| Apple II+ Project [message #353931] |
Fri, 06 October 2017 21:45  |
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Originally posted by: Bobbi
Looks like I just adopted a new project machine - an Apple II+
It looks like a 1980 model. The power supply is silver which is unusual.
Any idea what the mystery card is in slot #4? The language card in slot #0 is some strangle clone version I have not seen before.
Link: http://www.ebay.ca/itm/263244626967
Hopefully I can get this machine working. I think it comes with a Disk II as well (seller refers to a 'hard drive' but I suspect Disk II).
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| Re: Apple II+ Project [message #353937 is a reply to message #353931] |
Fri, 06 October 2017 22:04  |
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Originally posted by: James Davis
On Friday, October 6, 2017 at 6:45:36 PM UTC-7, Bobbi wrote:
> Looks like I just adopted a new project machine - an Apple II+
>
> It looks like a 1980 model. The power supply is silver which is unusual.
>
> Any idea what the mystery card is in slot #4? The language card in slot #0 is some strangle clone version I have not seen before.
>
> Link: http://www.ebay.ca/itm/263244626967
>
> Hopefully I can get this machine working. I think it comes with a Disk II as well (seller refers to a 'hard drive' but I suspect Disk II).
Reminds me of a sound or speech recognition card I saw once.
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| Re: Apple II+ Project [message #353938 is a reply to message #353931] |
Fri, 06 October 2017 22:09 |
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Originally posted by: James Davis
On Friday, October 6, 2017 at 6:45:36 PM UTC-7, Bobbi wrote:
> Looks like I just adopted a new project machine - an Apple II+
>
> It looks like a 1980 model. The power supply is silver which is unusual.
>
> Any idea what the mystery card is in slot #4? The language card in slot #0 is some strangle clone version I have not seen before.
>
> Link: http://www.ebay.ca/itm/263244626967
>
> Hopefully I can get this machine working. I think it comes with a Disk II as well (seller refers to a 'hard drive' but I suspect Disk II).
My original 1976~7 Apple II Plus #675 had a aluminium power supply box, IIRC.
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| Re: Apple II+ Project [message #353939 is a reply to message #353937] |
Fri, 06 October 2017 22:11 |
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Originally posted by: Bobbi
Seems to have more passive components on it than anything else, including what looks like a 3.5mm phono socket. Doesn't seem to have enough logic on it to do very much ... could be a game controller of some sort maybe?
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| Re: Apple II+ Project [message #353940 is a reply to message #353939] |
Fri, 06 October 2017 22:22 |
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Originally posted by: James Davis
On Friday, October 6, 2017 at 7:11:02 PM UTC-7, Bobbi wrote:
> Seems to have more passive components on it than anything else, including what looks like a 3.5mm phono socket. Doesn't seem to have enough logic on it to do very much ... could be a game controller of some sort maybe?
The placement of the 3.5mm jack is just about identical to the one on my Lis'ner 1000 card. That is why I thought it might be something like that. But there are a lot more electronics on the L1K.
Someone posted about a similar looking card just a few months ago, asking the same thing--"What is it?" You should look it up. Got to go eat supper. Buy.
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| Re: Apple II+ Project [message #353967 is a reply to message #353941] |
Sat, 07 October 2017 14:05 |
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Originally posted by: Bobbi
Something else interesting that I notice from the (one) photo I have of the internals. This seems to be an old-ish mainboard, maybe revision 4? It is certainly not rev 7.
There seems to be some sort of modification to IC at C2 (normally 74S195), which seems to be socketed with long pins (hard to see in pic.) Also there is a four pin header just 'south' of this device, which is absent on rev 7 boards (just have solder pads instead.) 75S195 is a four bit shift register. I will consult the Ref Manual and see if it mentions the four pin header.
Any ideas about this apparent mod?
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| Re: Apple II+ Project [message #353980 is a reply to message #353967] |
Sat, 07 October 2017 19:23 |
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Originally posted by: James Davis
On Saturday, October 7, 2017 at 11:05:01 AM UTC-7, Bobbi wrote:
> Something else interesting that I notice from the (one) photo I have of the internals. This seems to be an old-ish mainboard, maybe revision 4? It is certainly not rev 7.
