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From: dls@hocse.UUCP
Newsgroups: net.women,net.singles
Subject: New things/Re: Re: Is this rape?
Message-ID: <172@hocse.UUCP>
Date: Fri, 12-Oct-84 09:13:46 EDT
Article-I.D.: hocse.172
Posted: Fri Oct 12 09:13:46 1984
Date-Received: Sat, 13-Oct-84 07:13:45 EDT
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CC:         skran
REFERENCE:  <10400011@acf4.UUCP>, <10400012@acf4.UUCP>, <532@rayssd.UUCP>

Bravo, indeed, new things are called for.

Heather Emanual in her statement on the New Bedford incident
suggests that men "believe" women as a default when they say no.

This will keep the man out of trouble, but I suggest that it 
is not a practical course of action for men.

My experience, and that of many men I have talked with, is that
women(IN GENERAL-if you are the exception, keep the flames cool)
are hard-wired to say no with little regard for what they actually mean.

My sister usually explains it this way: "No has a thousand meanings,
including 

No, never with you, you turkey!
No, brush your teeth.
No, I need to get the diaphraghm.
No, let me think about it for a few minutes.
No, I don't know you well enough.

Etc. ad infinitum, ad nauseum

The result of this pernicious cultural conditioning
that women are never to encourage men is that frequently women DO
say NO when they mean YES or MAYBE.

About the age of 15 most men pick up on this, and the lesson sticks.
Women seem to WANT persistance, dragon killing, acts that indicate the
man is "really interested." What they say is to a first order not
what they mean.

I wish that the revolution was over, that women said what they meant,
and men respected their wishes. Alas, it has hardly gotten started.

PS: Just to make sure the slow witted out there understand -- I am
not talking about rape, the New Bedford incident, and I am NOT saying 
that men should just push on ahead without regard to what women
say. I am saying men have a significant, real problem that many
women may not fully appreciate.