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Re: Eudora replacement [message #229985] Sun, 19 January 2014 08:51 Go to next message
Jay Koutavas is currently offline  Jay Koutavas
Messages: 3
Registered: January 2014
Karma: 0
Junior Member
Now that MailForge is dead, I've been pondering...

How many people would be interested in a faithful reproduction of Mac
Eudora 6.2? 10? 100?, 1000?

Probably 100, by the likes of the FB page.

I use Mac Eudora v6.2 every day, since the mid 90s. I'm a pro software
developer. I have built stuff of this complexity a number of times over,
including a Mac email client a loooong time ago for Digital Equipment
Corporation. It's not easy to build a replacement. It would take EASILY
over a year for me to do it. If I did do it, I'd stick to keeping the same
workflow and features, and simply just "Freshen-up" the look and feel (but
not change it like MailForge did).

Thoughts, comments? Collaborators? -- I'd do this project open source,
because I love Eudora mail and want it to live on indefinitely.


On Sunday, July 22, 2012 9:13:47 AM UTC-4, benjee wrote:
>
> We thought that MailForge could fill the gap, but after 5 years they are
> still in beta.
>
> Why FB? I think it is a good tool to get figure out how many really need a
> true Eudora replacement.
>
>
>
> -- Sent from my HP Pre3
>
> ------------------------------
> On 22 Jul 2012 13.57, Stephen E. Bodnar <sbo...@gci.net <javascript:>>
> wrote:
>
> On 7/21/12 10:23 PM, ben...@gmail.com <javascript:> wrote:
>> We have set up a Facebook page to discuss and to see how many of us are
>> still looking for a true Eudora replacement:
>>
>> Http://www.facebook.com/WeWantEudora
>>
>> -- Sent from my HP Pre3
>
> What if you don't do Facebook? I'm in the market for a new email client,
> and would LOVE to see a reincarnation of Eudora.
>
> I used the Eudora - Thunderbird add-on for a while, but things got a bit
> squirrely when Thunderbird started the forced update cycle.
>
> Stephen
>
> --
> You received this message because you are a member of G-Group, a group for
> those using G3, G4, and G5 desktop Macs - with a particular focus on Power
> Macs.
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Re: Eudora replacement [message #229986 is a reply to message #229985] Sun, 19 January 2014 10:34 Go to previous messageGo to next message
Barney Guzzo is currently offline  Barney Guzzo
Messages: 7
Registered: October 2012
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Junior Member
I used and enjoyed Eudora for many years and would absolutly use it as
my main email client. I am not a programmer but would be willing to
help. Beta test?


On Jan 19, 2014, at 8:51 AM, Jay Koutavas wrote:

> Now that MailForge is dead, I've been pondering...
>
> How many people would be interested in a faithful reproduction of
> Mac Eudora 6.2? 10? 100?, 1000?
>
> Probably 100, by the likes of the FB page.
>
> I use Mac Eudora v6.2 every day, since the mid 90s. I'm a pro
> software developer. I have built stuff of this complexity a number
> of times over, including a Mac email client a loooong time ago for
> Digital Equipment Corporation. It's not easy to build a replacement.
> It would take EASILY over a year for me to do it. If I did do it,
> I'd stick to keeping the same workflow and features, and simply just
> "Freshen-up" the look and feel (but not change it like MailForge did).
>
> Thoughts, comments? Collaborators? -- I'd do this project open
> source, because I love Eudora mail and want it to live on
> indefinitely.
>
>
> On Sunday, July 22, 2012 9:13:47 AM UTC-4, benjee wrote:
> We thought that MailForge could fill the gap, but after 5 years they
> are still in beta.
>
> Why FB? I think it is a good tool to get figure out how many really
> need a true Eudora replacement.
>
>
>
> -- Sent from my HP Pre3
>
> On 22 Jul 2012 13.57, Stephen E. Bodnar <sbo...@gci.net> wrote:
>
> On 7/21/12 10:23 PM, ben...@gmail.com wrote:
>> We have set up a Facebook page to discuss and to see how many of
> us are
>> still looking for a true Eudora replacement:
>>
>> Http://www.facebook.com/WeWantEudora
>>
>> -- Sent from my HP Pre3
>
> What if you don't do Facebook? I'm in the market for a new email
> client,
> and would LOVE to see a reincarnation of Eudora.
>
> I used the Eudora - Thunderbird add-on for a while, but things got a
> bit
> squirrely when Thunderbird started the forced update cycle.
>
> Stephen
>
> --
> You received this message because you are a member of G-Group, a
> group for those using G3, G4, and G5 desktop Macs - with a
> particular focus on Power Macs.
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> netiquette guide is at http://www.lowendmac.com/lists/netiquette.shtml
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>
> --
> --
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Re: Eudora replacement [message #230098 is a reply to message #229985] Sun, 19 January 2014 12:01 Go to previous messageGo to next message
Bill &amp; Bunny Kuhl is currently offline  Bill &amp; Bunny Kuhl
Messages: 1
Registered: January 2014
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Junior Member
Thank you, Jay!

