Message-ID: <688@topaz.ARPA>
Date: Mon, 18-Feb-85 22:20:18 EST
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Posted: Mon Feb 18 22:20:18 1985
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From: FIRTH@TL-20B.ARPA


[ moderator: this is a long post; please edit at your discretion ]

We have had some fun discussing the worst SF films, but the
challenge still stands, to name the best SF films. I find
that a hard challenge, and would like to take a little time
to explain why.

What is a good film?  As a first test, one can apply to a film
the objective criteria of criticism, namely

	what is the author's intention?
	how reasonable is that intention?
	how well does the author carry it out?

This at least removes from consideration movies like "Dark Star"
(where no intention is discernable), "Things to Come" (where
the intention, of documenting an entire future history, is clearly
absurd), and "Dune" (where the execution is manifestly inadequate).

This does not get us very far.  For example, it leaves in contention
films such as "King Kong" and "The Man who fell to Earth"; both are
excellent as films, but I find both unsatisfactory as SF films.  And
for the same reason: they lack a scientific "what if" premiss.  So I
shall add the criterion that the movie must contain some extrapolation
from an assumption, plausible or implausible.

Finally, a personal view.  For me, a film is an historical document;
it cannot be taken out of its time, place, and culture.  If you care,
I can say that the film does not seem to me the true art form - the
true art form is the animated movie, and "Fantasia" or "Yellow Submarine"
transcend the circumstances of place and time that are the essence of
"Casablanca" or "A Passport to Pimlico".

And so, I looked for SF films that were

  - technically excellent
  - in the tradition of mainstream SF
  - in keeping with the spirit of their time

As the last criterion, I looked for films that, whether intentionally
or not, were "one of a kind" - not imitating, but imitated.  And
finally, to keep the list short, I arbitrarily took one movie per
decade.

The result (according to one biased observer):

	Fritz Lang : Metropolis (1926)

	Frank Capra : Lost Horizon (1937)

	Rudolph Mate' : When Worlds Collide (1951)  -- (for the 40's)

	Fred McLeod Wilcox : Forbidden Planet (1956)

	Roger Vadim : Barbarella (1967)

Here I stop, being able neither to ignore "2001"
nor to accept it.

Robert Firth
-------

Message-ID: <934@hound.UUCP>
Date: Wed, 20-Feb-85 15:16:37 EST
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Posted: Wed Feb 20 15:16:37 1985
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[]
You had a good idea, but your execution was poor. Your list
is ok, but if you prefer soft core porno to sf, we part company.
Your list should drop Barbarella and add the three greatest sf
films of all time:
Destination Moon
2001
Star Wars
Sure Star Wars is more than sf. So is Barbarella.

-- 

"It's the thought, if any, that counts!"  Dick Grantges  hound!rfg

Message-ID: <935@hound.UUCP>
Date: Wed, 20-Feb-85 15:18:32 EST
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Posted: Wed Feb 20 15:18:32 1985
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[]
p.s.:

Damn! I forgot Blade Runner.

-- 

"It's the thought, if any, that counts!"  Dick Grantges  hound!rfg

Message-ID: <488@ahuta.UUCP>
Date: Wed, 20-Feb-85 23:53:58 EST
Article-I.D.: ahuta.488
Posted: Wed Feb 20 23:53:58 1985
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REFERENCES:  <688@topaz.ARPA>

At the risk of boring most people who know me, I would say that the
science fiction film that has impressed me the most for its
sophisticated ideas and quality of narrative is QUATERMASS AND THE PIT,
known in this country by the forgetable title FIVE MILLION YEARS TO
EARTH.  In this the British start by digging a subway tunnel in London
and by the end of the film they have explanations for telekinesis,
ghosts, race memories, race prejudice, similar myths in different
cultures, and a heck of a lot more.  The BBC tv-play, shown at Seacon,
was even better than the film and a little less cryptic at times.  I
cannot remember reading a novel as thought provoking as this film.  The
story was by Nigel Kneale, one of a series of tv-plays he did revolving
around a fictional rocket scientist, Bernard Quatermass.

