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A couple of VICE problems [message #139492] Fri, 01 July 2005 13:31 Go to next message
Anonymous
Karma:
Originally posted by: Michael Lehmeier

After many months I finally decided to reinstall VICE and some
of my other stuff.

There are two problems that make it hard for me to play games right
now.
First: Sound is not in sync.
Okay, after some trying I found out that changing the buffer size to
minimum, but I wonder: is this really what the buffer is for?
Does the output have to be delayed?

Second: Fire terminates the joystick movement.
I use custom keys for joystick. If I, for example, move right and fire
while doing that, my character stops. I have to hit the "right" key
again.
This is a showstopper. There are many games that become unplayable
because of that. I don't remember having that problem with older
versions of VICE.

Third: I was trying to find a solution to my numpad problem: I never
was able to use the numpad for joystick because for "up" I have to
hit "8" and for "down" "2". The 2 and the 8 are two keys away, which
is too far apart for a fast reaction with the rather slow middle
finger. I consider this a bug, no matter what the symbols on the
numpad say.
So I wanted to assign the "down" to the "5" key.
However, it doesn't matter, the numpad doesn't work as joystick
anymore. I tried the settings but Numlock or not, the numpad does
not respond.
Is this new?
And the other question: are there any keyboard file on the net with
nicer default values, like the 2->5 problem fixed?

Fourth: Is there network playing capability planned?
You know, I almost never play network games, but this would be an
exception, since many of the old games were for two players.
I tried to play with a friend by connecting our laptops using VNC,
but that didn't work well.
I mean, can it be that hard to implement that?

Fifth: I know, I have already asked that but I still don't know:
Is there a possibilty to move raw text from a unix shell into the
VICE emulator window? Some sort of cut and paste?
I have found a way to export text from VICE to the outside using
the printer driver, but that is awkward. And from the PC to the
C64 I still don't know how to do it.
It's just that the PC editors are much more confortable than the
c64 ones especially if it comes to programming.
(and no, I am not looking for cross-compilers and stuff like that)

Thanks!

--
Lehmeier Michael (Nightshade Dragon UDIC)

8:00 - 12:00 : Frohlocken!
12:00 - 20:00 : Hosianna singen!
Re: A couple of VICE problems [message #139493 is a reply to message #139492] Fri, 01 July 2005 15:38 Go to previous messageGo to next message
BlackJack is currently offline  BlackJack
Messages: 152
Registered: December 2004
Karma: 0
Senior Member
On Fri, 01 Jul 2005 19:31:23 +0200, Michael Lehmeier wrote:

> There are two problems that make it hard for me to play games right
> now.

*Two* problems numbered from *first* to **fifths**? ;-)

> First: Sound is not in sync.
> Okay, after some trying I found out that changing the buffer size to
> minimum, but I wonder: is this really what the buffer is for?
> Does the output have to be delayed?

How do you play the sound? Does the data go straight to your soundcard or
is it played via some sort of daemon? Perhaps `artsd` or `esd`!?

From the headers of your post I deduced your OS is Linux, right!?

> Fourth: Is there network playing capability planned?
> You know, I almost never play network games, but this would be an
> exception, since many of the old games were for two players.
> I tried to play with a friend by connecting our laptops using VNC,
> but that didn't work well.
> I mean, can it be that hard to implement that?

It's not that easy, especially if you don't want to mess with the games
themselves and just bolt such a feature on top of the emulator.

> Fifth: I know, I have already asked that but I still don't know:
> Is there a possibilty to move raw text from a unix shell into the
> VICE emulator window? Some sort of cut and paste?

Not that I know of. Your best bet is the monitor of VICE.

> It's just that the PC editors are much more confortable than the
> c64 ones especially if it comes to programming.
> (and no, I am not looking for cross-compilers and stuff like that)

Why not?

Ciao,
Marc 'BlackJack' Rintsch
Re: A couple of VICE problems [message #139494 is a reply to message #139492] Fri, 01 July 2005 18:56 Go to previous messageGo to next message
Dirk Jagdmann is currently offline  Dirk Jagdmann
Messages: 11
Registered: June 2005
Karma: 0
Junior Member
> While I'm speaking of MSE: Is there some way to get the programs of the
> old 64'er issues? Some archive on the Internet. I'm not sure about the
> licences.

ftp://arnold.c64.org/pub/magazines/64'er/
http://www.emu-ecke.de/index_quereinstieg.htm?/sonderheft_12 8.htm
http://www.emu-ecke.de/index_quereinstieg.htm?/buch_disk_64. htm

> One more problem.
> I use Debian.
> The VICE debian packages have the ROMs removed.

Compile yourself or your penis will shrink.