>
> There seems to be some sort of modification to IC at C2 (normally 74S195), which seems to be socketed with long pins (hard to see in pic.) Also there is a four pin header just 'south' of this device, which is absent on rev 7 boards (just have solder pads instead.) 75S195 is a four bit shift register. I will consult the Ref Manual and see if it mentions the four pin header.
>
> Any ideas about this apparent mod?
Look in the Red Book if it is an older motherboard.
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| Re: Apple II+ Project [message #353992 is a reply to message #353991] |
Sun, 08 October 2017 02:09 |
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Originally posted by: James Davis
On Saturday, October 7, 2017 at 9:07:54 PM UTC-7, Bobbi wrote:
> Did a bit more research. Seems it is a rev 7 board (pre-RFI). The RFI board came in mid 1981. So it quite an early II+.
The photo on ebay is gone, bidding is over. Did you buy it? Do you still have the photo?
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| Re: Apple II+ Project [message #354023 is a reply to message #354012] |
Sun, 08 October 2017 21:56 |
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Originally posted by: James Davis
On Sunday, October 8, 2017 at 2:09:03 PM UTC-7, Bobbi wrote:
> Yes I bought it ... and I still have the photo. Should have the machine this week I hope!
Bobbi,
Good for you! Have fun with it.
James Davis
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| Re: Apple II+ Project [message #354300 is a reply to message #354042] |
Thu, 12 October 2017 19:11 |
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Originally posted by: Bobbi
The Apple II+ arrived today and I have had a chance to play with it a bit. The good news is that it is working (much to my surprise.) It passes the Apple II+ Dealer Diagnostics with flying colours.
As I suspected, it is quite an early II+ serial A2S2-87816, mainboard dated 8028, and it has some quite interesting features. I snapped a few pics ...
Mainboard / baseplate pic: http://picpaste.com/IMG_20171012_163358-D9GkqlPn.jpg
1) Power Supply is silver, not gold, with a different shaped switch to usual. PSU serial is 10186.
2) Baseplate is painted grey on the inside as well as the outside.
3) Keyboard is Datanetics, with a separate encoder board. This seems to be the last 'pre-RFI' keyboard, according to Mike Willegal's page. Manufacture date is June 20 1980.
Pics: http://picpaste.com/IMG_20171012_163252-jjdFTW5c.jpg
http://picpaste.com/IMG_20171012_163304-iniuJ0z9.jpg
4) Main board is revision 7, pre-RFI. Date code 8028.
5) Language card is some no-name clone, it seems.
Pic: http://picpaste.com/IMG_20171012_152531-DBTsah6G.jpg
6) There is a strange mod to the 74LS195 at board location C2. It is mounted on a socket with long pins, about one inch above the board. Anyone have any idea why this was done?
Pic: http://picpaste.com/IMG_20171012_152610-CzUurZrS.jpg
7) There is a mystery card, with just a couple of small 74xx type devices and a 3.5mm jack.
Pic: http://picpaste.com/IMG_20171012_152708-ziZPervf.jpg
Issues I need to fix:
1) The power switch is broken (fortunately failed in the On position)
2) Something seems to be wrong with the colour burst killer circuit. Seems the colour burst is always present so text mode is very fringe-y. Any ideas how to adjust this?
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| Re: Apple II+ Project [message #354301 is a reply to message #354300] |
Thu, 12 October 2017 19:30 |
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Originally posted by: Jorge
On Friday, October 13, 2017 at 1:11:13 AM UTC+2, Bobbi wrote:
>
> 6) There is a strange mod to the 74LS195 at board location C2. It is mounted on a socket with long pins, about one inch above the board. Anyone have any idea why this was done?
> Pic: http://picpaste.com/IMG_20171012_152610-CzUurZrS.jpg
That's most likely because it has had a Sup'r terminal 80 columns card installed. You had to lift that chip @C2 and connect a PCB in its place. The PCB had wire wrap pins that are much wider than the IC pins so the IC socket on the MLB was damaged. When they removed the Sup'r terminal and put the IC back in its place it did not make good contact and the easier fix for that was to put again a wirewap socket and plug the IC into it.
