Relay-Version: version B 2.10 5/3/83; site utzoo.UUCP Posting-Version: version B 2.10.2 9/18/84; site lanl.ARPA Path: utzoo!watmath!clyde!bonnie!akgua!sdcsvax!sdcrdcf!hplabs!hao!seismo!cmcl2!lanl!wkp From: wkp@lanl.ARPA Newsgroups: net.religion.jewish Subject: Some questions Message-ID: <18812@lanl.ARPA> Date: Tue, 1-Jan-85 17:03:41 EST Article-I.D.: lanl.18812 Posted: Tue Jan 1 17:03:41 1985 Date-Received: Thu, 3-Jan-85 04:39:06 EST Sender: newsreader@lanl.ARPA Distribution: net Organization: Los Alamos National Laboratory Lines: 23 Can someone please enlighten me as to the answers to the following questions: 1. What is the difference between a Jewish state and a state of Jews? Please give a precise and working definition; for example, how much Torah observance is necessary? 307 of the 613 mitzvot? By what percentage of the population? 51 percent? Less? More? 2. Is the present counterfeit Jewish state the first such? Or have there been previous? (For instance, during the Hasmonaim?). 3. Can we similarly divide Jews into two categories? Perhaps we can let "Jewish person" stand for the non-observant, and "person of the Jewish faith" for the observant, or vice-versa. 4. Can we then change the Havdalah service to read "Hamavdil...ben Yisrael l'Yisrael" ("Who separates between Israel and Israel") instead of the present antiquated version "Hamavdil...ben Yisrael l'Amim" ("Who separates between Israel and the nations")? thanks in advance, bill peter seismo!cmcl2o!lanl!wkp