--
---> doj / cubic
----> http://cubic.org/~doj
-----> http://llg.cubic.org
Re: A couple of VICE problems [message #139495 is a reply to message #139493] Fri, 01 July 2005 20:46 Go to previous messageGo to next message
Anonymous
Karma:
Originally posted by: Michael Lehmeier

On 2005-07-01, BlackJack <blackjack@civitas64.de> wrote:
> On Fri, 01 Jul 2005 19:31:23 +0200, Michael Lehmeier wrote:
>
>> There are two problems that make it hard for me to play games right
>> now.
>
> *Two* problems numbered from *first* to **fifths**? ;-)

Well, yes, they became more while I was writing them.

>
>> First: Sound is not in sync.
>> Okay, after some trying I found out that changing the buffer size to
>> minimum, but I wonder: is this really what the buffer is for?
>> Does the output have to be delayed?
>
> How do you play the sound? Does the data go straight to your soundcard or
> is it played via some sort of daemon? Perhaps `artsd` or `esd`!?
>
> From the headers of your post I deduced your OS is Linux, right!?

I get the following output:
Sound: Opened device `uss', speed 22050Hz, fragment size 23ms, buffer size 371ms

>> Fourth: Is there network playing capability planned?
>> You know, I almost never play network games, but this would be an
>> exception, since many of the old games were for two players.
>> I tried to play with a friend by connecting our laptops using VNC,
>> but that didn't work well.
>> I mean, can it be that hard to implement that?
>
> It's not that easy, especially if you don't want to mess with the games
> themselves and just bolt such a feature on top of the emulator.

I don't know how VICE works exactly, but I thought it couldn't be too
difficult considering all that would be needed would be the keyboard,
joystick and raw vidio- and audio- output.

I also wondered because fans already hack network capability into the
strangest games that weren't even written for multiplayer to begin with.
Some RPGs for example.
And IMO it doesn't even make sense to play them multiplayer.

Contrary to that, CBM emulators seem to really scream for such a
feature IMO.

How would you play C64 games with two players without two people
glued together and their four hands on a single notebook keyboard?

No, forget that I wrote that, it isn't possible at all.
No notebook I know of has a numpad and AFAIK only one set of
custom keys can be defined for VICE.

>> Fifth: I know, I have already asked that but I still don't know:
>> Is there a possibilty to move raw text from a unix shell into the
>> VICE emulator window? Some sort of cut and paste?
>
> Not that I know of. Your best bet is the monitor of VICE.

Haven't thought of that yet.

>> It's just that the PC editors are much more confortable than the
>> c64 ones especially if it comes to programming.
>> (and no, I am not looking for cross-compilers and stuff like that)
>
> Why not?

Partly because I want to use my old tools. My old assemblers and
source code.
I also tried to scan old MSE-printouts, use a text-recognizer and then
paste it to MSE in VICE.
Didn't work however, because text recognizer software seems to have
serious problems with the old fonts.
While I'm speaking of MSE: Is there some way to get the programs of the
old 64'er issues? Some archive on the Internet. I'm not sure about the
licences.

One more problem.
I use Debian.
The VICE debian packages have the ROMs removed.
Is there some sort of debian package that extracts them from the
source packages so that I can install them later?
Right now I have to copy them manually into my VICE-directory, and that
is really awful for a debian user.

--
Lehmeier Michael (Nightshade Dragon UDIC)

8:00 - 12:00 : Frohlocken!
12:00 - 20:00 : Hosianna singen!
Re: A couple of VICE problems [message #139497 is a reply to message #139492] Sat, 02 July 2005 06:36 Go to previous messageGo to next message
Michael J. Schülke is currently offline  Michael J. Schülke
Messages: 166
Registered: July 2003
Karma: 0
Senior Member
Michael Lehmeier wrote:

> Ah, thanks!
> But the one that I needed wasn't there.
> (Sonderheft 8/1985)

You've got mail.

Michael
Re: A couple of VICE problems [message #139498 is a reply to message #139494] Sat, 02 July 2005 08:32 Go to previous messageGo to next message
Anonymous
Karma:
Originally posted by: Michael Lehmeier

On 2005-07-01, Dirk Jagdmann <doj@cubic.org> wrote:
>> While I'm speaking of MSE: Is there some way to get the programs of the
>> old 64'er issues? Some archive on the Internet. I'm not sure about the
>> licences.
>
> ftp://arnold.c64.org/pub/magazines/64'er/
> http://www.emu-ecke.de/index_quereinstieg.htm?/sonderheft_12 8.htm
> http://www.emu-ecke.de/index_quereinstieg.htm?/buch_disk_64. htm

Ah, thanks!
But the one that I needed wasn't there.
(Sonderheft 8/1985)

>> One more problem.
>> I use Debian.
>> The VICE debian packages have the ROMs removed.
>
> Compile yourself or your penis will shrink.

Tried.
Now tried again.
Doesn't work.

The ROMs are not included in the package file, even if I compile it myself.

