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Re: Is LINUX the inheritor of the Earth? [message #378112 is a reply to message #378089] Wed, 12 December 2018 21:11 Go to previous messageGo to next message
Anonymous
Karma:
Originally posted by: J. Clarke

On 12 Dec 2018 09:58:33 GMT, maus <mausg@mail.com> wrote:

> On 2018-12-12, AndyW <Andy@nojunqmail.com> wrote:
>> On 11/12/2018 20:14, Dan Espen wrote:
>>> My bank, a credit union, recently remodeled.
>>> There are no more tellers at a counter, each person sits at a desk.
>>> More like a travel agency than a bank.
>>
>> In my bank we have a line of ATMs inside the bank and a row of desks
>> where the tellers stand.
>>
>> I prefer the ATMs over the faux sincerity and cabin crew welcome.
>> I think I am becoming a grumpy old man...
>>
>> Andy
>>
>
>
> perhaps we should form a new group?.. Alt.grumpy.oldmen... Me first!.

Only if Sophia Loren and Ann-Margret agree to be mascots.
Re: Is LINUX the inheritor of the Earth? [message #378113 is a reply to message #378088] Wed, 12 December 2018 21:13 Go to previous messageGo to next message
Anonymous
Karma:
Originally posted by: J. Clarke

On 12 Dec 2018 09:56:29 GMT, maus <mausg@mail.com> wrote:

> On 2018-12-12, Ahem A Rivet's Shot <steveo@eircom.net> wrote:
>> On Tue, 11 Dec 2018 21:28:07 -0500
>> J. Clarke <jclarke.873638@gmail.com> wrote:
>>
>>> So solar alone is _not_ working for him. If it was he wouldn't need
>>> log burners or a pelleted wood central heating system.
>>
>> Electricity alone does not work for most people, nearly everyone
>> burns something for heat be it wood, coal, gas or oil.
>>
>
> I know of two houses that were fitted with electrical underfloor
> heating, one gave it up after a month or so, replaced it with oil.
> That was years ago, when electricity was far cheaper than now.

If you're not using electricity for heat and cooking then you're
making a symbolic gesture, not actually taking action to reduce CO2
emissions to a level the IPCC believes is survivable.

That's the trouble with most greenies, they're all about symbolism and
not substance.
Re: Is LINUX the inheritor of the Earth? [message #378114 is a reply to message #378082] Wed, 12 December 2018 21:18 Go to previous messageGo to next message
Anonymous
Karma:
Originally posted by: J. Clarke

On Wed, 12 Dec 2018 07:36:24 +0000, AndyW <Andy@nojunqmail.com> wrote:

> On 12/12/2018 02:28, J. Clarke wrote:
>> On Tue, 11 Dec 2018 10:48:58 +0000, AndyW <Andy@nojunqmail.com> wrote:
>>
>
>>> It is never going to be a one size fits all but if it works for you then
>>> fine otherwise fine.
>>> I keep getting people telling me that solar does not work despite the
>>> fact that it works fine for me.
>>> I have a fried who lives mostly off grid and has his own solar thermal
>>> system, solar PV and wind generator and battery set up yet people will
>>> patiently explain to him that solar and wind do not work despite the
>>> fact that he has been off grid for about 4 years when a storm took out
>>> his power line and he agreed with the electricity company to not bother
>>> fixing it.
>>> He also has log burners and a pelleted wood central heating system.
>>
>> So solar alone is _not_ working for him. If it was he wouldn't need
>> log burners or a pelleted wood central heating system.
>
> Nice straw man, or is it goalpost shifting? Never too sure on the overlap.
> I don't think I made the claim that solar would fill all your needs.

The goalpost is achieving the CO2 emission levels that the IPCC
believes are necessary to prevent the sky from falling.

If you're getting 10% of your energy from solar and 90% by burning
something and everyone else does the same then the sky is still going
to fall.

> Solar works for his electricity needs and solar thermal to top off his
> heat store. In the event of there not being enough sun then wind usually
> tops off his thermal store and failing that he has log burners and
> pelleted wood for boost heat.

