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From: boyajian@akov68.DEC (Jerry Boyajian)
Newsgroups: net.comics
Subject: Ketchup comments (looooonnnnnngggggg!!!)
Message-ID: <235@decwrl.UUCP>
Date: Thu, 13-Dec-84 08:45:13 EST
Article-I.D.: decwrl.235
Posted: Thu Dec 13 08:45:13 1984
Date-Received: Sat, 15-Dec-84 01:39:41 EST
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A few words before I delve into comments:

(1) If any of you have wondered what has happened to parts 3 & 4 of my
series of articles on British comics, I *do* plan on doing them soon.
I was waiting for a big shipment of British Marvels from England before
doing the article on Marvel-UK. I have received them, but haven't had the
time to go through them for information for the article.

(2) The next issue of the fan-press magazine, AMAZING HEROES (#62 ---
1 January 1985), is something that you all should be on the lookout for.
It's their special 1985 Preview issue. As with their Preview issue for
1984, it'll contain an alphabetical listing of extant and planned comics
for 1985, with information garnered from the creative teams of those books
on what their plans are for the coming year. Not only is this a chance to
get an idea of what's ahead for your favorite comics, but it's also a
chance to see what other comics that you don't normally read are all about,
so that you may decide to give one a try. Specificly, I'm thinking of
those people who may only read one company's product, but may be interested
in trying others'. Last year's (their first Preview) was chock full of
info, and I suspect that there'll be even more this time. I definitely
recommend it.

Now, on with the show...

> From:	CS-Mordred!Pucc-H:Pucc-I:Pucc-K:afo	(Laurie Sefton)

> X-Men #191:  This was *awful*.  I mean dreadful.  Words don't
> describe how ***bad*** this issue was.  Where did Warlock pop in
> from?  And the ending... oh GLOS, how contrived.  Really, really
> bad.

	I have to agree, it was pretty bad. The ending wasn't exactly
	a surprise for me though --- when they start killing off major
	characters, you *know* that the whole thing is going to be made
	to un-happen. As for Warlock, he *was* in the previous issue,
	but ran away to fight again another day, which he, of course,
	does in this issue.

> Dr fate #3:  Nice reprint.  Are they ever going to come up with new
> materiel, or is this it?

	There is talk of at least doing a mini-series.


> From:	sdcc7!ma155abl	(Nick Flor, posting for Roberto Nararra)

> Why do we even read comics anymore with the crap that comes out, like
> secret wars (crappy story) or the new mutants (shitty artwork), or overall
> dumb characters like cerebus.  Why do we assume it makes sense to buy a comic
> that use to be good and is now mediocre (the X-MEN).

	Could it be that each of us decides which comics are crap and which
	are not, and read those we think are good, avoiding the ones we
	think are crap? To pick apart your specific examples: I can't argue
	with SECRET WARS, but I certainly don't begrudge Marvel's publishing
	it. It's obvious that *someone* likes it. That the artwork in NEW
	MUTANTS is "shitty" is a matter of personal taste --- I like it a lot,
	even though I'm still not convinced that it's right for the NM.
	Cerebus is far from being a dumb character --- he is, in fact, one of
	the better characters around. But again, this is a matter of personal
	taste. As for the X-MEN, well, I like the answer given by a previous
	netter: Why desert a sick friend? As a specific argument, I thought
	that issues #179 & 180 were among the worst issues of the entire run,
	but if I gave up on the book because of them, I would have missed
	#183 & 186, which were among the best.
		Sure, there's a lot of crap, but there is a lot of *great*
	stuff out there, too. I never imagined that there could ever be a
	time when there would be *20* *excellent* comics on the market (and
	*then* add the "very good" ones...).


> From:	fluke!moriarty	(Jeff Meyer)

> Eclipse is now handing out a newsheet, much like DC, and anyone reading it
> this month will be startled to see that the number of titles this month has
> DOUBLED.  Admittedly, several of these are one-shots; but most of these are
> continuing comics.  This causes a great deal of worry on my part: Eclipse
> seems to be suddenly tossing a number of new titles into a market which is
> already saturated to a new all-time zenith.  Can they afford the financial
> burden if these titles don't sell?  Many of these titles were picked up from
> the recently-defunct Pacific; one would hope that a lesson had been seen
> here.  I particularly worry because several of Eclipse's older titles,
> particlarly ZOT!, would be affected by an Eclipse financial setback; and I
> don't want to see these titles to disappear from the comics scene due to
> entrepreneurial whiz-kids on a rampage.  If they can afford to do it, fine;
> but I just hope they are looking at the market, and taking this into account.

	I really don't think you have much to worry about, Jeff. You yourself
	note that the bulk of their Pacific hand-me-downs are one-or-two-
	shots (to be specific, GROO SPECIAL, ROCKETEER SPECIAL, ALIEN WORLDS,
	TWISTED TALES, SOMERSET HOLMES, SUNRUNNERS, and MR. MONSTER). The
	only new titles from Pacific that they are continuing on an indefin-
	ite basis are the British reprint books: STRANGE DAYS, PRESSBUTTON,
	CHALLENGER, and MARVELMAN. Reprints are much easier and cheaper to
	produce.
		Of course, it's true that they plan on releasing some other
	new books, but their line-up isn't all that extensive. By my count,
	they will have about a dozen regular titles, plus the British
	reprints, plus a handful of mini-series and one-shots. That doesn't
	seem like too much to me. And remember, ECLIPSE MONTHLY was folded
	to make room for THE MASKED MAN, and CAP'N QUICK was "demoted" to
	a mini-series (I wonder why? :-) Is Marshall Rogers trying to be
	another Neal Adams?).


> From:	fluke!moriarty	(Jeff Meyer)

> TALES OF THE TEEN TITANS #51: [C]
>
> Raises the question of just how much the government knows about the Titans.
> Any guesses?

	Even worse, it raised the question to me of just how much the feds
	know about *all* of the various superheroes. I mean, do you suppose
	they might know Superman's or Batman's identities?


> From:	orca!davidl	(David D. Levine)

> [In-jokes, anyone?]
>
> In a recent "Tales of the JLA" (the one with Magpie... I'm afraid I
> can't recall the number), the first panel of the backup story has Sun
> Boy in a bar.  Over on the right side of the page, a bald-headed man
> who looks exactly like our friend Dr. Xavier is introducing himself
> as "Charles" to a comely wench who replies that she's "Kitty Storm."

> Excuse me, that's not "Tales of the Justice League of America", it's "Tales 
> of the Legion of Super Heroes."  Oops.  Mea culpa.

	Actually, this kind of in-joke has been going on for at least 10-12
	years. Every once in a while, you'd have a Marvel character make an
	off-hand reference to a DC character, or vice-versa. Or you might
	see the Phantom Stranger lurking in the background of a panel in a
	Marvel comic, or something like that. The latest issue of AMAZING
	HEROES has an article about that sort of thing going on (the author
	makes a much more significant case out of it than he should, though,
	claiming that it indicates that the Marvel & DC Universes are actually
	the same). The most outrageous example of this happening is the sub-
	plot crossover that went from AMAZING ADVENTURES (featuring the Beast)
	to THOR to JUSTICE LEAGUE OF AMERICA, occurring at the annual Hallo-
	ween festivities in Rutland, Vermont.
		If any of you out there missed this (it happened about 10
	years ago), and want to know the details of the plot crossover, send
	me mail. If there are enough requests, I'll post it in an article. If
	not, I'll answer those requests I do get via mail.


--- jayembee (Jerry Boyajian, DEC, Maynard, MA)

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