--
Lehmeier Michael (Nightshade Dragon UDIC)

8:00 - 12:00 : Frohlocken!
12:00 - 20:00 : Hosianna singen!
Re: A couple of VICE problems [message #139505 is a reply to message #139498] Sun, 03 July 2005 18:05 Go to previous messageGo to next message
BlackJack is currently offline  BlackJack
Messages: 152
Registered: December 2004
Karma: 0
Senior Member
On Sat, 02 Jul 2005 14:32:53 +0200, Michael Lehmeier wrote:

>>> I use Debian.
>>> The VICE debian packages have the ROMs removed.
>>
>> Compile yourself or your penis will shrink.
>
> Tried.
> Now tried again.
> Doesn't work.
>
> The ROMs are not included in the package file, even if I compile it myself.

I think he means compile the original sources not the "crippled" debian
ones.

Ciao,
Marc 'BlackJack' Rintsch
Re: A couple of VICE problems [message #139506 is a reply to message #139495] Sun, 03 July 2005 18:16 Go to previous messageGo to next message
BlackJack is currently offline  BlackJack
Messages: 152
Registered: December 2004
Karma: 0
Senior Member
On Sat, 02 Jul 2005 02:46:18 +0200, Michael Lehmeier wrote:

>>> First: Sound is not in sync.
>>> Okay, after some trying I found out that changing the buffer size to
>>> minimum, but I wonder: is this really what the buffer is for?
>>> Does the output have to be delayed?
>>
>> How do you play the sound? Does the data go straight to your soundcard or
>> is it played via some sort of daemon? Perhaps `artsd` or `esd`!?
>>
>> From the headers of your post I deduced your OS is Linux, right!?
>
> I get the following output:
> Sound: Opened device `uss', speed 22050Hz, fragment size 23ms, buffer size 371ms

I have this and no probems with excessive delays::

Sound: Opened device `uss', speed 48000Hz, fragment size 21ms, buffer
size 170ms

Are you sure there's no sound daemon between program and sound card? Or
maybe your sound hardware doesn't support 22050Hz and the sound driver has
to interpolate the data which may introduce an extra delay.

>>> Fourth: Is there network playing capability planned?
>>> […]
>>
>> It's not that easy, especially if you don't want to mess with the games
>> themselves and just bolt such a feature on top of the emulator.
>
> I don't know how VICE works exactly, but I thought it couldn't be too
> difficult considering all that would be needed would be the keyboard,
> joystick and raw vidio- and audio- output.

The problem is that you have to keep two C64 emulations in sync. Down to
the emulated SID noise generator, as it is used as source for random
numbers in some games.

> How would you play C64 games with two players without two people
> glued together and their four hands on a single notebook keyboard?
>
> No, forget that I wrote that, it isn't possible at all.
> No notebook I know of has a numpad and AFAIK only one set of
> custom keys can be defined for VICE.

You can connect a real joystick or joypad to the laptop.

Ciao,
Marc 'BlackJack' Rintsch
Re: A couple of VICE problems [message #139507 is a reply to message #139505] Sun, 03 July 2005 19:53 Go to previous messageGo to next message
Dirk Jagdmann is currently offline  Dirk Jagdmann
Messages: 11
Registered: June 2005
Karma: 0
Junior Member
>> The ROMs are not included in the package file, even if I compile it myself.
>
> I think he means compile the original sources not the "crippled" debian
> ones.

Exactly. Download a fresh tar.gz from http://viceteam.org. Everything
you need is included there. I think debian people are too afraid of a
possible copyright infringment on the ROM code by a now defunct and dead
company (but that's my 2¢).

--
---> doj / cubic
----> http://cubic.org/~doj
-----> http://llg.cubic.org
Re: A couple of VICE problems [message #139509 is a reply to message #139498] Mon, 04 July 2005 04:17 Go to previous messageGo to next message
Patryk 'Silver Dream  is currently offline  Patryk 'Silver Dream
Messages: 737
Registered: July 2003
Karma: 0
Senior Member
Michael Lehmeier wrote:

[...]

>
>>> One more problem.
>>> I use Debian.
>>> The VICE debian packages have the ROMs removed.
>>
>> Compile yourself or your penis will shrink.
>
>
> Tried.
> Now tried again.
> Doesn't work.

You mean it didn't shrink? Can't be! ;-)

>
> The ROMs are not included in the package file, even if I compile it myself.
>

You don't compile the package file. You compile the package from the
sources. Then you have all you need in there.
Re: A couple of VICE problems [message #139511 is a reply to message #139507] Mon, 04 July 2005 18:10 Go to previous messageGo to next message
BlackJack is currently offline  BlackJack
Messages: 152
Registered: December 2004
Karma: 0
Senior Member
On Mon, 04 Jul 2005 01:53:29 +0200, Dirk Jagdmann wrote:

>>> The ROMs are not included in the package file, even if I compile it myself.
>>
>> I think he means compile the original sources not the "crippled" debian
>> ones.
>
> Exactly. Download a fresh tar.gz from http://viceteam.org. Everything
> you need is included there. I think debian people are too afraid of a
> possible copyright infringment on the ROM code by a now defunct and dead
> company (but that's my 2¢).