Incidently, while I have your attention, anyone out there know where I
can get a VHS copy of a very good and almost unknown science fiction
film called UNEARTHLY STRANGER.  It is quite a good science fiction
tale and done in black and white with no special effects at all.  That
is probably why it disappeared.  Watch for it, though.  It is really
worth it.
				Mark Leeper
				...ihnp4!ahuta!leeper

Message-ID: <159@cord.UUCP>
Date: Wed, 27-Feb-85 01:22:39 EST
Article-I.D.: cord.159
Posted: Wed Feb 27 01:22:39 1985
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> On the subject of Best SF film . Has any one seen a film called
> UBX 11.. i can't remember the whole title .
This is probably THX-1138. Done by George Lucas (I think when he was
still in school). It';s cute when you see THX 1138 on a car license
plate in American Graffiti. . .

jerry

Message-ID: <500@ahutb.UUCP>
Date: Thu, 28-Feb-85 21:02:21 EST
Article-I.D.: ahutb.500
Posted: Thu Feb 28 21:02:21 1985
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REFERENCES:  <798@topaz.ARPA>, <159@cord.UUCP>

>> On the subject of Best SF film . Has any one seen a film called
>> UBX 11.. i can't remember the whole title .
>This is probably THX-1138. Done by George Lucas (I think when he was
>still in school). It';s cute when you see THX 1138 on a car license
>plate in American Graffiti. . .
Yes and no.  At UCLA he made a 20-minute film THX 2238 4EB.  THX 1138
is his remake of his own student film.  The license plate in AMERICAN
GRAFFITI was THX 138.  There was also a reference to the title THX 1138
in STAR WARS.  Anyone wanting to send me where they think it is, use the
address below.  On March 7, I will post the answer, and the names of
everyone who got a correct answer to me.

				Mark Leeper
				...ihnp4!ahutb!leeper

Message-ID: <256@ttidcc.UUCP>
Date: Wed, 27-Feb-85 16:45:14 EST
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Posted: Wed Feb 27 16:45:14 1985
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>From: @RUTGERS.ARPA:jlong@bbnccm.arpa
>Subject: Best SF <[DFilm
>Message-ID: <798@topaz.ARPA>
>
>From: Julian R. Long 
>
>On the subject of Best SF film . Has any one seen a film called
>UBX 11.. i can't remember the whole title . It is a futureistic
>society type film (1984 ish) this guy is getting all sorts from
>them in charge , funny seens with his wife/lover? . Oh yes , the
>police are robots , everyone is bald , i think they have to
>take some drug ? now it's starting to sound like brave new world .

Sounds like you're talking about Geroge Lucas's  THX1138.  I  expect  there
will shortly be 50 more postings to that effect.

>        Also what about some of the REAL clasics like METROPOLIS .
>A must for anyone who wants to be a real s-f fan , black&white
>very old and , of course ,  silent .

And on that subject, how many people are  aware  that  _Metropolis_  wasn't
written by Fritz Lang?  One of my pet peeves is everyone referring to it as
"Fritz Lang's _Metropolis_" when the original novel was actually written by
Thea von Harbou.

-- 
==============================================================================
The Polymath (Jerry Hollombe)
Citicorp TTI                               If thy CRT offend thee, pluck
3100 Ocean Park Blvd.                      it out and cast it from thee.
Santa Monica, California  90405
(213) 450-9111, ext. 2483
{vortex,philabs}!ttidca!ttidcc!hollombe

Message-ID: <115@dolqci.UUCP>
Date: Thu, 28-Feb-85 08:20:09 EST
Article-I.D.: dolqci.115
Posted: Thu Feb 28 08:20:09 1985
Date-Received: Mon, 4-Mar-85 06:31:07 EST
References: <798@topaz.ARPA> <159@cord.UUCP>
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> > On the subject of Best SF film . Has any one seen a film called
> > UBX 11.. i can't remember the whole title .
> This is probably THX-1138. Done by George Lucas (I think when he was
> still in school). It';s cute when you see THX 1138 on a car license
> plate in American Graffiti. . .
> 
> jerry

*** REPLACE THIS LINE WITH YOUR MESSAGE ***

  Lucas is notorious for that.... In Indiana Jones and The Temple of
Doom, the Nightclub that was used in the opening scenes in Shanghai was
the Club Obi-Wan.  In at least one point in each of the Star Wars movies
the number THX-1138 was used for somthing.  (usually a guard's id or
something equally obscure.  )


-- 

  Mike Stalnaker  {decvax!grendel,cbosgd!seismo}!dolqci!mike
                  Be wary of strong drink: It can cause you to
	 	  shoot at the tax collector... and miss.