a separate issue.)   For the government
to adopt comparative worth for its own employees is not so bad; however,
wages should not get too out of line with prevailing private wages.
However, I strongly applaud the collective efforts of teachers, nurses,
and other underpaid workers to get higher pay via political lobbying,
strikes, etc.  That, after all, is the American way. (1/2 -) )
					Bill Tanenbaum
-- 
Bill Tanenbaum - AT&T Bell Labs - Naperville IL  ihnp4!ihlpg!tan