I've used Eudora since first getting an email account in the days of
48k modems and well before <appleisp.net> became <themacisp.net>. I'm
currently using Eudora 6.2.4 on a 2009 MacBook Pro 17" and it is the
main reason I have not upgraded this machine further than OS 10.6.8.

I have eagerly followed threads in this group and others concerning
Eudora replacements for OS 10.7 and above with great interest and am
finally both eager and excited to know that someone may be willing to
give re-coding Eudora a try.

I would pay for a Eudora replacement, or provide a substantial sum
for donationware. To hear that it would be open-source is pretty
incredible and very much appreciated.

If this project is to be taken on, my recommendation is that it be
initiated as soon as possible.

Thanks again!
--

Bill & Bunny Kuhlman

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Re: Eudora replacement [message #230658 is a reply to message #229985] Sun, 19 January 2014 23:50 Go to previous messageGo to next message
Doug McNutt is currently offline  Doug McNutt
Messages: 38
Registered: September 2012
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Member
At 5:51 -0800 1/19/14, Jay Koutavas wrote:
> Now that MailForge is dead, I've been pondering...
>
> How many people would be interested in a faithful reproduction of Mac Eudora 6.2? 10? 100?, 1000?
>
> Probably 100, by the likes of the FB page.
>
> I use Mac Eudora v6.2 every day, since the mid 90s. I'm a pro software developer. I have built stuff of this complexity a number of times over, including a Mac email client a loooong time ago for Digital Equipment Corporation. It's not easy to build a replacement. It would take EASILY over a year for me to do it. If I did do it, I'd stick to keeping the same workflow and features, and simply just "Freshen-up" the look and feel (but not change it like MailForge did).
>
> Thoughts, comments? Collaborators? -- I'd do this project open source, because I love Eudora mail and want it to live on indefinitely.


1) You need to become acquainted with :
Reply-To: Eudora for the Mac <eudora-mac@hades.listmoms.net>
List-ID: Eudora for the Mac <eudora-mac.cartel.listmoms.net>

2) There are two different problems with Eudora. Email has changed and Apple wants iOS and OS-neXt to be written in X-code and objective C.

The whole concept of email has changed and Eudora won't be Eudora anymore if it is rewritten to handle IMAP and HTML the way other mail clients do.

Rewriting Eudora to compile in a newer Macintosh environment may be nearly impossible. It would be easier if the source code were available but it's not because of some patent issues with the search find parts of the code. Qualcomm says it can't release that because of a previous purchase agreement.

3) I'm using Eudora 5 on this OS 9.1 Mac 8500 and I find it very useful in the modern mail system. HTTP and IMAP just don't work. By refusing to read HTML and refusing to use a host that demands IMAP I find my spam problems a whole lot easier. Folks who want to talk soon get the idea.

4) What I'd really like to see is a version of Eudora that works in Linux with open source code. I might have some time to help with that. Most of the things I want could be done with perl which would be somewhat platform independent.
--

--> From the U S of A, the only socialist country that refuses to admit it. <--

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Re: Eudora replacement [message #231086 is a reply to message #229985] Mon, 20 January 2014 07:14 Go to previous messageGo to next message
James I Fraser is currently offline  James I Fraser
Messages: 2
Registered: January 2014
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Junior Member
Wonderful, Jay!