Which is fine if he's in an area where logs and pelleted wood are
cheaper than the alternatives.
Re: Is LINUX the inheritor of the Earth? [message #378115 is a reply to message #378113] Wed, 12 December 2018 21:45 Go to previous messageGo to next message
Dan Espen is currently offline  Dan Espen
Messages: 3867
Registered: January 2012
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Senior Member
J. Clarke <jclarke.873638@gmail.com> writes:

> On 12 Dec 2018 09:56:29 GMT, maus <mausg@mail.com> wrote:
>
>> On 2018-12-12, Ahem A Rivet's Shot <steveo@eircom.net> wrote:
>>> On Tue, 11 Dec 2018 21:28:07 -0500
>>> J. Clarke <jclarke.873638@gmail.com> wrote:
>>>
>>>> So solar alone is _not_ working for him. If it was he wouldn't need
>>>> log burners or a pelleted wood central heating system.
>>>
>>> Electricity alone does not work for most people, nearly everyone
>>> burns something for heat be it wood, coal, gas or oil.
>>>
>>
>> I know of two houses that were fitted with electrical underfloor
>> heating, one gave it up after a month or so, replaced it with oil.
>> That was years ago, when electricity was far cheaper than now.
>
> If you're not using electricity for heat and cooking then you're
> making a symbolic gesture, not actually taking action to reduce CO2
> emissions to a level the IPCC believes is survivable.
>
> That's the trouble with most greenies, they're all about symbolism and
> not substance.

They mean well, which appears to be more than you can muster.

--
Dan Espen
Re: Is LINUX the inheritor of the Earth? [message #378116 is a reply to message #378115] Wed, 12 December 2018 22:31 Go to previous messageGo to next message
Anonymous
Karma:
Originally posted by: J. Clarke

On Wed, 12 Dec 2018 21:45:12 -0500, Dan Espen <dan1espen@gmail.com>
wrote:

> J. Clarke <jclarke.873638@gmail.com> writes:
>
>> On 12 Dec 2018 09:56:29 GMT, maus <mausg@mail.com> wrote:
>>
>>> On 2018-12-12, Ahem A Rivet's Shot <steveo@eircom.net> wrote:
>>>> On Tue, 11 Dec 2018 21:28:07 -0500
>>>> J. Clarke <jclarke.873638@gmail.com> wrote:
>>>>
>>>> > So solar alone is _not_ working for him. If it was he wouldn't need
>>>> > log burners or a pelleted wood central heating system.
>>>>
>>>> Electricity alone does not work for most people, nearly everyone
>>>> burns something for heat be it wood, coal, gas or oil.
>>>>
>>>
>>> I know of two houses that were fitted with electrical underfloor
>>> heating, one gave it up after a month or so, replaced it with oil.
>>> That was years ago, when electricity was far cheaper than now.
>>
>> If you're not using electricity for heat and cooking then you're
>> making a symbolic gesture, not actually taking action to reduce CO2
>> emissions to a level the IPCC believes is survivable.
>>
>> That's the trouble with most greenies, they're all about symbolism and
>> not substance.
>
> They mean well, which appears to be more than you can muster.