No they are not afraid of that. The ROM is copyrighted and "not free".
It's some sort of religious issue with these Debian folks. ;-)

Ciao,
Marc 'BlackJack' Rintsch
Re: A couple of VICE problems [message #139513 is a reply to message #139492] Tue, 05 July 2005 16:02 Go to previous messageGo to next message
BlackJack is currently offline  BlackJack
Messages: 152
Registered: December 2004
Karma: 0
Senior Member
On Tue, 05 Jul 2005 23:09:35 +0200, Michael Lehmeier wrote:

> It's just when you build the package, the ROMs are left out.
> If I use the original sources instead I get errors because the checksum
> doesn't work. It detects changes from debian sources to the original
> sources and exits.

What is `it` here? What detects changes from Debian sources? We
suggested downloading the original sources and compile them. Impossible
under Debian? I can't believe that.

Ciao,
Marc 'BlackJack' Rintsch
Re: A couple of VICE problems [message #139514 is a reply to message #139507] Tue, 05 July 2005 17:09 Go to previous messageGo to next message
Anonymous
Karma:
Originally posted by: Michael Lehmeier

On 2005-07-03, Dirk Jagdmann <doj@cubic.org> wrote:
>>> The ROMs are not included in the package file, even if I compile it myself.
>>
>> I think he means compile the original sources not the "crippled" debian
>> ones.
>
> Exactly. Download a fresh tar.gz from http://viceteam.org. Everything
> you need is included there. I think debian people are too afraid of a
> possible copyright infringment on the ROM code by a now defunct and dead
> company (but that's my 2¢).

It's just when you build the package, the ROMs are left out.
If I use the original sources instead I get errors because the checksum
doesn't work. It detects changes from debian sources to the original
sources and exits.

Yes, this because of licence problems.
For example, why doesn't it ask me for a source for ROMs and then install
them from there.
This is done for Acrobat Reader for example or the JavaDoc package.
Here however I have to manually copy the ROMs to an area of the harddisk
that is usually just for the installation.
This should run shivers down the spines of ever Debian user.
So I wonder why the package exists at all. I couldn't believe that there
isn't an "official" workaround for the problem.

Now I guess I will look for an RPM package and convert it to Deb.
This may break some dependencies but it is a somewhat clean way.
Once I've found an RPM for AMD64 that is.

--
Lehmeier Michael (Nightshade Dragon UDIC)

8:00 - 12:00 : Frohlocken!
12:00 - 20:00 : Hosianna singen!
Re: A couple of VICE problems [message #139515 is a reply to message #139506] Tue, 05 July 2005 17:27 Go to previous messageGo to next message
Anonymous
Karma:
Originally posted by: Michael Lehmeier

On 2005-07-03, BlackJack <blackjack@civitas64.de> wrote:
> On Sat, 02 Jul 2005 02:46:18 +0200, Michael Lehmeier wrote:
>>
>> I get the following output:
>> Sound: Opened device `uss', speed 22050Hz, fragment size 23ms, buffer size 371ms
>
> I have this and no probems with excessive delays::
>
> Sound: Opened device `uss', speed 48000Hz, fragment size 21ms, buffer
> size 170ms
>
> Are you sure there's no sound daemon between program and sound card? Or
> maybe your sound hardware doesn't support 22050Hz and the sound driver has
> to interpolate the data which may introduce an extra delay.

I'm positive. I have no sound daemon running.
And all other applications I use that produce sound are in sync.

>>> It's not that easy, especially if you don't want to mess with the games
>>> themselves and just bolt such a feature on top of the emulator.
>>
>> I don't know how VICE works exactly, but I thought it couldn't be too
>> difficult considering all that would be needed would be the keyboard,
>> joystick and raw vidio- and audio- output.
>
> The problem is that you have to keep two C64 emulations in sync. Down to
> the emulated SID noise generator, as it is used as source for random
> numbers in some games.

Of course that sounds like a problem.
How big a problem is that?
Isn't some sort of client-server model possible. Then you would only have
to keep one emulation running and only export the output.

>> How would you play C64 games with two players without two people
>> glued together and their four hands on a single notebook keyboard?
>>
>> No, forget that I wrote that, it isn't possible at all.
>> No notebook I know of has a numpad and AFAIK only one set of
>> custom keys can be defined for VICE.
>
> You can connect a real joystick or joypad to the laptop.

Yes.

And I don't really want to modify my old C64 joysticks for use on the PC.
Together with the problem that motion stops with every fire, I can now
hardly use VICE for gaming.

(Try playing Wizard of Wor with keyboards. It's hardly possible. If you
can't fire and move at the same time.)