I've been using Eudora since Apple ][c with handbuilt 1200/75 modem,
and will stick with OS 10.6.8 until Eudora surfaces in a Mavericks or
greater, version.

I too, would be happy to pay, and beta test!

Best wishes,

James



> Now that MailForge is dead, I've been pondering...
>
> How many people would be interested in a faithful reproduction of
> Mac Eudora 6.2? 10? 100?, 1000?
>
> Probably 100, by the likes of the FB page.
>
> I use Mac Eudora v6.2 every day, since the mid 90s. I'm a pro
> software developer. I have built stuff of this complexity a number
> of times over, including a Mac email client a loooong time ago for
> Digital Equipment Corporation. It's not easy to build a replacement.
> It would take EASILY over a year for me to do it. If I did do it,
> I'd stick to keeping the same workflow and features, and simply just
> "Freshen-up" the look and feel (but not change it like MailForge
> did).
>
> Thoughts, comments? Collaborators? -- I'd do this project open
> source, because I love Eudora mail and want it to live on
> indefinitely.
>
>
>
> On Sunday, July 22, 2012 9:13:47 AM UTC-4, benjee wrote:
>
> We thought that MailForge could fill the gap, but after 5 years they
> are still in beta.
>
> Why FB? I think it is a good tool to get figure out how many really
> need a true Eudora replacement.
>
>
> -- Sent from my HP Pre3
>
>
> On 22 Jul 2012 13.57, Stephen E. Bodnar <<javascript:>sbo...@gci.net> wrote:
>
> On 7/21/12 10:23 PM, <javascript:>ben...@gmail.com wrote:
>> We have set up a Facebook page to discuss and to see how many of us are
>> still looking for a true Eudora replacement:
>>
>> <Http://www.facebook.com/WeWantEudora>Http://www.facebook.com/WeWantEudora
>>
>> -- Sent from my HP Pre3
>
> What if you don't do Facebook? I'm in the market for a new email client,
> and would LOVE to see a reincarnation of Eudora.
>
> I used the Eudora - Thunderbird add-on for a while, but things got a bit
> squirrely when Thunderbird started the forced update cycle.
>
> Stephen
>
> --
> You received this message because you are a member of G-Group, a
> group for those using G3, G4, and G5 desktop Macs - with a
> particular focus on Power Macs.
> The list FAQ is at
> <http://lowendmac.com/lists/g-list.shtml>http://lowendmac.com/lists/g-list.shtml
> and our netiquette guide is at
> <http://www.lowendmac.com/lists/netiquette.shtml>http://www.lowendmac.com/lists/netiquette.shtml
> To post to this group, send email to <javascript:>g3-5...@googlegroups.com
> For more options, visit this group at
> <http://groups.google.com/group/g3-5-list>http://groups.google.com/group/g3-5-list
>
> --
> --
> You received this message because you are a member of G-Group, a
> group for those using G3, G4, and G5 desktop Macs - with a
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> <http://lowendmac.com/lists/g-list.shtml>http://lowendmac.com/lists/g-list.shtml
> and our netiquette guide is at
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Re: Eudora replacement [message #231087 is a reply to message #230658] Mon, 20 January 2014 05:12 Go to previous messageGo to next message
Jay Koutavas is currently offline  Jay Koutavas
Messages: 3
Registered: January 2014
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Junior Member
Hi Doug.

At 9:50 PM -0700 1/19/14, Doug McNutt wrote:
>
> 1) You need to become acquainted with :
> Reply-To: Eudora for the Mac <eudora-mac@hades.listmoms.net>
> List-ID: Eudora for the Mac <eudora-mac.cartel.listmoms.net>

Okay.

>
> 2) There are two different problems with Eudora. Email has changed
> and Apple wants iOS and OS-neXt to be written in X-code and
> objective C.

Of course, I've been using Objective C with Xcode since 2003. Been a
C++ coder since the early 90s, and a C coder since the mid 80s.