The road to Hell is paved with good intentions.
Re: Is LINUX the inheritor of the Earth? [message #378122 is a reply to message #376693] Thu, 13 December 2018 00:00 Go to previous messageGo to next message
Richard Thiebaud is currently offline  Richard Thiebaud
Messages: 222
Registered: May 2013
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Senior Member
On 12/12/18 9:57 PM, Dave Garland wrote:
> On 12/12/2018 8:13 PM, J. Clarke wrote:
>> On 12 Dec 2018 09:56:29 GMT, maus <mausg@mail.com> wrote:
>>
>>> On 2018-12-12, Ahem A Rivet's Shot <steveo@eircom.net> wrote:
>>>> On Tue, 11 Dec 2018 21:28:07 -0500
>>>> J. Clarke <jclarke.873638@gmail.com> wrote:
>>>>
>>>> > So solar alone is _not_ working for him.  If it was he wouldn't need
>>>> > log burners or a pelleted wood central heating system.
>>>>
>>>>     Electricity alone does not work for most people, nearly everyone
>>>> burns something for heat be it wood, coal, gas or oil.
>>>>
>>>
>>> I know of two houses that were fitted with electrical underfloor
>>> heating, one gave it up after a month or so, replaced it with oil.
>>> That was years ago, when electricity was far cheaper than now.
>>
>> If you're not using electricity for heat and cooking then you're
>> making a symbolic gesture, not actually taking action to reduce CO2
>> emissions to a level the IPCC believes is survivable.
>
> Most people do not need electricity for heat or cooking (except for the
> trivial amounts used for circulation, igniters, and control systems, or
> where "heating" means a heat pump). The only people I have known in the
> last 50 years who used electricity for heat or cooking are people living
> in relatively new apartment buildings that were built as cheaply as
> possible by scumbag developers (or in the case of cooking, buildings
> intended for elderly tenants, to minimize the risk). Natural gas or
> propane are better and cheaper throughout most of the US, though in some
> circumstances wood wins for heating on cost grounds. (And while wood is
> not particularly "green", it is renewable.)
>
> It's true that there are parts of the world where gas is not a practical
> option.
A lot of the houses in my part of Pennsylvania are all-electric for
heating and cooking. They were build in the 1950's when electricity was
cheap.
Re: Is LINUX the inheritor of the Earth? [message #378123 is a reply to message #378114] Thu, 13 December 2018 00:53 Go to previous messageGo to next message
Charlie Gibbs is currently offline  Charlie Gibbs
Messages: 5313
Registered: January 2012
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Senior Member
On 2018-12-13, J Clarke <jclarke.873638@gmail.com> wrote:

> If you're getting 10% of your energy from solar and 90% by burning
> something and everyone else does the same then the sky is still going
> to fall.

Likewise, if you're getting 90% of your energy from solar and
you bring in 10 times as many people (or each person uses 10
times as much, or any suitable combination of the two), the sky
is also still going to fall.

--
/~\ cgibbs@kltpzyxm.invalid (Charlie Gibbs)
\ / I'm really at ac.dekanfrus if you read it the right way.
X Top-posted messages will probably be ignored. See RFC1855.
/ \ Fight low-contrast text in web pages! http://contrastrebellion.com
Re: Is LINUX the inheritor of the Earth? [message #378124 is a reply to message #378086] Thu, 13 December 2018 01:32 Go to previous messageGo to next message
Bob Martin is currently offline  Bob Martin
Messages: 157
Registered: August 2012
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Senior Member
> On 2018-12-11, Andreas Kohlbach <ank@spamfence.net> wrote:>> On 11 Dec 2018 10:34:09 GMT, maus wrote:
>>>
>>> On 2018-12-11, J Clarke <jclarke.873638@gmail.com> wrote:
>>>> On Mon, 10 Dec 2018 17:15:51 -0500, Andreas Kohlbach
>>>> <ank@spamfence.net> wrote:
>>>>
>>>> >Although when in WWII France was about to be overrun by the Nazis the UK
>>>> >asked France to surrender her warships. As France declined UK destroyers
>>>> >shelled and sunk them, although France was an ally.
>>>>
>>>> Which battle are you thinking of? The only record I can find of the
>>>> British sinking French ships was Mers-El-Kebir which was mostly a
>>>> battleship engagement in North Africa.
>>>
>>> That was surely what he meant. There were a lot of French sailors killed
>>> and the French are still sore about it.
>>
>> Yes, although I could not recall where it happened. It also seems,
>> regarding <https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Attack_on_Mers-el-K%C3%A9bir>,
>> that it was an air attack, not by Navy ships as I thought.

I can't think how you got that impression, it was definitely a naval operation.
Re: Is LINUX the inheritor of the Earth? [message #378126 is a reply to message #378116] Thu, 13 December 2018 02:41 Go to previous messageGo to next message
Anonymous
Karma:
Originally posted by: AndyW

On 13/12/2018 03:31, J. Clarke wrote:
> On Wed, 12 Dec 2018 21:45:12 -0500, Dan Espen <dan1espen@gmail.com>
> wrote:

>> They mean well, which appears to be more than you can muster.
>
> The road to Hell is paved with good intentions.

....but almost every single person who has made a positive change to
their energy use has started with an intention. At least they try, maybe
they failed but at least they tried.

