Relay-Version: version B 2.10 5/3/83; site utzoo.UUCP Posting-Version: version B 2.10.1 6/24/83; site rabbit.UUCP Path: utzoo!watmath!clyde!floyd!harpo!ulysses!allegra!alice!rabbit!jj From: jj@rabbit.UUCP Newsgroups: net.abortion Subject: Faith vs. law vs. abortion Message-ID: <2579@rabbit.UUCP> Date: Thu, 8-Mar-84 14:54:45 EST Article-I.D.: rabbit.2579 Posted: Thu Mar 8 14:54:45 1984 Date-Received: Sat, 10-Mar-84 07:10:38 EST Organization: AT&T Bell Laboratories, Murray Hill Lines: 53 Take this, O infamous eater of great netnews whizdom. This is excerpted, I believe in strict context: From alice!allegra!ulysses!mhuxl!ihnp4!ihnp1!dolan Wed Dec 31 19:00:00 1969 So the pertinent points seem to be: a. All human beings have the right to live. b. An unborn child is a human being from the moment of conception with the right to her/his life. c. Human beings only forfeit their right to live when they place the physical life of another human being in danger. ------------ The falicy in these statements is the "point" that "An unborn child is a human being from the moment of conception ... " Many people, myself included, do NOT believe that an fetus is a "human being" until that fetus can survive OUTSIDE THE WOMB with no extraordinary mechanical support.When this point is considered, the other "pertinent points " are shown to be moot. The deliberate action of calling a fetus a person/human from the instant of conception is a deliberate debating technique that is intended to sucker the opponent into stipulating the most important facts in the argument. The issue of when a fetus becomes human is NOT, and will not likely be in the near future, determined/determinable, and references like the above, which require stipulation of a given OPINION are not, in fact, fair or constructive arguments. The "pro-life" forces quite naturally wish to argue from the grounds most favorable to them. I object to their using the term "human" for a fetus, and I also object to the deliberate equating of abortion with murder. It is a simple step, and one that has occasionally already been taken, to extend this argument to the individual egg and sperm cells, thus making any failed attempt at intercourse murder. Please note: I do NOT stipulate that a 1 day old fetus is human. Please base your arguments on either convincing me otherwise (on physical grounds, not religious grounds) or on an argument that recognizes that I do NOT accept your defination of human. -- TEDDY BEARS ARE NICER THAN PEOPLE-- HUG YOUR OWN TODAY ! (allegra,harpo,ulysses)!rabbit!jj