Relay-Version: version B 2.10 5/3/83; site utzoo.UUCP Posting-Version: version B 2.10.1 6/24/83; site rabbit.UUCP Path: utzoo!watmath!clyde!floyd!harpo!ulysses!allegra!alice!rabbit!jj From: jj@rabbit.UUCP Newsgroups: net.abortion Subject: Re: Faith vs. law vs. abortion Message-ID: <2580@rabbit.UUCP> Date: Fri, 9-Mar-84 10:24:57 EST Article-I.D.: rabbit.2580 Posted: Fri Mar 9 10:24:57 1984 Date-Received: Sat, 10-Mar-84 11:22:56 EST References: <2579@rabbit.UUCP>, <1953@cbscc.UUCP> Organization: AT&T Bell Laboratories, Murray Hill Lines: 60 I DID explain my position. You even read it, Paul, because you asked "Why don't incubators count?" The reason I said "incubators don't count" is that I don't regard an incubator as an extraordinary method of keeping the fetusalive. I regard extraordinary measures as things like in-vitro birth (yeah, I know it's not available, and if it was, that would indeed be a viable alternative to abortion in some cases.), artificial wombs , heart/lung/kidney support, and the like. Basically, if the fetus can breathe, pump its own blood, digest its own food, and keep its own metabolism functioning, it's no longer a fetus, it's a baby, and it should be treated as a human. (I don't regard needing someone else to GET the food as a lack of humanity, so don't bother using the usual emotionally loaded sophistry to kill off all the 3 year old humans, please.) Clearly, if the mother WANTS extraordinary measures, she should be allowed to request them. Likewise for the father, or for anyone who WANTS the fetus to grow into humanity. . The definition given here is no different that the one that you claim I didn't give in the last article. I'm NOT going to argue about the definition, simply because I will not argue matters of your faith. You are welcome to hold the members of your faith to the tenets of that faith, but please do not expect me to agree with, or act by, them. On another note, referring to the individual who comments that many pregnancies are the result of "incautious behavior". I find your argument quite offensive. You use pregnancy as a tool to punish people who are not of your own belief regarding sexual behavior, a behavior which is EXACTLY equivelant to inflicting YOUR religious punishment on someone who does not believe in your religion. -- TEDDY BEARS ARE NICER THAN PEOPLE-- HUG YOUR OWN TODAY ! (allegra,harpo,ulysses)!rabbit!jj