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From: gjk@talcott.UUCP (Greg Kuperberg)
Newsgroups: net.flame
Subject: Re: Re: Gaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaah!!!
Message-ID: <223@talcott.UUCP>
Date: Thu, 10-Jan-85 18:53:50 EST
Article-I.D.: talcott.223
Posted: Thu Jan 10 18:53:50 1985
Date-Received: Mon, 14-Jan-85 00:37:16 EST
References: <118@decwrl.UUCP>, <210@talcott.UUCP>, <704@hou2h.UUCP> <158@abnji.UUCP>
Organization: Harvard
Lines: 33

> >Lets talk about the guy he paralyzed.
> >Would he have ever contributed positively to society ?
> >Do you normally walk around with sharpened screwdrivers ?
> >I think he should have killed all 4. People (People ?) will then think
> >	twice before mugging, killing, raping .....
> >
> >Next, Why don't the 4 have jobs ? What were they doing on the subway
> >at that time ? 
> 
> Good point.  Why don't they have jobs?  Why has the education system
> failed them?  Could it be that society hasn't given them the advantages
> it gives us?  Could it be that they see that as the only way they can get
> money?  If we were to stop thinking about punishing criminals and start
> thinking about preventing crime by making in unecessary, we will finally
> be able to call ourselves civilized.  Until then...

I have seen with my own eyes the attempted education of people who might
mug somebody.  If by "society" you mean the current citizens of my home
town, then no, society hasn't deprived them of anything.  If, on the other
hand, you mean the parents of the people in question, then yes, society has
deprived them of a great deal.  And for these people more money is not
something they need; they won't get better nutrition with it, nor will they
decorate their disheveled homes.  They may buy a new car.  Which brings us
to the real utility of money for them:  a very important status symbol.

> It seems funny that those European countries who do all those things we
> say will not stop crime have a significantly lower crime rate than us.  I
> wonder why?
...
> JCA

Murder rate, yes.  Crime rate, not always.  Since Goetz was the victim of
an attempted mugging, it falls under the second category.