Relay-Version: version B 2.10 5/3/83; site utzoo.UUCP Posting-Version: version B 2.10.1 6/24/83; site unc.UUCP Path: utzoo!linus!decvax!harpo!ulysses!unc!bch From: bch@unc.UUCP (Byron Howes ) Newsgroups: net.religion Subject: Re: YAOFW (Yet another Omni/Free Will) Message-ID: <6852@unc.UUCP> Date: Thu, 1-Mar-84 00:19:57 EST Article-I.D.: unc.6852 Posted: Thu Mar 1 00:19:57 1984 Date-Received: Fri, 2-Mar-84 08:25:33 EST References: <858@ssc-vax.UUCP>, <3586@utzoo.UUCP> Organization: University of North Carolina Comp. Center Lines: 37 Well, I'm not sure whether Laura made hash out of my argument or not since she seems to sum it up fairly well in the following paragraph: >>Suppose they are right. then where does that leave the "I" that did the >>raising? Clearly it had no effect on the outcome, since the outcome was >>predictable. My very self is thus no more significant to my decisions than >>the clothes I wear, or the size of my feet or any one of many other details >>about me. Indeed, you begin to see that the "I" is merely the sum of my >>experiences or some entirely predictable chemical soup. The only point I made was that free will (as a local phenomenon, a human sense of making choices) is largely irrelevant in the face of omniscience (the BIG perspective.) Either Laura attributed someone else's argument to me, or I misstated my arguement very badly (entirely possible considering the time of night I generally submit news) or she misread me very badly. What I was trying to get away from is the notion of G-d's responsibility in the matter of human actions. This does not, however, imply that humans are necessarily responsible (in the ultimate sense) for their actions. In the matter of G-d vs. human perception of time, I imagine that G-d sees time much like human's see physical dimensions, only with unlimited vision and resolution. (I agree with Dave Norris [*gasp*] that 'where' G-d was 'in/on' that dimension when it created the dimension itself is an ill-formed question.) Man, standing in the dimension sees muddily toward the past, and almost not at all toward the future and is, in fact, only sort of philosophically aware that the dimension exists at all. This conception spawns some fascinating problems, particularly with respect to interactions twixt G-d and man, but I'll leave those for another time. -- "Pay no attention to that man behind the curtain!" Byron Howes UNC - Chapel Hill ({decvax,akgua}!mcnc!unc!bch)