> The whole concept of email has changed and Eudora won't be Eudora
> anymore if it is rewritten to handle IMAP and HTML the way other
> mail clients do.

As I said in my post, I'm staying feature compatible with current
Eudora (no IMAP), perhaps a better use of the WebKit though, current
Mac Eudora 6.2 HTML support running on OS X 10.6.8 is buggy and slow.

> Rewriting Eudora to compile in a newer Macintosh environment may be
> nearly impossible. It would be easier if the source code were
> available but it's not because of some patent issues with the search
> find parts of the code. Qualcomm says it can't release that because
> of a previous purchase agreement.

I would rewrite the UI in Objective C from scratch and the backend in
C/C++ portable code. I've done this enough times that the block
diagram is easily realized.

> 3) I'm using Eudora 5 on this OS 9.1 Mac 8500 and I find it very
> useful in the modern mail system. HTTP and IMAP just don't work. By
> refusing to read HTML and refusing to use a host that demands IMAP I
> find my spam problems a whole lot easier. Folks who want to talk
> soon get the idea.

I won't be supporting OS 9.1, sorry.

> 4) What I'd really like to see is a version of Eudora that works in
> Linux with open source code. I might have some time to help with
> that. Most of the things I want could be done with perl which would
> be somewhat platform independent.
> --

A Linux UI layer is possible. It can be done in any language, but the
back-end would be in C/C++ if I did this project.

/Jay
--
------------------------------------------------------------ ---
Jay Koutavas mailto:jay@heynow.com
Heynow Software http://www.heynow.com
Windham, New Hampshire, USA
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Re: Eudora replacement [message #231459 is a reply to message #229985] Mon, 20 January 2014 13:23 Go to previous messageGo to next message
Jeff Walther is currently offline  Jeff Walther
Messages: 134
Registered: August 2012
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Senior Member


On Sunday, January 19, 2014 7:51:37 AM UTC-6, Jay Koutavas wrote:
>
> Now that MailForge is dead, I've been pondering...
>
> How many people would be interested in a faithful reproduction of Mac
> Eudora 6.2? 10? 100?, 1000?
>

I would love to see a modern email client which mimics Eudora. I've been
using it since version 2.0.

Default insertion points after quoted text. :-)

Jeff Walther

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Re: Eudora replacement [message #231460 is a reply to message #229985] Mon, 20 January 2014 14:32 Go to previous messageGo to next message
Cameron Kaiser is currently offline  Cameron Kaiser
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> I won't be supporting OS 9.1, sorry.

Would you support PowerPC, preferably 10.4+?

--
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Re: Eudora replacement [message #231580 is a reply to message #231460] Mon, 20 January 2014 15:31 Go to previous messageGo to next message
Jay Koutavas is currently offline  Jay Koutavas
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Junior Member
At 11:32 AM -0800 1/20/14, Cameron Kaiser wrote:

>> I won't be supporting OS 9.1, sorry.
>
> Would you support PowerPC, preferably 10.4+?

No. The whole point of this exercise would be to move past PPC, so
"Redora" (redone Eudora) could run on Mac OS X 10.7 and later. Eudora
6.2 PPC runs fine on Mac OS 10.6.8, but breaks on 10.7+. Thus,
"Redora" would be targeted for 10.7 and later, Intel only.

/Jay

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Re: Eudora replacement [message #231581 is a reply to message #229985] Mon, 20 January 2014 16:05 Go to previous messageGo to next message
Cameron Kaiser is currently offline  Cameron Kaiser
Messages: 1622
Registered: December 2011
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Senior Member
>>> I won't be supporting OS 9.1, sorry.
>>
>> Would you support PowerPC, preferably 10.4+?
>
> No. The whole point of this exercise would be to move past PPC, so
> "Redora" (redone Eudora) could run on Mac OS X 10.7 and later. Eudora
> 6.2 PPC runs fine on Mac OS 10.6.8, but breaks on 10.7+. Thus,
> "Redora" would be targeted for 10.7 and later, Intel only.

Then, politely, why is this being discussed on a PowerPC mailing list if
we're not the intended audience?

