Relay-Version: version B 2.10 5/3/83; site utzoo.UUCP Posting-Version: version B 2.10 5/3/83; site pyuxhh.UUCP Path: utzoo!watmath!clyde!burl!ulysses!gamma!pyuxww!pyuxhh!dxp From: dxp@pyuxhh.UUCP (D Peak) Newsgroups: net.rec Subject: Re: any gunslingers? Message-ID: <752@pyuxhh.UUCP> Date: Tue, 4-Dec-84 11:17:34 EST Article-I.D.: pyuxhh.752 Posted: Tue Dec 4 11:17:34 1984 Date-Received: Thu, 6-Dec-84 02:47:01 EST References: <37@politik.UUCP> <419@cepu.UUCP>, <1831@sun.uucp> Organization: Bell Communications Research, Piscataway N.J. Lines: 74 >> >Any gunslingers out there? In particular, I am interested if anyone >> >has an opinion on the HK VP70Z. (I can get one cheap). I know 9mm is >> >a wheeze, but that seems to be the way the world is going. >> > >> >Advice appreciated. >> >The american version is fairly boring. If you can get the detachable shoulder >stock which enables the 3-shot full auto mode type european version, it's a >lot more interesting. Verry interesting and also illegal ! You now have a short barrelled carbine which is not something you should be telling a lot of people about. I've recently seen a shoulder stock that is not "attached" to the gun and therefore is not considered a carbine(its moulded so that the hand grip rest firmly in the stock). > In the american semi-auto only version, I've heard it >rated as heavy handed... your finger will tire trying to repeatedly fire it. Agreed especially if you have small or medium sized hands. >Like the semi-auto version of an Uzi, it's one of those products which by >attempting to meet US law has lost its functional utility. By the way, you'll >find that 3 quick 9mm hits (which the VP70Z was designed to excell at) will >take someone down better than the one .45 hit so venerated by the old timers. If you use the newish "sivertip" JHP ammo the 9mm is pretty much on a par one-on-one with the .45. >There are better choices than the VP70Z for semi-auto only mode... the P9S >comes to mind, or a Devel conversion of an S&W 39, 59, 459, etc. Browning BDA etc etc however one thing that the VP70Z has over all these mention is a capacity of 18 rounds in each clip. This I suspect is one of the major reasons that people initially look at the VP70Z. Hell with two spare clips in your belt you've got your own small army. > The real >question of course, is what do you want it for? If its to save your life, >money should not be a consideration (what's your life worth?) so what does it >matter what you can get cheap? If it's for target practice, try a Ruger >Model 1. If it's all just a part of the game: > "The Guy who dies with the most toys, wins" >then why not an Ingram Mac-10 so you can rock 'n' roll? >Or if your aim is poor, try a nuclear hand-grenade. >Or for real class you could get a Thompson Center Contender and 43million >barrel conversions. Or if you prefer wheelguns, how about a Gatling Gun... >but I digress... > > Anyone know where I can buy Glaser Safety Slugs or better 9mm ammo? > Oh, pretty please? They're so hard to find. > > Sunny >-- Theoretically only police can buy Glaser Safety Slugs(thats why they are so hard to find), not I'm not sure but I would imagine that if only the police can buy them then only the police would be allowed to possess them. Need I go on ? As I mentioned earlier lots of good(really good) things are being said about "silvertip" ammo for the 9mm(expansion to .55,approx 90-95 % weight retention). Also if you hand load you could use shotshell in the larger sizes 2->00 to give you better stopping power (not like the Glaser however). I didn't notice any smiley face in your article, which is a shame because of some of the quasi-legal stuff that you mention. -- Dave Peak (pyuxhh!dxp) "He's a legend in his own mind"