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| Re: Apple II+ Project [message #354302 is a reply to message #354300] |
Thu, 12 October 2017 19:32 |
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Originally posted by: Jorge
On Friday, October 13, 2017 at 1:11:13 AM UTC+2, Bobbi wrote:
>
> 1) The power switch is broken (fortunately failed in the On position)
I'm green of envy... you won't want to sell me that power supply ? :-)
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| Re: Apple II+ Project [message #354303 is a reply to message #354300] |
Thu, 12 October 2017 19:37 |
anthonypaulo
Messages: 531
Registered: September 2013
Karma: 0
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Senior Member |
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On Thursday, October 12, 2017 at 7:11:13 PM UTC-4, Bobbi wrote:
> The Apple II+ arrived today and I have had a chance to play with it a bit. The good news is that it is working (much to my surprise.) It passes the Apple II+ Dealer Diagnostics with flying colours.
>
> As I suspected, it is quite an early II+ serial A2S2-87816, mainboard dated 8028, and it has some quite interesting features. I snapped a few pics ...
>
> Mainboard / baseplate pic: http://picpaste.com/IMG_20171012_163358-D9GkqlPn.jpg
>
> 1) Power Supply is silver, not gold, with a different shaped switch to usual. PSU serial is 10186.
>
> 2) Baseplate is painted grey on the inside as well as the outside.
>
> 3) Keyboard is Datanetics, with a separate encoder board. This seems to be the last 'pre-RFI' keyboard, according to Mike Willegal's page. Manufacture date is June 20 1980.
> Pics: http://picpaste.com/IMG_20171012_163252-jjdFTW5c.jpg
> http://picpaste.com/IMG_20171012_163304-iniuJ0z9.jpg
>
> 4) Main board is revision 7, pre-RFI. Date code 8028.
>
> 5) Language card is some no-name clone, it seems.
> Pic: http://picpaste.com/IMG_20171012_152531-DBTsah6G.jpg
>
> 6) There is a strange mod to the 74LS195 at board location C2. It is mounted on a socket with long pins, about one inch above the board. Anyone have any idea why this was done?
> Pic: http://picpaste.com/IMG_20171012_152610-CzUurZrS.jpg
>
> 7) There is a mystery card, with just a couple of small 74xx type devices and a 3.5mm jack.
> Pic: http://picpaste.com/IMG_20171012_152708-ziZPervf.jpg
>
> Issues I need to fix:
>
> 1) The power switch is broken (fortunately failed in the On position)
>
> 2) Something seems to be wrong with the colour burst killer circuit. Seems the colour burst is always present so text mode is very fringe-y. Any ideas how to adjust this?
You might want to get a new power supply from reactive micro.
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| Re: Apple II+ Project [message #354306 is a reply to message #354304] |
Thu, 12 October 2017 19:42 |
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Originally posted by: Jorge
On Friday, October 13, 2017 at 1:37:40 AM UTC+2, Bobbi wrote:
> The Sup'R Terminal makes total sense to explain the weird socket at C2. Pity I didn't get the Sup'R Terminal card as well.
No no, it's very likely the slowest 80 columns card there is. It's painful. Get a videx videoterm instead.
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| Re: Apple II+ Project [message #354307 is a reply to message #354305] |
Thu, 12 October 2017 19:45 |
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Originally posted by: Bobbi
The three devices on the mystery card are as follows:
1) 74L377 octal D flip-flop. Bus buffer I guess.
2) 386N-4 audio amplifier
3) 16 DIL chip with no markings!! (super secret).
The jack is wired to the amplifier. There is also a single transistor and a bunch of passive LCR components.
It is some kind of audio output card, but it doesn't have an AY-3-xxxx device.
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| Re: Apple II+ Project [message #354308 is a reply to message #354307] |
Thu, 12 October 2017 19:51 |
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Originally posted by: Bobbi
Mystery card connects to following bus pins only:
GND
-12V (I think)
Device Select'
D0-D7
-12V
The data lines D0-D8 and Device Select' go to the 74LS377, where they are latched and thence to the unmarked chip. Not sure if any of that helps anyone work out what this thing may do ...
