Relay-Version: version B 2.10 5/3/83; site utzoo.UUCP Posting-Version: version B 2.10.1 6/24/83 v7 ucbtopaz-1.8; site ucbtopaz.CC.Berkeley.ARPA Path: utzoo!watmath!clyde!burl!ulysses!allegra!mit-eddie!genrad!decvax!ucbvax!ucbtopaz!mwm From: mwm@ucbtopaz.CC.Berkeley.ARPA Newsgroups: net.lang Subject: Re: Good Things About BASIC Message-ID: <779@ucbtopaz.CC.Berkeley.ARPA> Date: Fri, 1-Mar-85 05:26:12 EST Article-I.D.: ucbtopaz.779 Posted: Fri Mar 1 05:26:12 1985 Date-Received: Sun, 3-Mar-85 03:37:58 EST References: <401@vax2.fluke.UUCP> Reply-To: mwm@ucbtopaz.UUCP (Praiser of Bob) Organization: Missionaria Phonibalonica Lines: 35 Summary: ["LISP is a local optimum in the space of programming languages."] In article <401@vax2.fluke.UUCP> kurt@fluke.UUCP (Kurt Guntheroth) writes: >BASIC is a USEFUL >LANGUAGE TO SOLVE CERTAIN IMPORTANT CLASSES OF PROBLEMS and anybody who >categorically refuses to recognize its usefulness has condemned themselves >to a life of working too hard on that class of problems. (Or else is one of >the lucky few who has at his disposal one of the tools which is actually >better than BASIC for such tasks.) Since I'm one of the people "categorically" refusing to recognize BASICs usefulness, I'll reply. First, *any* language is useful to solve certain classes of problems (otherwise, why build the thing in the first place?). If BASIC appears to be the best available tool to solve a specific problem I'll use it. That just doesn't happen very often anymore. What I've said (repeatedly) is that "There is no class of problems for which ANSI Minimal BASIC is the best tool." Maybe that's because I'm "one of the lucky few" you mention. Nearly every system I've worked on for the last five years has had a C compiler and a small LISP system. Those, plus a programmable calculator program of some sort (CALC, bc, or a spreadsheet) are better tools than BASIC over an incredible range of problem classes. Now, at this point I probably ought to bringup the old "higher-level" argument. A programming language as a tool is "better" than another only to the degree that it mimics your thoughts about the problem at hand. Since I tend to think in terms of recursion, small routines and structured programming constructs, translating solutions into BASIC is a burden. If you think in terms of sequences of simple operations and transfer of control, this is probably not true. So I get to amend my statement to: "For me, there exists no class of problems for which BASIC is the best tool."