Aphorisms mean never having to do the thinking, just recycle something
vaguely appropriate and declare victory.

Andy
Re: Is LINUX the inheritor of the Earth? [message #378127 is a reply to message #376693] Thu, 13 December 2018 04:33 Go to previous messageGo to next message
mausg is currently offline  mausg
Messages: 2483
Registered: May 2013
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Senior Member
On 2018-12-12, Andreas Kohlbach <ank@spamfence.net> wrote:
> On Tue, 11 Dec 2018 18:29:31 -0600, JimP wrote:
>>
>> On Sun, 09 Dec 2018 16:37:51 -0500, Andreas Kohlbach
>> <ank@spamfence.net> wrote:
>>>
>>> Imagine Canada and Denmark go to war. Both are parts of the NATO...
>>
>> Turkey and Greece are also part of NATO. They ave gone to war before
>> using ships, etc. given to them as part of their NATO gear.
>
> Okay, I should had added "democratic". While is Greece (on my opinion is)
> is Turkey ruled by a dictator.

There was an election within the last year in Turkey, which the 'dictator' won.
Unusual for a dictator. (All I know is that there were a lot of posters up,
with what seemed to be differing parties names on them)

Reported by a younger person who was on holiday there.

The man is a little aggrivated because a US-based group tried a coup


--
Maus@ireland.com
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Re: Is LINUX the inheritor of the Earth? [message #378128 is a reply to message #378113] Thu, 13 December 2018 04:37 Go to previous messageGo to next message
mausg is currently offline  mausg
Messages: 2483
Registered: May 2013
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Senior Member
On 2018-12-13, J Clarke <jclarke.873638@gmail.com> wrote:
> On 12 Dec 2018 09:56:29 GMT, maus <mausg@mail.com> wrote:
>
>> On 2018-12-12, Ahem A Rivet's Shot <steveo@eircom.net> wrote:
>>> On Tue, 11 Dec 2018 21:28:07 -0500
>>> J. Clarke <jclarke.873638@gmail.com> wrote:
>>>
>>>> So solar alone is _not_ working for him. If it was he wouldn't need
>>>> log burners or a pelleted wood central heating system.
>>>
>>> Electricity alone does not work for most people, nearly everyone
>>> burns something for heat be it wood, coal, gas or oil.
>>>
>>
>> I know of two houses that were fitted with electrical underfloor
>> heating, one gave it up after a month or so, replaced it with oil.
>> That was years ago, when electricity was far cheaper than now.
>
> If you're not using electricity for heat and cooking then you're
> making a symbolic gesture, not actually taking action to reduce CO2
> emissions to a level the IPCC believes is survivable.
>
> That's the trouble with most greenies, they're all about symbolism and
> not substance.


Electric car parked permanently in front, civiliam humvee for to get
places. (Actually, a Merc, I cannot imagine how anyone could drive a Humvee
along a ordinary road)

--
Maus@ireland.com
Opinions offered om any subject:
Re: Is LINUX the inheritor of the Earth? [message #378129 is a reply to message #378113] Thu, 13 December 2018 05:12 Go to previous messageGo to next message
Ahem A Rivet's Shot is currently offline  Ahem A Rivet's Shot
Messages: 4843
Registered: January 2012
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Senior Member
On Wed, 12 Dec 2018 21:13:49 -0500
J. Clarke <jclarke.873638@gmail.com> wrote:

> If you're not using electricity for heat and cooking then you're
> making a symbolic gesture, not actually taking action to reduce CO2
> emissions to a level the IPCC believes is survivable.

In a word - no. I use electricity for cooking, lighting and so on
but for heating I use wood pellets made from sustainable forestry which is
a carbon neutral source of heat. If the grid power generation were to be
carbon neutral then my home would be with no more effort from me. Transport
is another matter.

