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From: hollombe@ttidcc.UUCP (Jerry Hollombe)
Newsgroups: net.suicide
Subject: RE: Re: Is suicide an attempt of murder?
Message-ID: <188@ttidcc.UUCP>
Date: Wed, 16-Jan-85 17:35:29 EST
Article-I.D.: ttidcc.188
Posted: Wed Jan 16 17:35:29 1985
Date-Received: Sun, 20-Jan-85 05:36:03 EST
Organization: TTI, Santa Monica, CA.
Lines: 52

>From: mjc@cmu-cs-cad.ARPA (Monica Cellio)
>Subject: Re: Is suicide an attempt of murder?
>Message-ID: <239@cmu-cs-cad.ARPA>
>
>                Of course, on a wider scale a would-be suicide loses anyway,
>since it is trivial to get that person locked up for a long, long time.
>
>I've known quite a few people who have attempted to kill themselves (all in
>the U.S.), and none of them was ever prosecuted.  On the other hand, many
>were committed, which is probably worse.  At least prison guards can't say,
>"I think we'll keep you here a while longer."  Doctors can, and it takes the
>cooperation of someone on the outside to beat the system.  (Ever try to call
>the ACLU from inside a mental hospital?)  While things are not on the order
>of "One Flew Over the Cuckoo's Nest", they aren't real good and there is
>plenty of room for improvement in the system.  It is still a form of
>punishment much more than it is a form of rehabilitation, though.

While I can't  speak  for  the  rest  of  the  country,  the  situation  in
California  is  quite different.  One of our biggest problems when I worked
at the LASPC was how to get a suicidal person IN to a mental hospital.

Here, IF you can demonstrate a person is a  clear  and  present  danger  to
themselves  (or  others)  you  can PROBABLY get them put on a 72 hour hold.
(That's three working days -- worst  case  could  be  7  actual  days  over
Thanksgiving  week).  Beyond that the hospital staff has to go to court and
demonstrate that the person is still a danger in order to keep them another
two  weeks.  The patient must be represented by counsel at this hearing and
be advised of their rights.  After those two weeks, and every three  months
thereafter  the  hospital  has  to  go  to  court AGAIN to keep the patient
another three months.  Every time,  the  patient  must  be  represented  by
counsel and advised of their rights.  Bedspace and funding being very tight,
hospitals aren't willing to go to this kind of trouble in most cases.

As for calling the ACLU, most  wards  have  pay-phones  accessible  to  the
patients.  I  know  of  at least one case where a woman convinced the local
Sherriff's Department and Fire Department paramedics to come and rescue her
while  she  was  an  in-patient  at one of the local hospitals (lots of red
faces over that one).  She used to call the LASPC from there all the time.

I don't know how this situation compares to other places  in  the  country,
but at least things aren't always as bad as the movies make them out to be.

-- 
==============================================================================
   ... sitting in a pile of junk on the runway, wondering what happened ...

The Polymath (Jerry Hollombe)
Citicorp TTI                               If thy CRT offend thee, pluck
3100 Ocean Park Blvd.                      it out and cast it from thee.
Santa Monica, California  90405
(213) 450-9111, ext. 2483
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