--
Lehmeier Michael (Nightshade Dragon UDIC)

8:00 - 12:00 : Frohlocken!
12:00 - 20:00 : Hosianna singen!
Re: A couple of VICE problems [message #139548 is a reply to message #139513] Tue, 05 July 2005 21:03 Go to previous messageGo to next message
Anonymous
Karma:
Originally posted by: Michael Lehmeier

On 2005-07-05, BlackJack <blackjack@civitas64.de> wrote:
> On Tue, 05 Jul 2005 23:09:35 +0200, Michael Lehmeier wrote:
>
>> It's just when you build the package, the ROMs are left out.
>> If I use the original sources instead I get errors because the checksum
>> doesn't work. It detects changes from debian sources to the original
>> sources and exits.
>
> What is `it` here? What detects changes from Debian sources? We
> suggested downloading the original sources and compile them. Impossible
> under Debian? I can't believe that.

I can compile the original sources fine but I can't turn the result into
a Debian package.

With "it" I meant dpkg-buildpackage.

apt-get source vice
gets me the Sources, the diffs and descriptor needed for a debian package
compilation and extracts them.
Then I do
cd vice-1.16
to get into the extracted sources.
There I do
fakeroot dpkg-buildpackage
which configures and compiles it all and turns the result into a deb
package.

I tried copying the ROMS from the original sources into the extracted
source tree but dpkg-buildpackage notices the changes and aborts.
I don't know any way to override that abort.

--
Lehmeier Michael (Nightshade Dragon UDIC)

8:00 - 12:00 : Frohlocken!
12:00 - 20:00 : Hosianna singen!
Re: A couple of VICE problems [message #139549 is a reply to message #139548] Wed, 06 July 2005 05:35 Go to previous messageGo to next message
Spiro Trikaliotis is currently offline  Spiro Trikaliotis
Messages: 380
Registered: December 2011
Karma: 0
Senior Member
Hello Michael,

Michael Lehmeier <m_lehmeier@gmx.de> schrieb:

> I tried copying the ROMS from the original sources into the extracted
> source tree but dpkg-buildpackage notices the changes and aborts.
> I don't know any way to override that abort.

You do not only need to copy the ROMs into the extracted source file,
but also all other files (i.e. Makefile.am, Makefile.in).

Personally, I do it the following way:

# 1a. Get the sources from VICE:
apt-get source vice
rm -r vice-1.16/

# 1b. or, alternatively, get only the diff file:
wget http://ftp.debian.org/debian/pool/contrib/v/vice/vice_1.16-3 .diff.gz

# Regardless of how you got the diff file, proceed as follows:

# 2. Now, get the original VICE source tarball:
wget http://ftp.funet.fi/pub/cbm/crossplatform/emulators/VICE/vic e-1.16.tar.gz

# 3. unpack the VICE source tarball:
tar xzf vice-1.16.tar.gz

# 4. apply the Debian diff:
zcat vice_1.16-3.diff.gz|patch -p0

# 5. Now, build the package:
cd vice-1.16/; fakeroot dpkg-buildpackage

HTH,
Spiro.

--
Spiro R. Trikaliotis
http://www.trikaliotis.net/
http://cbm4win.sf.net/
Re: A couple of VICE problems [message #139550 is a reply to message #139549] Wed, 06 July 2005 14:56 Go to previous messageGo to next message
Anonymous
Karma:
Originally posted by: Michael Lehmeier

On 2005-07-06, Spiro Trikaliotis <news-200506@trikaliotis.net> wrote:
> Hello Michael,
>
> # 1a. Get the sources from VICE:
> apt-get source vice
> rm -r vice-1.16/
>
> # 1b. or, alternatively, get only the diff file:
> wget http://ftp.debian.org/debian/pool/contrib/v/vice/vice_1.16-3 .diff.gz
>
> # Regardless of how you got the diff file, proceed as follows:
>
> # 2. Now, get the original VICE source tarball:
> wget http://ftp.funet.fi/pub/cbm/crossplatform/emulators/VICE/vic e-1.16.tar.gz
>
> # 3. unpack the VICE source tarball:
> tar xzf vice-1.16.tar.gz
>
> # 4. apply the Debian diff:
> zcat vice_1.16-3.diff.gz|patch -p0
>
> # 5. Now, build the package:
> cd vice-1.16/; fakeroot dpkg-buildpackage

I did that like exactly like you wrote.
Additionally I had to give debian/rules execute permissions.

However, it doesn't work.
It behaves exactly like before, ending with:
dpkg-source: cannot represent change to data/C64/kernal: binary file contents changed
dpkg-source: cannot represent change to data/C64/basic: binary file contents changed
dpkg-source: building vice in vice_1.16-3.dsc
dpkg-source: unrepresentable changes to source

So it didn't work.
Thanks for you help anyway.