--
Steve O'Hara-Smith | Directable Mirror Arrays
C:\>WIN | A better way to focus the sun
The computer obeys and wins. | licences available see
You lose and Bill collects. | http://www.sohara.org/
Re: Is LINUX the inheritor of the Earth? [message #378133 is a reply to message #378088] Thu, 13 December 2018 07:57 Go to previous messageGo to next message
Peter Flass is currently offline  Peter Flass
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Senior Member
maus <mausg@mail.com> wrote:
> On 2018-12-12, Ahem A Rivet's Shot <steveo@eircom.net> wrote:
>> On Tue, 11 Dec 2018 21:28:07 -0500
>> J. Clarke <jclarke.873638@gmail.com> wrote:
>>
>>> So solar alone is _not_ working for him. If it was he wouldn't need
>>> log burners or a pelleted wood central heating system.
>>
>> Electricity alone does not work for most people, nearly everyone
>> burns something for heat be it wood, coal, gas or oil.
>>
>
> I know of two houses that were fitted with electrical underfloor
> heating, one gave it up after a month or so, replaced it with oil.
> That was years ago, when electricity was far cheaper than now.
>
>

We had electric in NY and it was OK. We could close off rooms we didn't use
and keep the heat lower in rooms not used as much.

--
Pete
Re: Is LINUX the inheritor of the Earth? [message #378134 is a reply to message #378115] Thu, 13 December 2018 07:57 Go to previous messageGo to next message
Peter Flass is currently offline  Peter Flass
Messages: 8375
Registered: December 2011
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Senior Member
Dan Espen <dan1espen@gmail.com> wrote:
> J. Clarke <jclarke.873638@gmail.com> writes:
>
>> On 12 Dec 2018 09:56:29 GMT, maus <mausg@mail.com> wrote:
>>
>>> On 2018-12-12, Ahem A Rivet's Shot <steveo@eircom.net> wrote:
>>>> On Tue, 11 Dec 2018 21:28:07 -0500
>>>> J. Clarke <jclarke.873638@gmail.com> wrote:
>>>>
>>>> > So solar alone is _not_ working for him. If it was he wouldn't need
>>>> > log burners or a pelleted wood central heating system.
>>>>
>>>> Electricity alone does not work for most people, nearly everyone
>>>> burns something for heat be it wood, coal, gas or oil.
>>>>
>>>
>>> I know of two houses that were fitted with electrical underfloor
>>> heating, one gave it up after a month or so, replaced it with oil.
>>> That was years ago, when electricity was far cheaper than now.
>>
>> If you're not using electricity for heat and cooking then you're
>> making a symbolic gesture, not actually taking action to reduce CO2
>> emissions to a level the IPCC believes is survivable.
>>
>> That's the trouble with most greenies, they're all about symbolism and
>> not substance.
>
> They mean well, which appears to be more than you can muster.
>

Many of them are hypocrits, like Al Gore with his mansion. Their mantra
seems to be "we have to reduce CO2, let's start with you."

--
Pete
Re: Is LINUX the inheritor of the Earth? [message #378137 is a reply to message #378112] Thu, 13 December 2018 08:58 Go to previous messageGo to next message
scott is currently offline  scott
Messages: 4237
Registered: February 2012
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Senior Member
J. Clarke <jclarke.873638@gmail.com> writes:
> On 12 Dec 2018 09:58:33 GMT, maus <mausg@mail.com> wrote:
>
>> On 2018-12-12, AndyW <Andy@nojunqmail.com> wrote:
>>> On 11/12/2018 20:14, Dan Espen wrote:
>>>> My bank, a credit union, recently remodeled.
>>>> There are no more tellers at a counter, each person sits at a desk.
>>>> More like a travel agency than a bank.
>>>
>>> In my bank we have a line of ATMs inside the bank and a row of desks
>>> where the tellers stand.
>>>
>>> I prefer the ATMs over the faux sincerity and cabin crew welcome.
>>> I think I am becoming a grumpy old man...
>>>
>>> Andy
>>>
>>
>>
>> perhaps we should form a new group?.. Alt.grumpy.oldmen... Me first!.
>
> Only if Sophia Loren and Ann-Margret agree to be mascots.

