Relay-Version: version B 2.10 5/3/83; site utzoo.UUCP Posting-Version: version B 2.10.2 9/18/84 SMI; site sun.uucp Path: utzoo!linus!decvax!decwrl!sunny From: sunny@sun.uucp (Sunny Kirsten) Newsgroups: net.women Subject: Re: rape and violence Message-ID: <1733@sun.uucp> Date: Tue, 9-Oct-84 05:31:02 EDT Article-I.D.: sun.1733 Posted: Tue Oct 9 05:31:02 1984 Date-Received: Tue, 16-Oct-84 05:22:35 EDT References: <3029@hlexa.UUCP> <10400010@acf4.UUCP> <385@pucc-k> Organization: Sun Microsystems, Inc. Lines: 62 > > How do you go about proving "psychological" rape? What the hell is > "psychological" rape?!!! Is that rape of someone with the mind? > In what sense? I think it's utterly ridiculous if you're implying > that dreaming of having sex with someone (forcibly or non-forcibly), > even though that person says no (in real-life or the dream) should be > illegal. I think maybe you were trying to say (at least it's more > logical) that you psychologically (playing mind games and the like) > convince a girl(or guy) to say "yes". At this point, I'm still not > sure you have grounds for rape. I mean the guy didn't do anything > until he got a "yes". It seems like a bit of an underhanded and cruel > technique, but I don't see how you could convict on it!! Or is > psychological rape when screw her brains out (no, arrrggggghhhh, I know it > was bad, sorry!) > > > ------------------------------------------------------------------------------ > Andy Banta {decvax!allegra!inhp4}!pucc-k!agz > Alcohol Design and Application Corp. --- Serving people over 21 years. > ------------------------------------------------------------------------------ > "You lock the door, you hold the key, > There's someone in my head, but it's not me ... " you've missed the point! You espouse the "protect the criminal, to hell with the victim" philosophy usually applied by the (usually) male justice system to the crime of rape. the point is not how you prove shit is shit in court, but to pay attention to the fact that there IS shit laying all around you, whether the courts know about it or not!. MY WHOLE POINT was that there IS a psychological form of rape, and that you and the courts haven't got the foggiest idea of how to deal with it!. Rape is a crime of DOMINANCE. It may manifest as SEXual dominance, and / or it may manifest as VIOLENTce dominance, but it is nevertheless a crime of one person asserting control over the other person's body/mind where there is no legal right for that dominance. The rapist MUST assert mental dominance OR physical dominance to achieve rape (the non-consensual dominance of another person), but our laws deal only with the SEXUAL aspects of the crime, none of the victims PSYCHOLOGICAL rape. The psychological dominance may occurr quickly... 1: Do exactly as I tell you or this knife punctures your heart, etc... 2: Oh shit! I'll do EXACTLY what he says, and maybe he won't knife me... 3: No further protest is registered, (take THAT to court!) to stay alive. Or may be the entirety of the crime... But there has to be some point where Psychological rape has occurred (reduction of victim to mental submission) in almost EVERY physical rape. Because rape IS a crime of dominance, it seldom goes to the point of sex with the victim still fighting...because that fails to satisfy the attacker's need to dominate...(getting sex without submission), so he will usually escalate the violence until the victim yields. Thus MOST rapes involve violence, and some involve sex, but ALL involve dominance. For yet another storm in net.singles, we could look at the cause of the need to dominate, why that's related to sex, and why men usually take it out on women. Remember, psychological illnesses are usually only the symptoms of the victims failure to deal with the mental illnesses of the family in which he was raised. The rapist is as much a psychological victim as the rapee. That's also why these things run in families (e.g. wifebeating). But I digress. -- {ucbvax,decvax,ihnp4}!sun!sunny (Sunny :-> Kirsten of Sun Microsystems Inc.)