From: utzoo!decvax!ucbvax!ARPAVAX:UNKNOWN:sf-lovers Newsgroups: fa.sf-lovers Title: SF-LOVERS Digest V6 #47 Article-I.D.: ucbvax.8479 Posted: Sun Sep 12 06:57:19 1982 Received: Tue Sep 14 02:02:16 1982 >From SFL@SRI-CSL Sun Sep 12 06:40:58 1982 SF-LOVERS Digest Saturday, 28 Aug 1982 Volume 6 : Issue 47 Today's Topics: SF Books - Coils & Courtship Rite & Stand on Zanzibar & Poul Anderson, SF TV - Land of the Lost & Starlost, Humor - Genderless Video Games ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Date: 08/21/82 02:53:52 From: JEH@MIT-MC Subject: Review: \Coils/ by Fred Saberhagen and Roger Zelazny Micro-review: Worth reading once. Good writing, interesting ideas, but not a particularly memorable story. Zelazny really is over-using the rediscovery-of-forgotten-past plotline. At least in \Nine Princes in Amber/ there was some excuse for it: The reader NEEDED a slow, easy introduction to Corwin's home environment. Here (as in many of Z's other books), rediscovery-of-past is the whole story. The obstacles placed in the hero's path are interesting, and his way of getting past them is interesting and well-described -- he can psionically link to, get information from, and control computers -- but the overall story isn't that momentous. The writing is very good, and each chapter flow along well enough, but at the end I realized I'd been cheated a bit -- as if I'd eaten and paid for a dinner that tasted good, but which was neither filling nor nourishing. In particular, the final battle between Our Hero and his enemies wasn't particularly exciting, and not at all climactic; it was just another of his troubles, and I had to keep glancing at the page numbers to be sure that it WAS the final battle (even though the authors kept reminding me that it was, about once every three grafs, in so many words). Worth reading, I suppose, but not worth buying unless you can get it for under two bucks. Sorry about that, Fred and Roger -- I really expected better. ----Jamie Hanrahan ------------------------------ Date: 15 August 1982 1708-EDT From: Hank Walker at CMU-10A Subject: Courtship Rite This story was serialized in the Feb 1, Mar 1, Mar 29, and May issues of ANALOG. As it so happens, I just finished reading it last night (I'm behind on my reading). It deals with the bizarre culture created on a planet by a starship apparently escaping a war. Much of the story deals with the strange customs of the people, and their origins. As one of the characters says in the story, you may not like the rituals, but they were developed to solve a problem, and even though we may have forgotten the problem, it is probably still there waiting to come back if we throw out the ritual. The story is at least as good as anything else I've read lately. ------------------------------ Date: 25-Aug-82 12:01AM-EDT (Wed) From: Todd AllenSubject: Raiders OTLA - John Brunner - Poul Anderson Just came back from seeing "Raiders of the Lost Ark" for the 4th or 5th time. (Yes, I know, not SF!) Was amazed at something -- that movie runs less than two hours, yet it feals much longer. Not that it's boring, but that there's so much packed into it. Some how you feel that it could end when the board the freighter, yet it keeps on going. AMAZING!!! Star Wars had the same quality. This may be a big factor in their popularity. Our arpa gateway was down for a while, so I'm about 1&1/2 weeks behind in my reading. To respond to some things that have flown by ... RE: From: "Ross Nelson" John Brunner's "Stand on Zanzibar" ranks with "1984" and "Brave New World" as anti-utopias. No doubt about it, Zanzibar is one of the best SF novels ever written. It is interesting and absorbing, not only for its plot and ideas, but also for its style and manner of presentation. Perhaps the only TV documentry that never made it to TV. However, why no mention of "The Jagged Orbit", also by Brunner, written the year after Zanzibar. It is every bit as powerful, well written, and relevant. Zanzibar and Orbit may be the two best books Brunner has ever written. Certainly Brunner's recent output has been a disappointment. (Most of his work up to Zanzibar and Orbit realy turned me on -- the last 14 years have been mostly down hill.) Zanzibar and Orbit are two great books, neither one of which has received its due. Zanzibar is well known, but never won any awards or great acclaim. Orbit is virtually unknown, but definitely the equal of Zanzibar. If you haven't read it do so. Read them both - together - they are related, but not the same. Can someone tell me ... I once heard the Bunner did a sequel to Zanzibar (not Orbit). Is this true? Title please! On to Poul Anderson ... I think I have read more works by Anderson than by any one else (except maybe