I'd rather Peggy Lipton or maybe Susan Dey be the mascot.
Re: Is LINUX the inheritor of the Earth? [message #378138 is a reply to message #378134] Thu, 13 December 2018 09:02 Go to previous messageGo to next message
scott is currently offline  scott
Messages: 4237
Registered: February 2012
Karma: 0
Senior Member
Peter Flass <peter_flass@yahoo.com> writes:
> Dan Espen <dan1espen@gmail.com> wrote:
>> J. Clarke <jclarke.873638@gmail.com> writes:

>> They mean well, which appears to be more than you can muster.
>>
>
> Many of them are hypocrits, like Al Gore with his mansion. Their mantra
> seems to be "we have to reduce CO2, let's start with you."

Rather than parrotting propoganda from the coal industry, why
not actually do the research to back up (or refute) your
statement (which while partially true a decade ago, is not at all true
today).

https://www.factcheck.org/2009/06/al-gores-mansion/
Re: Is LINUX the inheritor of the Earth? [message #378139 is a reply to message #378113] Thu, 13 December 2018 09:03 Go to previous messageGo to next message
Anonymous
Karma:
Originally posted by: Kerr-Mudd,John

On Thu, 13 Dec 2018 02:13:49 GMT, J. Clarke <jclarke.873638@gmail.com>
wrote:

> On 12 Dec 2018 09:56:29 GMT, maus <mausg@mail.com> wrote:
>
>> On 2018-12-12, Ahem A Rivet's Shot <steveo@eircom.net> wrote:
>>> On Tue, 11 Dec 2018 21:28:07 -0500
>>> J. Clarke <jclarke.873638@gmail.com> wrote:
>>>
>>>> So solar alone is _not_ working for him. If it was he wouldn't need
>>>> log burners or a pelleted wood central heating system.
>>>
>>> Electricity alone does not work for most people, nearly everyone
>>> burns something for heat be it wood, coal, gas or oil.
>>>
>>
>> I know of two houses that were fitted with electrical underfloor
>> heating, one gave it up after a month or so, replaced it with oil.
>> That was years ago, when electricity was far cheaper than now.
>
> If you're not using electricity for heat and cooking then you're
> making a symbolic gesture, not actually taking action to reduce CO2
> emissions to a level the IPCC believes is survivable.
>
> That's the trouble with most greenies, they're all about symbolism and
> not substance.
>

And you're just carping from the sidelines; doing less than nothing to
help.

--
Bah, and indeed, Humbug.
Re: Is LINUX the inheritor of the Earth? [message #378140 is a reply to message #378114] Thu, 13 December 2018 09:04 Go to previous messageGo to next message
scott is currently offline  scott
Messages: 4237
Registered: February 2012
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Senior Member
J. Clarke <jclarke.873638@gmail.com> writes:
> On Wed, 12 Dec 2018 07:36:24 +0000, AndyW <Andy@nojunqmail.com> wrote:

>> Nice straw man, or is it goalpost shifting? Never too sure on the overlap.
>> I don't think I made the claim that solar would fill all your needs.
>
> The goalpost is achieving the CO2 emission levels that the IPCC
> believes are necessary to prevent the sky from falling.
>
> If you're getting 10% of your energy from solar and 90% by burning
> something and everyone else does the same then the sky is still going
> to fall.

Another strawman. Where do your 90% and 10% numbers originate?
Re: Is LINUX the inheritor of the Earth? [message #378144 is a reply to message #378140] Thu, 13 December 2018 10:59 Go to previous messageGo to next message
Anonymous
Karma:
Originally posted by: songbird

Scott Lurndal wrote:
....
> Another strawman. Where do your 90% and 10% numbers originate?

we are improving, but not fast enough, i still like to see
it as compared to hiding heads in the sand:

