Relay-Version: version B 2.10 5/3/83; site utzoo.UUCP Posting-Version: version B 2.10 beta 3/9/83; site grkermit.UUCP Path: utzoo!linus!genrad!grkermit!chris From: chris@grkermit.UUCP (Chris Hibbert) Newsgroups: net.politics Subject: Re: morality based on species survival Message-ID: <481@grkermit.UUCP> Date: Wed, 6-Jul-83 17:49:06 EDT Article-I.D.: grkermit.481 Posted: Wed Jul 6 17:49:06 1983 Date-Received: Mon, 11-Jul-83 17:14:13 EDT References: <248@isrnix.UUCP> grkermit.456 <257@isrnix.UUCP> Organization: GenRad Inc., Concord, MA Lines: 60 Here are some excerpts from an exchange between isrnix!tim and myself, followed by my rebuttal to his most recent comment. "The primary moral value is NOT to preserve an individual life- it is to preserve the life of the species as a whole!" --isrnix!tim in <248@isrnix.UUCP> "if it ever came to me to make a decision that gave me a choice of my life versus the survival of mankind, I hope I would want to give up my life. ... In a rational war ... I would be willing to give up my life to defend a society that was upholding the rights I believe in." --grkermit!chris in <456@grkermit.UUCP> "Chris says that he would favor actions which insure the survival of the species over the individual. I am glad to see a Libertarian admit that there is a need to value our species survival over any given individual life." -- isrnix!tim in <257@isrnix.UUCP> Read carefully, that isn't quite what I said. I said that I would LIKE to prefer actions which insure the survival of the species over my life. I wouldn't say "[I] would favor actions which insure the survival of the species over the individual," since I have no right to make that decision for anyone but myself. What I meant by saying "I hope I would want" is that of the 2 situations: 1. I prefer to give up my life in the course of some action that ensures or enables the survival of the human life. 2. I prefer to save my life and let the species certainly die in the forseeable future. I find the former situation to be preferable. The reason for this is that I value rational life, and I prefer situations in which I consider the human race to be mostly rational life. (ie. The situations that I can imagine in which I would prefer to live out my life knowing I hadn't take steps to save the race all involve becoming terminally exasperated with the race.) Some of the reasons I prefer a rational human race (if they aren't obvious) are: I am a social creature, and prefer company; and I know that a whole rational race will continuously invent things to make my life more comfortable, and I wouldn't have time to invent them all in their absence. I don't believe "that there is a need to value the species over any given individual['s] life." (My insertion in the quotation should show where my sympathies lie.) PS. I admire the way you switched subjects in the last article I refer to above. I agree with you that something must be done to stop the insane arms race. decvax!genrad!grkermit!chris allegra!linus!genrad!grkermit!chris harpo!eagle!mit-vax!grkermit!chris