Relay-Version: version B 2.10 5/3/83; site utzoo.UUCP Posting-Version: version B 2.10.1 exptools 1/6/84; site ihu1m.UUCP Path: utzoo!watmath!clyde!cbosgd!ihnp4!ihu1m!gadfly From: gadfly@ihu1m.UUCP (Gadfly) Newsgroups: net.women Subject: Re: Re: Only a few nuts rape? Message-ID: <144@ihu1m.UUCP> Date: Mon, 3-Dec-84 23:56:03 EST Article-I.D.: ihu1m.144 Posted: Mon Dec 3 23:56:03 1984 Date-Received: Tue, 4-Dec-84 08:46:56 EST References: <10011@watmath.UUCP> <136@ihu1m.UUCP> <1830@sun.uucp> Organization: AT&T Bell Labs, Naperville, IL Lines: 35 -- [Sunny Kirsten, replying to my wondering if the "35% who would rape if they knew they wouldn't get caught" were confusing traditional male "rape fantasies" with the opportunity to do true violence] >> The fact that the question involved "getting caught" implies we're >> talking about the use of force of violence, rather than "friendly >> persuasion" of true enjoyment. Thus we can say that 1/3 of the male >> population of a certain age category ( a snapshot of the better >> (college) crosssection of "society") has no moral compunction (only >> fear of retribution) about forcibly dominating a woman and using her >> sexually. If that isn't a sad statement about the state of human >> rights in the country who's main claim to fame "above" other countries >> is it's support of human rights, then I can only conclude that women >> are not considered human, but merely chattel, by "society". It's worse than that. It's not a matter of committing an act that, save for the sex of the victim, would be morally wrong. Men somehow learn "she says 'no', but she means 'yes'", or even worse, that women really want to be raped and actually enjoy it. It's not hypocrisy, it's dementia. Where do these attitudes come from? There's an interesting analysis in "The Mermaid and the Minotaur, Sexual Arrangements and Human Malaise" by Dorothy Dinnerstein. She contends that they are inevitable in a society where children are brought up exclusively by women, and maintains that they won't disappear until the task is performed equally by parents of both sexes. Good reading, albeit dry. -- *** *** JE MAINTIENDRAI ***** ***** ****** ****** 03 Dec 84 [13 Frimaire An CXCIII] ken perlow ***** ***** (312)979-7188 ** ** ** ** ..ihnp4!iwsl8!ken *** ***