Relay-Version: version B 2.10 5/3/83; site utzoo.UUCP Posting-Version: version B 2.10.1 6/24/83 v7 ucbtopaz-1.8; site ucbtopaz.CC.Berkeley.ARPA Path: utzoo!watmath!clyde!burl!ulysses!allegra!bellcore!decvax!ucbvax!ucbtopaz!mwm From: mwm@ucbtopaz.CC.Berkeley.ARPA Newsgroups: net.politics Subject: Re: Re: More on justice Message-ID: <656@ucbtopaz.CC.Berkeley.ARPA> Date: Thu, 17-Jan-85 14:55:41 EST Article-I.D.: ucbtopaz.656 Posted: Thu Jan 17 14:55:41 1985 Date-Received: Sun, 20-Jan-85 04:41:35 EST References: <283@gargoyle.UChicago.UUCP> <1175@ut-ngp.UUCP> <671@bunker.UUCP> Reply-To: mwm@ucbtopaz.UUCP (Mike Meyer) Organization: Univ. of Calif., Berkeley CA USA Lines: 31 In article <671@bunker.UUCP> garys@bunker.UUCP (Gary M. Samuelson) writes: [Definitions deleted - mwm] >I think that "depriving the rightful owner" is synonomous with >"without authority." > >Therefore, taxation is not theft; the question remains, however, >is what the government does taxation or theft? I.e., does the >government have the authority to levy taxes? (Answers of the >form, "no, because taxation IS theft" are question-begging.) It all becomes crystal clear now: Taxation is not theft, because it's being done by the government. The same actions, taken for the same reasons, by somebody other than the government, would be theft. Looks like you're begging the question just a bit, too. >Does the government have any responsibilities which require >funding to discharge? Or, are all of the responsibilities of >the government contingent on someone's willingness and ability >to finance it? I think you found the nub. To rewrite it, if you think that the government has the right to tax people, then taxation isn't theft. Likewise, if you don't think it has that right, then taxation is theft. I'll duck the question from now on, and just say that theft is taxation. Now, if you think that the government has the right to tax you, are you going to argue with it's right to spend the money as the duly elected officials decree? Such things as the SDI, more missiles, enforced discrimination, 100% retirement pay for some federal employees, etc?