https://emissionsindex.org/#chart-3-view-1


songbird
Re: Is LINUX the inheritor of the Earth? [message #378145 is a reply to message #378137] Thu, 13 December 2018 11:23 Go to previous messageGo to next message
mausg is currently offline  mausg
Messages: 2483
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Senior Member
On 2018-12-13, Scott Lurndal <scott@slp53.sl.home> wrote:
> J. Clarke <jclarke.873638@gmail.com> writes:
>> On 12 Dec 2018 09:58:33 GMT, maus <mausg@mail.com> wrote:
>>
>>> On 2018-12-12, AndyW <Andy@nojunqmail.com> wrote:
>>>> On 11/12/2018 20:14, Dan Espen wrote:
>>>> > My bank, a credit union, recently remodeled.
>>>> > There are no more tellers at a counter, each person sits at a desk.
>>>> > More like a travel agency than a bank.
>>>>
>>>> In my bank we have a line of ATMs inside the bank and a row of desks
>>>> where the tellers stand.
>>>>
>>>> I prefer the ATMs over the faux sincerity and cabin crew welcome.
>>>> I think I am becoming a grumpy old man...
>>>>
>>>> Andy
>>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> perhaps we should form a new group?.. Alt.grumpy.oldmen... Me first!.
>>
>> Only if Sophia Loren and Ann-Margret agree to be mascots.
>
> I'd rather Peggy Lipton or maybe Susan Dey be the mascot.

Sophia, last i saw a picture of her, still looks good. Like a
lot of Italian women.

To a Wonkie, this particular thread might be homophobic. (Rock Hudson?)




--
Maus@ireland.com
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Re: Is LINUX the inheritor of the Earth? [message #378151 is a reply to message #378134] Thu, 13 December 2018 13:42 Go to previous messageGo to next message
Charlie Gibbs is currently offline  Charlie Gibbs
Messages: 5313
Registered: January 2012
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Senior Member
On 2018-12-13, Peter Flass <peter_flass@yahoo.com> wrote:

> Dan Espen <dan1espen@gmail.com> wrote:
>
>> J. Clarke <jclarke.873638@gmail.com> writes:
>>
>>> That's the trouble with most greenies, they're all about symbolism and
>>> not substance.
>>
>> They mean well, which appears to be more than you can muster.
>
> Many of them are hypocrits, like Al Gore with his mansion. Their mantra
> seems to be "we have to reduce CO2, let's start with you."

https://dilbert.com/strip/2007-06-20

--
/~\ cgibbs@kltpzyxm.invalid (Charlie Gibbs)
\ / I'm really at ac.dekanfrus if you read it the right way.
X Top-posted messages will probably be ignored. See RFC1855.
/ \ Fight low-contrast text in web pages! http://contrastrebellion.com
Re: Is LINUX the inheritor of the Earth? [message #378155 is a reply to message #378140] Thu, 13 December 2018 16:49 Go to previous messageGo to next message
Andreas Kohlbach is currently offline  Andreas Kohlbach
Messages: 1456
Registered: December 2011
Karma: 0
Senior Member
On Thu, 13 Dec 2018 14:04:07 GMT, Scott Lurndal wrote:
>
> J. Clarke <jclarke.873638@gmail.com> writes:
>>
>> The goalpost is achieving the CO2 emission levels that the IPCC
>> believes are necessary to prevent the sky from falling.
>>
>> If you're getting 10% of your energy from solar and 90% by burning
>> something and everyone else does the same then the sky is still going
>> to fall.
>
> Another strawman. Where do your 90% and 10% numbers originate?

It also depends on where you live. In Canada with a snow cover from
December to March (and higher in the north) you get less out of solar
than say in Texas. Where people panic, when they only see one snowflake.

But even for Canada solar helps, as I mentioned when the guy I know in
Toronto broke even after seven years (cost of the panels and
installation) after he installed them. Now he pays little for grid
electricity and might even feed back surplus into the grid and gets paid
for.
--
Andreas

My random thoughts and comments
https://news-commentaries.blogspot.com/
Re: Is LINUX the inheritor of the Earth? [message #378156 is a reply to message #378124] Thu, 13 December 2018 16:55 Go to previous messageGo to next message
Andreas Kohlbach is currently offline  Andreas Kohlbach
Messages: 1456
Registered: December 2011
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Senior Member
On 13 Dec 2018 06:32:35 GMT, Bob Martin wrote:
>
>> On 2018-12-11, Andreas Kohlbach <ank@spamfence.net> wrote:>> On 11 Dec 2018 10:34:09 GMT, maus wrote:
>>>>
>>>> On 2018-12-11, J Clarke <jclarke.873638@gmail.com> wrote:
>>>> >
>>>> > Which battle are you thinking of? The only record I can find of the
>>>> > British sinking French ships was Mers-El-Kebir which was mostly a
>>>> > battleship engagement in North Africa.
>>>>
>>>> That was surely what he meant. There were a lot of French sailors killed
>>>> and the French are still sore about it.
>>>
>>> Yes, although I could not recall where it happened. It also seems,
>>> regarding <https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Attack_on_Mers-el-K%C3%A9bir>,
>>> that it was an air attack, not by Navy ships as I thought.
>
> I can't think how you got that impression, it was definitely a naval operation.

| The combined air-and-sea attack was conducted by the Royal Navy after
| France had signed armistices with Germany and Italy that came into
| effect on 25 June.

