Relay-Version: version B 2.10 5/3/83; site utzoo.UUCP Posting-Version: version B 2.10.1 6/24/83; site watmath.UUCP Path: utzoo!watmath!saquigley From: saquigley@watmath.UUCP (Sophie Quigley) Newsgroups: net.motss Subject: questions Message-ID: <8134@watmath.UUCP> Date: Mon, 25-Jun-84 12:40:51 EDT Article-I.D.: watmath.8134 Posted: Mon Jun 25 12:40:51 1984 Date-Received: Tue, 26-Jun-84 00:26:01 EDT Organization: U of Waterloo, Ontario Lines: 41 While you're in a question-from-straights-answering mood Steve (or anybody else for that matter), I'd like to ask a question that has been puzzling me for a while. MY understanding of the lesbian community is that there is a subgroup of lesbians who choose to be lesbians for "political" reasons. These are usually women like Ellen who consciously choose to be lesbians because they think that men are creeps (to put it lightly). From the litterature I've read by some of these women, the point (or reason or whatever) of this switch is to rediscover female sexuality which has been buried under male propaganda of what sex should be like: foreplay + intercourse (+ washing oneself (-:). This view of sexuality is usually accompanied by a different philosophy of how the world should be, a place where caring and emotions are important, etc..... It also seems (and here I am not as aware of the actual reality as I am in the case of lesbians, so correct me if I am wrong) that there is a subculture in the gay culture which is the complete antithesis of this lesbian ideal: power is the basis of sex and a great emphasis is put on anonymousness, sex for sex' sake with no place for feelings, promiscuity etc (i.e the image that most "straights" have of gays), in other words everything that political lesbians loathe in "straight" men pushed to its extreme. Obviously lesbians and gay men do have common interests since they are both discriminated against by society at large, so as there is power in numbers it is in their interest to join forces to try to achieve better rights in society. However the philosophies of these two subgroups seem to be so irreconciliable (that of the political lesbians and of the "promiscuous" (let's say) gay men, not of lesbians and gay men in general) that I wonder how they manage to work together when their ideals are so different. I was just curious as to whether this produces a rift into the gay culture, whether these two subcultures just ignore themselves except to join forces to get things accomplished, or whether there is hatred or debating going on about ideals etc.... I have never seen any mention of this problem anywhere in the lesbian litterature I have read and I am wondering why. Can anybody enlighten me? Sophie Quigley ...!{clyde,ihnp4,decvax}!watmath!saquigley