--
Lehmeier Michael (Nightshade Dragon UDIC)

8:00 - 12:00 : Frohlocken!
12:00 - 20:00 : Hosianna singen!
Re: A couple of VICE problems [message #139552 is a reply to message #139550] Thu, 07 July 2005 06:41 Go to previous messageGo to next message
Spiro Trikaliotis is currently offline  Spiro Trikaliotis
Messages: 380
Registered: December 2011
Karma: 0
Senior Member
Hello Michael,

Michael Lehmeier <m_lehmeier@gmx.de> schrieb:

> On 2005-07-06, Spiro Trikaliotis <news-200506@trikaliotis.net> wrote:
>> Hello Michael,
>>
>> # 1a. Get the sources from VICE:
>> apt-get source vice
>> rm -r vice-1.16/
>>
>> # 1b. or, alternatively, get only the diff file:
>> wget http://ftp.debian.org/debian/pool/contrib/v/vice/vice_1.16-3 .diff.gz
>>
>> # Regardless of how you got the diff file, proceed as follows:
>>
>> # 2. Now, get the original VICE source tarball:
>> wget http://ftp.funet.fi/pub/cbm/crossplatform/emulators/VICE/vic e-1.16.tar.gz
>>
>> # 3. unpack the VICE source tarball:
>> tar xzf vice-1.16.tar.gz
>>
>> # 4. apply the Debian diff:
>> zcat vice_1.16-3.diff.gz|patch -p0
>>
>> # 5. Now, build the package:
>> cd vice-1.16/; fakeroot dpkg-buildpackage
>
> I did that like exactly like you wrote.
> Additionally I had to give debian/rules execute permissions.

Oh yes, I forgot that one.

> However, it doesn't work.

It does. ;)

> It behaves exactly like before, ending with:
> dpkg-source: cannot represent change to data/C64/kernal: binary file contents changed
> dpkg-source: cannot represent change to data/C64/basic: binary file contents changed
> dpkg-source: building vice in vice_1.16-3.dsc
> dpkg-source: unrepresentable changes to source

This is only a warning, isn't it? At least on my machine, a deb is
generated, nevertheless.

If this disturbs you, then remove (or rename) the vice ".orig." file
from the directory above vice-1.16 (if you used apt-get source). This
way, this warning goes away.

Background: dpkg-buildpackage wants to generate an appropriate diff to
the .orig. package. Anyway, it finds out that the .orig. tarball is not
the same as the base of your generated vice-1.16.

HTH,
Spiro.

--
Spiro R. Trikaliotis
http://www.trikaliotis.net/
http://cbm4win.sf.net/
Re: A couple of VICE problems [message #139553 is a reply to message #139552] Thu, 07 July 2005 15:27 Go to previous messageGo to next message
Anonymous
Karma:
Originally posted by: Michael Lehmeier

On 2005-07-07, Spiro Trikaliotis <news-200506@trikaliotis.net> wrote:
>
> If this disturbs you, then remove (or rename) the vice ".orig." file
> from the directory above vice-1.16 (if you used apt-get source). This
> way, this warning goes away.

The problem was that I left the real .orig. file in
the parent directory and just extracted the original
VICE sources from another source.
Now I copied the VICE sources over the package sources
before extracting and the error goes away.

I still get a warning (probably the one you meant) about
a wrong GPG key, but that can be ignored.

So this is the full way:

apt-get source vice
wget -c <vice url>/vice-1.16.tar.gz
mv vice-1.16.tar.gz vice_1.16.orig.tar.gz
tar -zxvf vice_1.16.orig.tar.gz
zcat vice_1.16-3.diff.gz | patch -p0
cd vice-1.16
chmod a+x debian/rules
fakeroot dpkg-buildpackage
cd ..

Thanks!
One problem solved, several to go!

(at least the "stop on fire" problem must be solved until
I can play games again)

--
Lehmeier Michael (Nightshade Dragon UDIC)

8:00 - 12:00 : Frohlocken!
12:00 - 20:00 : Hosianna singen!
Re: A couple of VICE problems [message #139559 is a reply to message #139553] Sat, 09 July 2005 09:35 Go to previous messageGo to next message
Spiro Trikaliotis is currently offline  Spiro Trikaliotis
Messages: 380
Registered: December 2011
Karma: 0
Senior Member
Hello Michael,

Michael Lehmeier <m_lehmeier@gmx.de> schrieb:

> (at least the "stop on fire" problem must be solved until
> I can play games again)

You meant that one (from your first post):

>> Second: Fire terminates the joystick movement.
>> I use custom keys for joystick. If I, for example, move right and fire
>> while doing that, my character stops. I have to hit the "right" key
>> again.
>> This is a showstopper. There are many games that become unplayable
>> because of that. I don't remember having that problem with older
>> versions of VICE.

Are you sure you tested this with previous versions of VICE on the same
machine and with the same keyboard?

Many keyboards have problems with recognizing simultaneous keypresses.
Even if the keyboard supports it, some combinations of mainboard,
operating system and the daylight ;) can change this behaviour. Thus, if
you reinstalled you OS, this might have influence, too.

