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From: nxs@fluke.UUCP (Bruce Golub)
Newsgroups: net.flame
Subject: Re: Flame Broiled Veal
Message-ID: <503@tpvax.fluke.UUCP>
Date: Tue, 15-Jan-85 13:53:12 EST
Article-I.D.: tpvax.503
Posted: Tue Jan 15 13:53:12 1985
Date-Received: Fri, 18-Jan-85 01:35:36 EST
References: <139@gcc-opus.ARPA> <878@ihuxx.UUCP> <168@harvard.ARPA> <384@mhuxt.UUCP>
Organization: John Fluke Mfg. Co., Inc., Everett, WA
Lines: 94

> > Parkway through New Jersey and New York, I saw a group of 3 cars coming
> > back from a hunting trip.  Now I eat meat, and it doesn't offend me to
> > think of people hunting for food, but these men were obviously not
> > starving to death, so I assume they were hunting for sport.  Between
> 
> In other words, nobody who isn't starving could possibly be hunting for food.
> (Did you know that a mature deer will yield ~35-45 lbs of venison?  Worth
> at least 75 to 80 dollars in terms of meat these men won't have to buy from
> the grocery store.)

  Do you know that the average hunter spends $150 to $250 on a typical
  hunting trip. (Source: My brother works as a hunters guide). Do you know
  that the average hunter eats one or two steaks from the kill, usually
  giving the rest away. And by the way, bears are not a good source of food
  since most of the meat is too tough (ahh... but not for macho men).

> 
> > them they had a total of 6 bucks and 2 bears tied onto their cars.  With
> > dead, open eyes staring at me.  I have not been as offended as I was
> 
> Maybe they should have closed the eyes?

  Maybe they should have stayed home and watched football.

> 
> > then in a long time.  First of all, I was disgusted with these men,
> > looking so smug and proud of themselves for killing eight wild animals.
> 
> You were able to tell how proud and smug they were just by driving by?  You
> must be an extremely perceptive individual.  (and why shouldn't they be 
> proud?  Only about one hunter in 10 manages to get a buck at all, and far
> fewer than that are successful in bear season.)

  There are few reasons why hunters hunt these days. About 1% really hunt to
  suppliment their diet. (Another 30% may eat the meat they kill but it is
  not cost effective.) The majority to it for sport. Sport? You call
  standing around a camper drinking beer and waiting for a stupid deer to
  wonder into a clear-cut so you can it then with a high-powered rifle from
  1/2 mile away sport, then yes.  

  Most hunters that my brother has met do it for the sole reason that they
  want to KILL something (this is why many hunters shoot each other).

> 
> > Very macho.  I was not impressed.  Second of all, why should I have to
> 
> I'm sure that they're very disappointed that they didn't manage to impress
> you.  That was probably their entire goal.

  In a way, yes.
> 
> > look at these dead animals, tied onto the trunk of someone's car?  At
> > the very least they could have covered them.  But WHY DID THEY KILL THEM
> 
> But these men had never heard of you, let alone heard of the fact that you 
> were offended by the sight of unprocessed food.  How could you expect them
> to know that they would meet you that day?
> 

  Like I said, it is not unprocessed food that is annoying, it is the
  flagrant killing of an animal for SPORT.

> > IN THE FIRST PLACE?
> 
> Maybe for food?  No, I guess you've already proved that non-starving people
> have no use for food.
> 
> > a hypocrite (but you eat meat!). I eat beef, I eat chicken, I eat pork
> > on occasion.  Those animals were raised for food.  Deer were not raised
> > for food.  I don't have any ultra-moral mentality, but I can't see any
> > reason for killing these animals (argument #2: there are too many deer.
> > That's because we go around killing their natural predators.  Is this
> > right either?)
> 
> Did you know that animals which are raised for food are no less alive, no
> less able to feel pain, etc. as wild animals?  Why is it that you feel that
> it is alright to eat domesticated animals and not wild ones?
>    As far as us going around killing their natural predators,  sorry you're
> wrong.  We don't.  Our ancestors did, however.  (the predators had a nasty
> habit of killing domesticated animals instead of wild ones.)  Since the
> predators are gone, I guess that you are advocating letting all of those
> deer die of disease and starvation.  Grizzly Adams would be proud of you.
> 
> Jeff Sonntag

Why, you ask, is it all right to kill animals who have been raised for food
bu not wild animals? This question is almost to ridiculous to answer.
Because one is raised for food and the other is not. Really now, you can
raise crops in your own backyard and reap the harvast, but you can not go
into a National Forest or wilderness area and start cutting down trees or
wild plants for your cupboards. Yet they (the National Parks Dept.) allow
hunters to parade around with lethal weapons, plucking up every moving and
breathing life-form and they call it sport.

Bruce Golub