Relay-Version: version B 2.10 5/3/83; site utzoo.UUCP Posting-Version: version B 2.10.2 9/18/84; site brl-tgr.ARPA Path: utzoo!watmath!clyde!cbosgd!ihnp4!zehntel!hplabs!hao!seismo!brl-tgr!jeffh From: jeffh@brl-tgr.ARPA (Jeff Hanes ) Newsgroups: net.flame Subject: Rebuttal to Canzi's Rebuttal Message-ID: <6451@brl-tgr.ARPA> Date: Fri, 7-Dec-84 08:27:04 EST Article-I.D.: brl-tgr.6451 Posted: Fri Dec 7 08:27:04 1984 Date-Received: Mon, 10-Dec-84 01:39:48 EST References: <1344@ihuxq.UUCP> <1515@pucc-h> <707@watdcsu.UUCP> <6220@brl-tgr.ARPA> <733@watdcsu.UUCP> Reply-To: jeffh@brl-tgr.ARPA [ The Fantome Straynger ] Organization: Ballistic Research Lab Lines: 67 Summary: >> > David Canzi >> Me > David again Me again -- I admit it: I wrote in anger, without thinking clearly first. Actually, at that point in time, I was quite free from any pretense of an even temper. I do humbly apologize for personal insults, sleazy debate tac- tics, etc. I would start from a clean slate, but I don't want to look for the original article. Besides, the subject will probably come up again, later. Therefore, I will just mention a few points found in your rebuttal to my flame. >> >Believing falsehoods is not the same as believing lies, because not all >> >falsehoods are lies. This still seems like a strange statement to me. After all, the listener has no way of knowing whether an assertion is a) true b) unintended falsehood or c) deliberate lie. >> Johnny, give this man a Doublespeak Award. > (By the way, there is no doublespeak in my dictionary. > Perhaps you meant doubletalk?) I was refering to the Doublespeak Awards recently posted in net.jokes. >> > People *have* been known to make honest mistakes, >> True. You for instance (see above). All right. Me, for instance (see above). [ouch! that hurt] >> >but I suppose this simple concept is beyond the intellectual grasp of the >> >average christianoid. I think that the average Christian has a very good grasp of that concept. We make them all the time. Anybody (Christian or otherwise) who claims to be above making mistakes is truly a fool. >> > Believing lies is not the same as lying to oneself, >> >if you have no way of knowing that you were told a lie. Didn't I just make this point? Are we secretly agreeing with each other? Maybe I *will* go look at the original. > The trouble with your truth is that the only evidence of it is > somebody else's word. Hmm. I don't recall actually *saying* what I believe (not all Christians believe alike, you know), but your assertion is wrong. I have the evidence of my own life to prove to me that my beliefs work. I don't expect this to convince you that they are true, although I hope you will at least consider them as a possibility. The only evidence of my truth is a changed life. Maybe you will meet such a person. Sorry to be such a poor example of Christianity in action. > You do not appear to be a fool as much as you appear to be unusually free > of the shackles of intellectual honesty. This is a VERY strong accusation to make on the basis of one article, especially when it contains only one statement of any semi-debatable content (oh well, first impressions and all ... ). I won't even bother answering it directly. Instead, I hope that this and other postings will *show* that it is inaccurate. >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> The Fantome Straynger <<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<< Second to the right, UUCP: {seismo,decvax,unc}!brl-bmd!jeffh then straight on till morning. ARPA:-J.M. Barrie