If you are really sure it worked before and does not anymore (it would
be best if you could actually test an older version on exactly the same
machine with exactly the same configuration), then come back here. ;)

Regards,
Spiro.

--
Spiro R. Trikaliotis
http://www.trikaliotis.net/
http://cbm4win.sf.net/
Re: A couple of VICE problems [message #139567 is a reply to message #139559] Wed, 13 July 2005 18:20 Go to previous messageGo to next message
Anonymous
Karma:
Originally posted by: Michael Lehmeier

On 2005-07-09, Spiro Trikaliotis <news-200506@trikaliotis.net> wrote:
> Hello Michael,
>
> Michael Lehmeier <m_lehmeier@gmx.de> schrieb:
>
>> (at least the "stop on fire" problem must be solved until
>> I can play games again)
>
> You meant that one (from your first post):
>
>>> Second: Fire terminates the joystick movement.
>>> I use custom keys for joystick. If I, for example, move right and fire
>>> while doing that, my character stops. I have to hit the "right" key
>>> again.
>>> This is a showstopper. There are many games that become unplayable
>>> because of that. I don't remember having that problem with older
>>> versions of VICE.
>
> Are you sure you tested this with previous versions of VICE on the same
> machine and with the same keyboard?

Probably not the same machine since I change parts now and then.
But definitely the same keyboard. My keyboard is now in use for eight years and
shows no signs of aging. :)

> Many keyboards have problems with recognizing simultaneous keypresses.
> Even if the keyboard supports it, some combinations of mainboard,
> operating system and the daylight ;) can change this behaviour. Thus, if
> you reinstalled you OS, this might have influence, too.
>
> If you are really sure it worked before and does not anymore (it would
> be best if you could actually test an older version on exactly the same
> machine with exactly the same configuration), then come back here. ;)

I tried today.
I downloaded several versions of the sources but couldn't compile a
single one of them.
The only build that succeeds are the debian sources with patch applied.
(not without the patch)

I once knew an archive that keeps the outdated debian packages but forgot
where it is.
So I'm stuck right now.

--
Lehmeier Michael (Nightshade Dragon UDIC)

8:00 - 12:00 : Frohlocken!
12:00 - 20:00 : Hosianna singen!
Re: A couple of VICE problems [message #139607 is a reply to message #139567] Mon, 25 July 2005 12:17 Go to previous messageGo to next message
Spiro Trikaliotis is currently offline  Spiro Trikaliotis
Messages: 380
Registered: December 2011
Karma: 0
Senior Member
Hello Michael,

Michael Lehmeier <m_lehmeier@gmx.de> schrieb:

[Testing with older VICE versions on a Debian system]

> I downloaded several versions of the sources but couldn't compile a
> single one of them.
> The only build that succeeds are the debian sources with patch
> applied. (not without the patch)

Normally, I build VICE myself by replacing the Debian sources with the
original (from http://www.viceteam.org/) and just compiling. It always
worked great. Did you do that?

Regards,
Spiro.

--
Spiro R. Trikaliotis
http://www.trikaliotis.net/
http://cbm4win.sf.net/
Re: A couple of VICE problems [message #139634 is a reply to message #139607] Fri, 29 July 2005 09:56 Go to previous messageGo to next message
Anonymous
Karma:
Originally posted by: Michael Lehmeier

On 2005-07-25, Spiro Trikaliotis <news-200507@trikaliotis.net> wrote:
> Hello Michael,
>
> Michael Lehmeier <m_lehmeier@gmx.de> schrieb:
>
> [Testing with older VICE versions on a Debian system]
>
>> I downloaded several versions of the sources but couldn't compile a
>> single one of them.
>> The only build that succeeds are the debian sources with patch
>> applied. (not without the patch)
>
> Normally, I build VICE myself by replacing the Debian sources with the
> original (from http://www.viceteam.org/) and just compiling. It always
> worked great. Did you do that?

I tried the orignal sources. Didn't work.
Then the debian sources with patch. Did work.
Then the debian sources without patch. Didn't work.

Problem: It's been some time now so I don't remember on which
architectures I tried that.
Right now I'm working on an AMD64 linux, that might have to do something
with the problem.

Anyway, I tried something different last night.
There is one old linux version that I was able to get: The i386 version
of the Woody branch.

It was the 1.8 version.

I extracted the x64 file and run it on my i386 laptop. It also uses the
current VICE which is 1.16.

I can confirm the problem/bug.
The 1.8 version allows me to shoot and move at the same time.
The 1.16 version breaks off movement every time I hit fire.

So that you can compare, I use the following keyboard.vkm in order to
control my joystick.
The arrow keys are for movement, the right control key for fire.

Maybe here lies the problem.
I never fully understood how the key file works.
Maybe the semantics changed a little as the versions progressed.