Asimov, who is a daily occurrence and as inescapable as the rising of the sun!). In recent editions of the digest and in reviews I have seen many complaints about the generally poor use of language and quality of writing. Nabokov was pointed out as one of the few who used English well, and literately. To this I answer, READ THE WORKS OF POUL ANDERSON - anything by him (even "The Avitar"). At his very worst, Anderson's work is merely well written and enjoyable. At his best (or almost there), is prose is as beautiful and subtle as any written in any language. Combine this with an informed, intelligent, and compassionate understanding of the human condition, and an immense knowledge of history, folk lore, mythology, literature, and technology, and you have a giant of a writer. Contrary to what some would have you believe, the writers of the forties and fifties are distinguishable, their works have other than historical significance, and they are enjoyable even if you weren't under 20 when the stuff was first written (much of Anderson's best work was written before I was 7). Hopefully, people that say otherwise are saying it only for shock value. If they truly believe what they say, then one must wonder just how perceptive they are as readers and as people. Back to Anderson... I don't mean to say that everything he has written is of great significance, certainly not. He has written his share of space operas. However, even his space operas are no more "just space operas" that "High Noon" is just another western. Among other things, his extreme care and craftsmanship in his use of the language. Anderson is so easy to read, it is often possible to miss the deeper aspects of his books and read them just as escapist literature. It took me years to realize how beautifully crafted ALL his writting is. What made me go back and explore this was my first encounter with his Hugo winning "Goat Song" (Orpheus retold, but with very different impact and meaning). It was while I was rereading his works, enjoying the writting, that I discovered that even when plots and characters bore no relation, most of his books are tied together by a common idea/motive (not profit!). Consider, for example, the set of books "The Dancer From Atlantis" (a marvel!), "The Corridors of Time" (recently downplayed in the digest), "Three Hearts and Three Lions", "The Golden Slave", and his recent historical trilogy biographing Harold Hardrede (the titles don't come to mind at the moment. These books span a period of over thirty years, yet, if you look very closely, there is a common thread running through all of them. What is happening, is that he is looking very closely at our history and folk lore, exploring the possibilities being the myths and legends and exploring what makes us (our culture) what we are. He seems to be exploring the the way events and people shape a culture, with the aim of understanding our own culture better. (Ultimately, he is hooked on his own viking heritage.) (PS: Even van Rijn fits in with this.) About "Brain Wave" (reviewed in a recent digest) -- that book was written in the mid fifties. Given the political and social atmosphere at the time, it is not surprising that Anderson felt the brain wave necessary for liberalization of social, sexual, and dress codes. The shocks that the USA went through in the early sixties, that resulted in this liberalization, was probably almost as great as that resulting from Anderson's brain wave. ------------------------------ Date: 24 Aug 82 0:53:02-EDT (Tue) From: Speaker.umcp-cs at UDel-Relay Subject: SF TV: Starlost and Space Ark (?) and... Date: 12-Aug-82 11:10:24 PDT (Thursday) From: Mackey at PARC-MAXC Subject: SF TV: Starlost and Space Ark (?) and... I think I remember that show. It was about a family (father, son, and daughter) who are out camping and fall through a time-warp onto a planet with futuristic technology, and dinosaurs, but no civilization. This show was called 'Land of the Lost', a Sid and Marty Kroft production aired on Saturday mornings. There were some neat ideas in the story, like the Pylons that were communication/memory devices, and there were some interesting story ideas. One of those storys, called 'Tag Team', was written by Larry Niven and, true to Niven's style, focused more on the interactions of people than on his technology. Does anyone remember Space Ark? I think that was the name of it. It was about a large spaceship with millions of people scattered through it like nations. Close...this one was produced in Canada and was called 'Starlost'. Three people are trying to find the control center onboard a gigantic space ark. Apparently some catastrophe has made the earth uninhabitable so various segments of the