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From: bitmap@ucbtopaz.CC.Berkeley.ARPA
Newsgroups: net.politics
Subject: re: Who SAYS it's yours?
Message-ID: <404@ucbtopaz.CC.Berkeley.ARPA>
Date: Fri, 2-Mar-84 01:17:23 EST
Article-I.D.: ucbtopaz.404
Posted: Fri Mar  2 01:17:23 1984
Date-Received: Sun, 26-Feb-84 00:26:15 EST
Organization: Univ. of Calif., Berkeley CA USA
Lines: 37

>The net effect, according to Citizens for Tax Justice, 
>...is that the Reagan "tax cut" increased taxes 30.2% (an average
>of $134/year) for people with incomes under $10,000...

Would you please elaborate, Mike?  The federal income tax went down
for all brackets, according to my understanding, so how is this
"net effect" calculated?  Is it the result of higher state taxes?
Higher Social Security taxes (that law was passed before Reagan
took office, I believe)?  Even if you count these things, how are
they the result of the Reagan tax cut?  Is your claim that there
has been a reverse transfer of wealth from the poor to the rich
based only on increases in military spending?  Sure, I'll agree
that those with high incomes (as opposed to those  rich who pay few
taxes) are better off paying lower income taxes -- I won't agree
that this constitutes a transfer of wealth from the poor to the
rich.  Is that what you've been trying to claim?

>That got me thinking about what determines what belongs to whom.
>To me, all that determines that is state policy.  In other words,
>there is no private property unless the state decides that there is
>private property.

This seems logical, but it doesn't seem to say a lot.  In essence,
if the state is strong enough, it can decide whether there is
private property, freedom, or if you'll live until tomorrow.
This does not negate the idea of private property.

>So the "this is mine and the state is extorting it from me"
>attitude makes me laugh.  Try and hold on to it if the state
>weren't around to protect you from rioting workers.

Do you feel that all that you own really should belong to the
state?  Are you against the concept of private property?  If so,
do you ever lock your car?  How about locking your apartment/house?

Sam Hall, UCB