!CLEAR
!LSHIFT 1 7
!RSHIFT 6 4

# Tab = CTRL
Tab 7 2 8
# Shift + Tab = CTRL
ISO_Left_Tab 7 2 8

# Control_L = CBM
Control_L 7 5 8

BackSpace 0 0 8
Delete 0 0 8
Down 0 7 8
Escape 7 7 8
F1 0 4 8
F2 0 4 1
F3 0 5 8
F4 0 5 1
F5 0 6 8
F6 0 6 1
F7 0 3 8
F8 0 3 1
Home 6 3 8
Insert 0 0 16
KP_F1 0 4 8
KP_F2 0 5 8
KP_F3 0 6 8
KP_F4 0 2 8
Left 0 2 1
Return 0 1 8
Right 0 2 8
Shift_L 1 7 2
Shift_R 6 4 4
Up 0 7 1

ampersand 2 3 1
apostrophe 3 0 1
asciicircum 6 6 0
asciitilde 6 6 0
asterisk 6 1 0
at 5 6 0
backslash 6 0 0
bar 6 0 8
bracketleft 5 5 1
bracketright 6 2 1
colon 5 5 0
comma 5 7 0
dollar 1 3 1
equal 6 5 0
exclam 7 0 1
grave 6 6 0
greater 5 4 1
less 5 7 1
minus 5 3 0
numbersign 1 0 1
parenleft 3 3 1
parenright 4 0 1
percent 2 0 1
period 5 4 0
plus 5 0 0
question 6 7 1
quotedbl 7 3 1
semicolon 6 2 0
slash 6 7 0
space 7 4 8
sterling 6 0 0
underscore 7 1 0

0 4 3 0
1 7 0 0
2 7 3 0
3 1 0 0
4 1 3 0
5 2 0 0
6 2 3 0
7 3 0 0
8 3 3 0
9 4 0 0

A 1 2 1
B 3 4 1
C 2 4 1
D 2 2 1
E 1 6 1
F 2 5 1
G 3 2 1
H 3 5 1
I 4 1 1
J 4 2 1
K 4 5 1
L 5 2 1
M 4 4 1
N 4 7 1
O 4 6 1
P 5 1 1
Q 7 6 1
R 2 1 1
S 1 5 1
T 2 6 1
U 3 6 1
V 3 7 1
W 1 1 1
X 2 7 1
Y 3 1 1
Z 1 4 1
a 1 2 8
b 3 4 8
c 2 4 8
d 2 2 8
e 1 6 8
f 2 5 8
g 3 2 8
h 3 5 8
i 4 1 8
j 4 2 8
k 4 5 8
l 5 2 8
m 4 4 8
n 4 7 8
o 4 6 8
p 5 1 8
q 7 6 8
r 2 1 8
s 1 5 8
t 2 6 8
u 3 6 8
v 3 7 8
w 1 1 8
x 2 7 8
y 3 1 8
z 1 4 8

#
# Joystick 1
#
#KP_0 -1 0
#KP_1 -1 1
#KP_2 -1 2
#KP_3 -1 3
#KP_4 -1 4
#KP_5 -1 5
#KP_6 -1 6
#KP_7 -1 7
#KP_8 -1 8
#KP_9 -1 9
w -1 8
#r -2 9
a -1 4
#d -2 5
d -1 6
#x -2 1
s -1 2
#v -2 3
Control_L -1 0

#
# Joystick 2
#
#w -2 7
Up -2 8
#r -2 9
Left -2 4
#d -2 5
Right -2 6
#x -2 1
Down -2 2
#v -2 3
Control_R -2 0

# Restore key mappings
Page_Up -3 0
Prior -3 1


--
Lehmeier Michael (Nightshade Dragon UDIC)

8:00 - 12:00 : Frohlocken!
12:00 - 20:00 : Hosianna singen!
Re: A couple of VICE problems [message #139640 is a reply to message #139492] Sun, 31 July 2005 13:41 Go to previous messageGo to next message
tutu is currently offline  tutu
Messages: 111
Registered: April 2013
Karma: 0
Senior Member
Michael Lehmeier schrieb:

> After many months I finally decided to reinstall VICE and some
> of my other stuff.
>
> There are two problems that make it hard for me to play games right
> now.
> [...]

Sixth:
I noticed when running Vice on a Dual Screen Computer that Vice only
displays a black window if you move the Vice Window to the 2nd Monitor.

But I didn't have an ViCE problems yet. Ok, sometimes I don't find a
key. E.g. in the C128 Mode I don't know where the ESC-Key is, as ESC is
Run/Stop. So I can't change to the high resolution mode with ESC+X.
Guess that can be found in some FAQ but it would be fine if you could
view the keyboard in Vice directly.
Re: A couple of VICE problems [message #139643 is a reply to message #139640] Mon, 01 August 2005 11:32 Go to previous message
PHead is currently offline  PHead
Messages: 44
Registered: June 2005
Karma: 0
Member
Try the F1 key in x128. I believe its mapped to the ESCape key.
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