Relay-Version: version B 2.10 5/3/83; site utzoo.UUCP Posting-Version: version B 2.10.1 Fluke 1/4/84; site fluke.UUCP Path: utzoo!watmath!clyde!burl!mgnetp!ihnp4!houxm!houxz!vax135!cornell!uw-beaver!microsoft!fluke!tron From: tron@fluke.UUCP (Peter F. Barbee) Newsgroups: net.auto Subject: Re: Muscle_Car != Sport_Car (Corvette too rough?/real Muscle car) Message-ID: <635@vax1.fluke.UUCP> Date: Fri, 8-Jun-84 16:31:22 EDT Article-I.D.: vax1.635 Posted: Fri Jun 8 16:31:22 1984 Date-Received: Sun, 10-Jun-84 01:19:51 EDT References: <1165@qubix.UUCP> Organization: John Fluke Mfg. Co., Everett, WA Lines: 81 A few comment about the article from; Jeff Buchanan @ QUBIX Graphic Systems, Inc., Saratoga, CA. >>My '66 Vette may actually generate as much sideways G's but the feel of the >>two cars is as different as night and day. The steering response makes >>all the difference. I just can't believe the wimps who ride in a >>'Vette and whine "it's too rough! I can feel the bumps!". Now really, I need some numbers to believe your '66 and '84 'Vettes are even comparable. If you think your '66 was a good handling car (especially compared to the new one) your judgement is suspect. >So going by that reasoning, the softer the suspension, the more fun a car is to >>drive. That means that a big limo would be the funnest car to drive >>and a Can-Am racer would be a terribly boring car to drive. And since >>it's a fact that the stiffer the suspension the better a car handles >>that means the better a car handles, the less fun it is to drive!? >>Shows you how screwed up I was -- I always thought the better the handling >>the more fun to drive. I find two glaring logic errors here. First it is possible that the suspension could be too stiff on a car, thus if the suspension was softened the car would be more fun to drive. Carrying this argument out to extremes of the limo is absurd, moderation is possible. Second it is not a fact that the stiffer the suspension the better the handling. In fact, in Grand Prix racing it was noted that even though they allowed for suspension travel the suspension actually doesn't travel. They experimented with no suspension but (not surprisingly) it made the cars nearly undrivable. I realize that this is an extreme example, so I will also mention Peugots (sp), they are well known for soft springs and suspension but undoubtably handle better than many harsher sprung cars. >> In another response Guy Harris talks about the "Best Handling >>American Car" article in Car&Driver. I read that story and >>I found the conclusion they came to absolutely baffling. Their data >>showed the 'Vette had MUCH better cornering, MUCH better steering response >>("Knife-edged" is how they described it) than the Z-28 so their conclusion >>is that the 'Vette handles MUCH worse than Z-28!! Therefore, great >>cornering and great steering response equals bad handling. Now that's >>certainly logical! I think what Car&Driver really discussed was the best *driving* car. The main point I got out of the article was their feeling that the 'Vette required too much driver input and forced the driver to concentrate on driving at all times. I think most of us like to be able to relax occasionly. My own experiences back-up C&D's reporting. Another example might be the 930 Turbo, both C&D and Road&Track gave it poor grades as a highway cruiser (read GT) because of its nervousness. Notice I'm comparing your precious 'Vette to the 930, I think it's a valid comparison, the 'Vette may even be the winner. I would beg to disagree with Guy when he says the >>staff of Car&Driver "aren't exactly the sort of people who want a sports >>car with the ride of a Cadillac". Apparently a Cadillac ride is EXACTLY >>what they would want in a sports car. Come now, you've read enough in the magazine to know better than this. I really do like the new 'Vette, I've enjoyed the time I've spent driving and riding in one. This car is a huge step forward for the American automakers, it has been many years since they've put out a car competitive in this market. Unfortunately the car is harder to drive than many people would like, Chevy is (or has) responded to their complaints. As long as they don't compramise too much everyone might be pleased. Peter Barbee decvax-+-uw-beaver-+ ihnp4--+ allegra-+ ucbvax----lbl-csam-+--fluke!tron sun-+ ssc-vax-+