Relay-Version: version B 2.10 5/3/83; site utzoo.UUCP Posting-Version: version B 2.10.2 9/18/84; site utcsrgv.UUCP Path: utzoo!utcsrgv!west From: west@utcsrgv.UUCP (Thomas L. West) Newsgroups: net.books,net.women Subject: Re: Pornography doesn't degrade women ... Message-ID: <671@utcsrgv.UUCP> Date: Wed, 16-Jan-85 19:04:15 EST Article-I.D.: utcsrgv.671 Posted: Wed Jan 16 19:04:15 1985 Date-Received: Wed, 16-Jan-85 19:43:26 EST References: <243@looking.UUCP> <11300010@smu.UUCP> <4560@cbscc.UUCP> <354@ahuta.UUCP> Reply-To: west@utcsrgv.UUCP (Thomas L. West) Organization: CSRI, University of Toronto Lines: 36 Summary: In article <354@ahuta.UUCP> ecl@ahuta.UUCP (e.leeper) writes: >Freedom of speech is freedom of speech. I find Nazi propaganda more offensive >(by several orders of magnitude) and demonstrably more harmful in the long run >than pornography, but I would not ban Nazi propaganda. >> ...real contribution to our basic liberties is made by porn? We have >> an essentially free press without it. >The same could be said for Nazi propaganda. My support of its right to be >heard still stands. I think that you have stated the fundamentals of the argument right there. *I*, at least, do not think that *totally* free speech is worth another holocaust, or in this specific case, I don't think it's worth the warping of attitudes towards women that pornography involves. (And the attitude has little to do with sex and much to do with relative importance of people as human beings.) The ability of the written and verbal media to inspire people to do things that they would not normally consider is well known (eg Nazi Germany). The matter of free speech is not something that can be considered as something taken for granted. The potential cost of free speech could (and *has*) reached millions of lives. While death is not something that is likely to arise out of pornography, the set of attitudes it puts forward has a higher cost than the the loss of free speech, at least in my opinion. Freedom costs. How much are we willing to pay? In this case (and in the case of hate literature), the cost is too much. As can be seen, this is an issue where there will always be disagreement *even* if we can get *all* the facts. The price of freedom varies between individuals, and there will thus be a wide variety of responses. The best we can hope for is a concensus on what the facts are. Tom West { allegra cornell decvax ihnp4 linus utzoo }!utcsrgv!west