Relay-Version: version B 2.10 5/3/83; site utzoo.UUCP Posting-Version: version B 2.10.2 9/18/84; site rochester.UUCP Path: utzoo!watmath!clyde!burl!ulysses!allegra!mit-eddie!godot!harvard!seismo!rochester!sher From: sher@rochester.UUCP (David Sher) Newsgroups: net.cse Subject: Re: Where have all the hackers gone? (reposted) Message-ID: <4721@rochester.UUCP> Date: Thu, 13-Dec-84 20:12:27 EST Article-I.D.: rocheste.4721 Posted: Thu Dec 13 20:12:27 1984 Date-Received: Sat, 15-Dec-84 02:12:24 EST References: <3137@utah-cs.UUCP> <629@bunker.UUCP> Organization: U. of Rochester, CS Dept. Lines: 47 > > Subject: Where have all the hackers gone? > > Newsgroups: net.college, net.cse > > > > The following is a message that I have forwarded for a friend of mine: > > ----------------------------------------------------------------------------- > > The department I belong has very few undergraduate hacker > > types. They are being replaced by normal looking, normal acting people who > > only want to make money. They do their assignments on time, and seldom write > > anything that they aren't either getting credit for, or being paid for. It's > > sickening. > > When (if?) you get out of school, you will find that doing assignments on > time is a definite plus in the professional world. If you are good at it, > you will only do what you get paid for, because you will not have time to > do other things. He who pays the fiddler calls the tune; he who pays the > programmer specifies what programs will be written. "Only" want to make > money? I doubt that; I, for one, like making money, but I also enjoy > learning how to do what I do well. ... > > > Steven (Harley) Davidson > > > Gary Samuelson There seems to be a problem of conflicting definitions here. There used to be a group of undergraduates at Yale and elsewhere who wrote code because they enjoyed it. They were found in the computer room at all hours of the night simply because they were doing what they enjoyed and could do so when they wanted to. They refered to themselves as hackers. Some of them were not well disciplined and they paid the price in general, others like myself were sufficiently well disciplined to get degrees with honors and go on to become graduate students or professionals. Mr Samuelson seems to think writing code because you enjoy it somehow destroys your discipline that it is incompatible with coding well. (Actually I apologize for putting words in your mouth, a lot of messages with this gist have been coming through). Sorry I lost control there, the other definition is that hackers are people who destroy computer systems and waste time simply to be obnoxious. This was publicized by the news systems and has corrupted the word from its once fairly innocent meaning. I think Mr. Davidson is looking for the people who write code and do computer science because they enjoy it. I have written to him where he might find them. They are gone because the environments available at most universities could not be enjoyed by anyone but a confirmed masochist which is why you find so many confirmed masochists as cs majors now a days (they used to be premeds). Oh well enough flames. -David Sher (former hacker)