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Path: utzoo!watmath!clyde!floyd!harpo!seismo!hao!hplabs!menlo70!sanders
From: sanders@menlo70.UUCP (Rex Sanders)
Newsgroups: net.politics
Subject: re: grass roots politics + antinukes
Message-ID: <200@menlo70.UUCP>
Date: Sun, 4-Mar-84 02:40:37 EST
Article-I.D.: menlo70.200
Posted: Sun Mar  4 02:40:37 1984
Date-Received: Fri, 2-Mar-84 13:47:46 EST
Organization: USGS, Menlo Park CA
Lines: 84

Well, I will try to reply to exactly the kind of sarcastic,
dirty-fighting message I feared in my original posting.  Mr. Lofstrom's
message is indented.

	It's amazing that the ultimate expression of grass-roots
	politics involves trying to prevent the folks at Diablo ( who
	supply the electricity that runs menlo70!sander's terminal )
	from doing their job.  Perhaps he wishes to drive away the
	semi-competent people running the plant, leaving complete
	incompetents in their place.

  Civil disobedience is not the ultimate expression of grass-roots
politics - only a last resort, when all else has failed.  As far as
driving the competent people away - why would they leave?  They believe
in what they are doing.  Anyway, if I and others are successful, even
the incompetents won't be around to run the plant.

	I would have thought such expression would involve BUILDING
	alternate energy sources, finding economical ways to save
	energy, and changing the monopolistic, government-caused rate
	system that makes inefficient power generation seem
	profitable.  Can't get on TV that way, though.

  Well, I wasn't on TV.  I and 4 friends were arrested at 5:30 am at
least 3 miles from the nearest TV camera.  Several cars tried to run us
down until the PG&E helicopter landed.
  We are working on building alternate energy sources.  However,
because PG&E has 4.9 BILLION dollars tied up in Diablo Canyon, and
because the Reagan Administration is borrowing 1 out of 4 federal
budget dollars to prepare for war, interest rates are so high as to
make alternates nearly infeasible.  We have been, and continue to work
to change the rate system.  However, Diablo is an *imminent danger* -
changing the rate structure won't stop it from going on-line.

	As it is, the price of generated electricity will go up a
	little, inducing BC Hydro to build a few more dams on the
	Frazier river.

Huh?  What will cause the price of electricity to go up?  Why would BC
Hydro need to build more dams when there is still excess capacity,
nationwide and within PG&E?

	(sarcasm mode on ) This will cause maps to change, and allow
	Sanders' employer (the USGS) to ask for more money from
	Congress, to pay for changing those maps, and pay for the more
	expensive electricity that his terminal uses.  HE doesn't pay
	for it...except at tax time.  (sarcasm off)

Is this crap really necessary?  If you want to argue the economics of
nuclear power, don't forget the *huge* subsidies hidden around every
corner.  Other points: the terminal is mine, at home - I'm paying for
the electricity.  I don't get my electricity from PG&E - the City of
Palo Alto supplies it from hydro plants and has many conservation and
solar programs going to reduce even that.  I don't work for the
map-making people - we got a 50% budget cut last year.

	Oh, we should make the bad-nasty old utilities pay for it all?
	Well, the utilities are mostly owned by pension funds, which
	means "punishing" the utilities economically can be a backdoor
	way of punishing the elderly.  There is no "them" to punish
	separate from "us".  When you set out to hurt an organization
	you end up hurting HUMAN BEINGS, and not the ones you want to
	hurt, unless you are careful.  Blocking a gate isn't being
	careful.

I'm not willing to let PG&E endanger my life, liberty, and pursuit of
happiness so that the stupid pension fund managers can keep their
jobs.  The handwriting has been on the wall for years for nukes.  I
think the far greater harm will be done if I don't try to stop Diablo
from going on-line.

	Mr. Sanders, if you are flamed for your actions, might it not
	be because a portion of the intelligent, ethical, educated
	people on the net think what you are doing is WRONG?  Perhaps
	the funny feeling you have is simply your conscience.

	-- Keith Lofstrom

You are entitle to your opinion - don't speak for others.  If I am
wrong, prove it.  If there is something right about Diablo Canyon,
nuclear power, our present form of decision making in these areas, show
me.  So far, all you've shown me is sarcasm.

-- Rex          decvax!ucbvax!menlo70!sanders