Relay-Version: version B 2.10 5/3/83; site utzoo.UUCP Posting-Version: version B 2.10 5/3/83; site utzoo.UUCP Path: utzoo!laura From: laura@utzoo.UUCP (Laura Creighton) Newsgroups: net.religion Subject: Re: Different sets of assumptions - response to Laura Message-ID: <5176@utzoo.UUCP> Date: Wed, 6-Mar-85 11:41:17 EST Article-I.D.: utzoo.5176 Posted: Wed Mar 6 11:41:17 1985 Date-Received: Wed, 6-Mar-85 11:41:17 EST References: <589@pyuxd.UUCP> <5135@utzoo.UUCP>, <617@pyuxd.UUCP> Organization: U of Toronto Zoology Lines: 39 Rich, your personal definition of ``religion'' implies a worship of a deity, and your personal definition of ``worship'' implies the existence of a deity -- or deities, I suppose. Unfortunately, you are in Humpty Dumpty mode again. Everybody else (yes, I am sure you could drag up people who agree with you, that wasn't meant to be taken literally) just doesn't use words that way. This definition of religon is true for Judaism, Christianity and Islam -- though I know Gnostics who consider themselves Christian and who don't ``worship God'' (according to them, Jesus was *not* God, and worshipping the Demiurge [sp?] is a mistake) (as opposed to the Yezidees who have a similar world view and who are proclaimed Satanists) and I am not sure how to characterise Sufism. You seem to have left out Hinduism (though some Hindus do ``worship'' as you understand the term) Buddhism, Taoism, and a great many ``primative religions'' found in Malasia, Africa, and the Americas. The european pagan tradition (assuming that you believe that there was one, and that it is connected to current paganism, the point being hotly debated in anthropological circles today) would be very divided into worshippers and non-worshippers by your standard -- all depending on what and how one takes to be symbols. That is a lot of people who consider themsleves ``religious'' and who have designed ceremonies, and build statues, frescos and temples and in general gathered together to express a common belief and practice which they considered religious whom you are not recognising. Why must we all adopt your definitions? It seems that you are only willing to discuss what are called ``Judeao-Christian religions'' (the authority centred, God creator ones) and, at that, I can't remember you discussing Islam ever, or Judaism much. If what you want to discuss is Christianity, then, you are in the wrong newsgroup, even if ``religion'' is synonymous with ``christianity'' to you. Laura Creighton utzoo!laura