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From: martillo@mit-athena.ARPA (Joaquim Martillo)
Newsgroups: net.religion.jewish
Subject: Re: Ignorant, assimilated Ashkenazim discussion
Message-ID: <26@mit-athena.ARPA>
Date: Mon, 8-Oct-84 10:02:03 EDT
Article-I.D.: mit-athe.26
Posted: Mon Oct  8 10:02:03 1984
Date-Received: Wed, 10-Oct-84 06:02:25 EDT
References: <1125@ihuxi.UUCP>
Organization: MIT, Project Athena, Cambridge, Ma.
Lines: 59

I  showed  the  articles  on  Czarist versus Soviet treatment of Jews to
members of the Russian Jewish community in New York and Boston.  If  any
one wants phone numbers, I can give via private mail.

The results:

Czarist Pogroms versus Yevsektsia and Stalinist Executions.

In a typical czarist pogrom order of 20 people died.

Over a similar time period the Yevsektsias or Stalin would order several
hundred executions.

Drafting of Children versus Removing children from unfit parents
(because of Jewish identification)

About equal numbers except that the Soviets have been more likely to
execute or exile the parents to Siberia.

Attending Universities

Czarists and Soviets place restrictions on Jewish attendence at
University.

Destruction of the Jewish Community

Czarists -- minor censorship of Jewish religious books.

Soviet -- total destruction of the Jewish community by forbidding and
making illegal any sort of Jewish education or Jewish observance.

Emigration

Under the Czarists Jews were always free to leave.

Under the Soviets even when some Jews were permitted to leave, there
were massive restrictions.

Why do Mike Musing and David Rubin believe Ignorant VusVus Fairy Tales
about the Czarists?

Assimilated Ashkenazim consider restrictions on admittance to non-Jewish
society a most terrible form of anti-semitism.  In Czarist society a Jew
was always a Jew even after conversion.  The Soviets pay lip service  to
ideas  of  equality  and  universality of human society.  The low common
vulgar VusVus, who came to the USA before the 20s who knew nothing about
Yahadut  and therefore grovelled and had no pride, psychologically found
czarist restrictions unbearable.

Just a note  on  general  (not  related  to  Jews)  Czarist  and  Soviet
brutality.   In  the  19th  century the Czarist empire was primitive and
barabic yet less than 30 were executed by  the  government.   Since  the
beginning  of the Soviet Regime (less than one hundred years ago) on the
order of 20 million people are estimated to have been  murdered  by  the
government.

The hallmark of the VusVus is not letting  reality  interfere  with  his
world view.