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| Re: Apple II+ Project [message #354310 is a reply to message #354308] |
Thu, 12 October 2017 20:09 |
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Originally posted by: Jorge
On Friday, October 13, 2017 at 1:51:52 AM UTC+2, Bobbi wrote:
>
> The data lines D0-D8 and Device Select' go to the 74LS377, where they are latched and thence to the unmarked chip. Not sure if any of that helps anyone work out what this thing may do ...
Perhaps the super secret chip is a DTMF generator?
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| Re: Apple II+ Project [message #354325 is a reply to message #354301] |
Fri, 13 October 2017 02:20 |
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Originally posted by: James Davis
On Thursday, October 12, 2017 at 4:30:45 PM UTC-7, Jorge wrote:
> On Friday, October 13, 2017 at 1:11:13 AM UTC+2, Bobbi wrote:
>>
>> 6) There is a strange mod to the 74LS195 at board location C2. It is mounted on a socket with long pins, about one inch above the board. Anyone have any idea why this was done?
>> Pic: http://picpaste.com/IMG_20171012_152610-CzUurZrS.jpg
>
> That's most likely because it has had a Sup'r terminal 80 columns card installed. You had to lift that chip @C2 and connect a PCB in its place. The PCB had wire wrap pins that are much wider than the IC pins so the IC socket on the MLB was damaged. When they removed the Sup'r terminal and put the IC back in its place it did not make good contact and the easier fix for that was to put again a wirewap socket and plug the IC into it.
Bobbi,
If the chip & socket are ever in the way of something, the wire-wrap tines can be shortened (cut) or the original socket can be replaced.
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| Re: Apple II+ Project [message #354526 is a reply to message #354300] |
Mon, 16 October 2017 13:05 |
scott
Messages: 4237
Registered: February 2012
Karma: 0
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Senior Member |
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In article <2d6362a5-10ae-4165-89cb-c738152dc545@googlegroups.com>,
Bobbi <bobbi.manners@gmail.com> wrote:
> 1) Power Supply is silver, not gold, with a different shaped switch to
> usual. PSU serial is 10186.
That power supply looks like the one that was installed in my IIe when it
shipped. Perhaps yours isn't original, but a replacement for an earlier
power supply that went bad. Then again, it's also possible that this type
of power supply originated with the II+ at some point in its production life
and continued to be used with the IIe when it came along.
_/_
/ v \ Scott Alfter (remove the obvious to send mail)
(IIGS( https://alfter.us/ Top-posting!
\_^_/ >What's the most annoying thing on Usenet?
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| Re: Apple II+ Project [message #354527 is a reply to message #354526] |
Mon, 16 October 2017 13:14 |
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Originally posted by: Bobbi
I saw a picture of another II+ with serial number a couple hundred earlier than mine and it also had a silver power supply (with serial number 1000 later than mine - go figure!). It seems Apple had a bunch of silver supplies around that time for some reason.
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| Re: Apple II+ Project [message #355073 is a reply to message #354527] |
Sat, 21 October 2017 18:22 |
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Originally posted by: Bobbi
I successfully removed the wirewrap socket at MLB location C2, cleaned up the IC with nail board, reinserted it and system still works :) It seems the socket wasn't really damaged. I have no idea why previous owner left the wirewrap socket in there, but it is better without it!
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| Re: Apple II+ Project [message #355078 is a reply to message #355073] |
Sat, 21 October 2017 22:56 |
Michael J. Mahon
Messages: 1767
Registered: October 2012
Karma: 0
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Senior Member |
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Bobbi <bobbi.manners@gmail.com> wrote:
> I successfully removed the wirewrap socket at MLB location C2, cleaned up
> the IC with nail board, reinserted it and system still works :) It seems
> the socket wasn't really damaged. I have no idea why previous owner left
> the wirewrap socket in there, but it is better without it!
>
Well done!
--
-michael - NadaNet 3.1 and AppleCrate II: http://michaeljmahon.com
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