Meanwhile, Tenfourbird works very well for my purposes when I need an PPC
OS X mail client (I am not the author, although they do use the patches
from TenFourFox as a basis).

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------------------------------------ personal: http://www.cameronkaiser.com/ --
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-- Remember, kids: for great justice take off every zig! ----------------------

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[Manager Comment] Re: Eudora replacement [message #231582 is a reply to message #231581] Mon, 20 January 2014 16:17 Go to previous messageGo to next message
Fabian Fang is currently offline  Fabian Fang
Messages: 33
Registered: August 2012
Karma: 0
Member
On Jan 20, 2014, at 1:05 PM, Cameron Kaiser wrote:

>>>> I won't be supporting OS 9.1, sorry.
>>>
>>> Would you support PowerPC, preferably 10.4+?
>>
>> No. The whole point of this exercise would be to move past PPC, so
>> "Redora" (redone Eudora) could run on Mac OS X 10.7 and later. Eudora
>> 6.2 PPC runs fine on Mac OS 10.6.8, but breaks on 10.7+. Thus,
>> "Redora" would be targeted for 10.7 and later, Intel only.
>
> Then, politely, why is this being discussed on a PowerPC mailing list if
> we're not the intended audience?


I have already asked the OP to move this thread to the LEM MacIntel Group.

Fabian Fang
LEM G-Group Manager

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Re: Eudora replacement [message #232613 is a reply to message #229985] Tue, 21 January 2014 13:04 Go to previous messageGo to next message
gifutiger is currently offline  gifutiger
Messages: 9
Registered: December 2012
Karma: 0
Junior Member
I used Eudora mail a long time ago, it was just the best. Then I changed to
Apple Mail since it was integrated into the Mac OSX operating system. I was
Okay with it until OSX 9.x.x it was a mess, then OSX 10.1.x and not it is
the worst client eMail around.

Like the other responders I would use Eudora again and be so pleased.

Cheers

Harry in San Jose, Ca

On Saturday, July 21, 2012 11:23:21 PM UTC-7, benjee wrote:
>
> We have set up a Facebook page to discuss and to see how many of us are
> still looking for a true Eudora replacement:
>
> Http://www.facebook.com/WeWantEudora
>
> -- Sent from my HP Pre3
>
>
>
>

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Re: Eudora replacement [message #232614 is a reply to message #232613] Tue, 21 January 2014 14:00 Go to previous messageGo to next message
Guy Plunkett III is currently offline  Guy Plunkett III
Messages: 6
Registered: October 2012
Karma: 0
Junior Member
I don't see that this thread has actually been moved to the MacIntel group yet ... still awaiting my subscription to kick in.

Eudora 6.2.4 behaves well enough under OSX 10.6.8 that I continue to use it day in and day out. It is *one* of the reasons that Snow Leopard is the OS I'm stopping at unless and until I cannot get hardware that supports it, and what I have becomes irreparable. Apple has essentially lost me as a computer customer.

Guy

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Re: Eudora replacement [message #232720 is a reply to message #232614] Tue, 21 January 2014 15:15 Go to previous messageGo to next message
Fabian Fang is currently offline  Fabian Fang
Messages: 33
Registered: August 2012
Karma: 0
Member
On Jan 21, 2014, at 11:00 AM, Guy Plunkett III wrote:

> I don't see that this thread has actually been moved to the MacIntel group yet ... still awaiting my subscription to kick in.


Please be reminded that LEM Group Managers occasionally close down off-topic threads, but we do not move threads. In my recent Manager Comment, I stated that I asked the OP to move the thread. It now appears that he subscribed to the G-Group only two days ago for the sole purpose of initiating this thread.

Anyone who is interested in further discussions about "Eudora replacement" for Intel Macs, or other appropriate topics, can always start a new thread at the MacIntel Group, without waiting for this OP.