earth's population have been uprooted and placed inside giant domes (called bio-spheres I think). Kind of like the idea behind 'Silent Running' but on a much grander scale. They get hold of a pass key that allows them to move between domes. While on the outside they discover that a plague of some sort has killed the entire crew...except those sealed within the domes... - Speaker speaker.Umcp-Cs@UDel-Relay ------------------------------ Date: 18 August 1982 14:53 edt From: Barry Margolin at MIT-MULTICS Subject: Land of the Lost The moderator correctly pointed out that the TV show about a family that falls into this weird land was not called "Starlost". The name of the show was "Land of the Lost". It was a Saturday morning TV show about eight years ago. It actually was quite good, as I remember it. There was a race of neanderthals, and they had a language of their own. The makers of the show seemed to give that up in the second or third season, and they excused it by having the little girl teach them how to speak English. I even remember a TV Guide article about the language. barmar ------------------------------ Date: 18 Aug 82 17:13:56-EDT (Wed) From: Charles Kennedy Subject: Re: SF-LOVERS Digest V6 #41 The name of the Saturday morning show that Mackey mistakenly mentioned as being "The Starlost" is really "The Land of the Lost". I too found the Pylons very interesting since they seemed technically sophisticated. I believe that in one of the episodes, one of the Pylons that controlled the weather had gone beserk (or had been sabotaged, I can't remember), but the father was able to get the Pylon working again. Chuck Kennedy ------------------------------ Date: 18 Aug 1982 15:26:24-EDT From: csin!cjh at CCA-UNIX Subject: The Starlost The pilot episode for this deservedly short-lived TV series was novelized by Edward Bryant under the title PHOENIX WITHOUT ASHES; I'd call it pretty good 50's SF (which is further ahead than most TV was at that time). The book also has "Somehow I don't think we're in Kansas, Toto", which is both the correct quote and Ellison's essay on what happened to the show. In it he specifically says that he demanded at the outset that Bova be hired as science consultant; Ellison had used Bova's technical knowledge before (notably in a short story about cars dueling on the freeway) and knew he couldn't provide the needed realism himself. Bova actually bailed out in disgust fairly early---I think before the first episode was aired. The one instance that he can point to of his advice actually being taken is in the opening shot(?), in which some jackass had wanted to show that the generation ship was drifting, aimless and uncontrolled; the camera was supposed to pan around an "Enterprise"---style control room and lock on a sailing ship's steering wheel rocking back and forth in the middle of all this high-tech clutter. Ben did persuade them that the wheel didn't belong. ------------------------------ Date: 20 Aug 1982 1236-PDT From: CARROLL at USC-ISIF Subject: Items Regarding Kevin Mackey's message in V6#41, the Saturday morning show was "Land of the Lost". Not the best stories, but some nice animation and other effects. It made extensive use of a "magicam" video system for placing live action within miniature sets. I think "The Starlost" listed a Cordwainer Bird as the creator, and that was Ellison's pseudonym.....not sure. Has there ever been a discussion about "Robinson Crusoe on Mars"? One of the best, a very good film, especially considering when it was made ( 1964). Here are the titles, who are the authors? 1. "Operation Springboard"- a crippled teenager becomes a member of the crew of the first ship to Venus... 2. "Space Winners"- some young people take part in an inter- planetary exchange program and get stranded on a planet where the primary weapon is the quarterstaff... Both of these are juvenile type stories. Did ( or does) anyone out there read comics? I really liked the Legion of Super-Heroes in the 60's. Does anyone remember Spyman, featured in the short-lived Harvey comic of the same name? He was a government agent who had lost his hand disarming a nuclear weapon w/o any tools.....his hand was replaced by a robot one, with all sorts of gadgets like detachable finger-grenades. Good stuff. Steve ( carroll@isif) ------------------------------ Date: 19 August 1982 17:18-EDT From: junkmail.umcp-cs@udel-relay Subject: to the person who replied to my mail Here's a TIP from me that you can use: Whenever you are thinking of accusing someone of TACtlessness, remember this TIP well, atTACh a rope around your neck, and direct your atTACk to yourself. We'll all be happier. ------------------------------ End of SF-LOVERS Digest ***********************