Fabian Fang
LEM G-Group Manager

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Re: Eudora replacement [message #235241 is a reply to message #231580] Thu, 23 January 2014 14:34 Go to previous messageGo to next message
Dan is currently offline  Dan
Messages: 89
Registered: April 2008
Karma: 0
Member
At 3:31 PM -0500 01/20/2014, Jay Koutavas wrote:
> At 11:32 AM -0800 1/20/14, Cameron Kaiser wrote:
>>> I won't be supporting OS 9.1, sorry.
>> Would you support PowerPC, preferably 10.4+?
>
> No. The whole point of this exercise would be to move past PPC, so
> "Redora" (redone Eudora) could run on Mac OS X 10.7 and later.
> Eudora 6.2 PPC runs fine on Mac OS 10.6.8, but breaks on 10.7+.
> Thus, "Redora" would be targeted for 10.7 and later, Intel only.

Good point. But there are quite a few bugs in Eudora that manifest
themselves annoyingly often. A full featured and debugged version of
Eudora that runs on x86/OS X 10.6 and newer would be a much better
received product.

Time and again, people have cited to me two giant stumbling blocks as
their reason for not updating to OS X 10.7+. 1) loss of AppleWorks.
2) loss of Eudora *and* their hatred for all the other email clients
they've tried. So, I'd love to have a real Eudora-type client for
newer OS X.

I wonder what legal issues there be? afaik, Qualcomm owns Eudora and
doesn't play well with others. I believe it has only licensed
Eudora's interface and such to the Mozilla Foundation, for the
Penelope project - because that project is driven (although maybe
dead now) by the original Eudora developer, ?Steve Dorner?.

https://wiki.mozilla.org/Penelope

fwiw,
- Dan.
--
- Psychoceramic Emeritus; South Jersey, USA, Earth.

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Re: Eudora replacement [message #270857 is a reply to message #235241] Fri, 17 October 2014 02:59 Go to previous message
Barry Chern is currently offline  Barry Chern
Messages: 1
Registered: October 2014
Karma: 0
Junior Member
As of a week ago, I do not think 6.2.4 runs perfectly well on 10.5 on a
PPC. My mail server just started insisting we use SSL, and after struggling
with every possible little detail endlessly I still can not send or receive
any more. I have 20 years of e-mail in Eudora, and wished to keep running
it on my G5 which I will also not give up for a number of reasons. It will
work on my Intel machine at work, and for another friend who is a Eudora
and pre 10.7 hold-out. So I have to conclude at this point that it is
something wrong with the way Eudora works on a PPC as opposed to Intel that
is causing this calamity. I can not find a solution or suitable
replacement, so if anyone knows what I'm talking about and has any further
clues I'd be grateful to hear about it.

On Thursday, January 23, 2014 2:34:33 PM UTC-5, Dan wrote:
>
> At 3:31 PM -0500 01/20/2014, Jay Koutavas wrote:
>> At 11:32 AM -0800 1/20/14, Cameron Kaiser wrote:
>>>> I won't be supporting OS 9.1, sorry.
>>> Would you support PowerPC, preferably 10.4+?
>>
>> No. The whole point of this exercise would be to move past PPC, so
>> "Redora" (redone Eudora) could run on Mac OS X 10.7 and later.
>> Eudora 6.2 PPC runs fine on Mac OS 10.6.8, but breaks on 10.7+.
>> Thus, "Redora" would be targeted for 10.7 and later, Intel only.
>
> Good point. But there are quite a few bugs in Eudora that manifest
> themselves annoyingly often. A full featured and debugged version of
> Eudora that runs on x86/OS X 10.6 and newer would be a much better
> received product.
>
> Time and again, people have cited to me two giant stumbling blocks as
> their reason for not updating to OS X 10.7+. 1) loss of AppleWorks.
> 2) loss of Eudora *and* their hatred for all the other email clients
> they've tried. So, I'd love to have a real Eudora-type client for
> newer OS X.
>
> I wonder what legal issues there be? afaik, Qualcomm owns Eudora and
> doesn't play well with others. I believe it has only licensed
> Eudora's interface and such to the Mozilla Foundation, for the
> Penelope project - because that project is driven (although maybe
> dead now) by the original Eudora developer, ?Steve Dorner?.
>
> https://wiki.mozilla.org/Penelope
>
> fwiw,
> - Dan.
> --
> - Psychoceramic Emeritus; South Jersey, USA, Earth.
>

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