You are right and the air attacks were merely a support.
--
Andreas

My random thoughts and comments
https://news-commentaries.blogspot.com/
Re: Is LINUX the inheritor of the Earth? [message #378158 is a reply to message #378145] Thu, 13 December 2018 20:07 Go to previous messageGo to next message
Anonymous
Karma:
Originally posted by: J. Clarke

On 13 Dec 2018 16:23:31 GMT, maus <mausg@mail.com> wrote:

> On 2018-12-13, Scott Lurndal <scott@slp53.sl.home> wrote:
>> J. Clarke <jclarke.873638@gmail.com> writes:
>>> On 12 Dec 2018 09:58:33 GMT, maus <mausg@mail.com> wrote:
>>>
>>>> On 2018-12-12, AndyW <Andy@nojunqmail.com> wrote:
>>>> > On 11/12/2018 20:14, Dan Espen wrote:
>>>> >> My bank, a credit union, recently remodeled.
>>>> >> There are no more tellers at a counter, each person sits at a desk.
>>>> >> More like a travel agency than a bank.
>>>> >
>>>> > In my bank we have a line of ATMs inside the bank and a row of desks
>>>> > where the tellers stand.
>>>> >
>>>> > I prefer the ATMs over the faux sincerity and cabin crew welcome.
>>>> > I think I am becoming a grumpy old man...
>>>> >
>>>> > Andy
>>>> >
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> perhaps we should form a new group?.. Alt.grumpy.oldmen... Me first!.
>>>
>>> Only if Sophia Loren and Ann-Margret agree to be mascots.
>>
>> I'd rather Peggy Lipton or maybe Susan Dey be the mascot.
>
> Sophia, last i saw a picture of her, still looks good. Like a
> lot of Italian women.
>
> To a Wonkie, this particular thread might be homophobic. (Rock Hudson?)

Just a note to the pop-culturally challenged, but:
<https://www.imdb.com/title/tt0107050/>
<https://www.imdb.com/title/tt0113228>

Note cast.
Re: Is LINUX the inheritor of the Earth? [message #378159 is a reply to message #378127] Thu, 13 December 2018 20:14 Go to previous messageGo to next message
Anonymous
Karma:
Originally posted by: J. Clarke

On 13 Dec 2018 09:33:00 GMT, maus <mausg@mail.com> wrote:

> On 2018-12-12, Andreas Kohlbach <ank@spamfence.net> wrote:
>> On Tue, 11 Dec 2018 18:29:31 -0600, JimP wrote:
>>>
>>> On Sun, 09 Dec 2018 16:37:51 -0500, Andreas Kohlbach
>>> <ank@spamfence.net> wrote:
>>>>
>>>> Imagine Canada and Denmark go to war. Both are parts of the NATO...
>>>
>>> Turkey and Greece are also part of NATO. They ave gone to war before
>>> using ships, etc. given to them as part of their NATO gear.
>>
>> Okay, I should had added "democratic". While is Greece (on my opinion is)
>> is Turkey ruled by a dictator.
>
> There was an election within the last year in Turkey, which the 'dictator' won.
> Unusual for a dictator. (All I know is that there were a lot of posters up,
> with what seemed to be differing parties names on them)

In M*A*S*H Hawkey at one point comments "Syngmun Rhee was just elected
dictator again". Stalin got elected dictator in 1937, 1946, and 1950
(there don't appear to have been any elections in the Soviet Union
during the Great Patriotic War).

> Reported by a younger person who was on holiday there.
>
> The man is a little aggrivated because a US-based group tried a coup
Re: Is LINUX the inheritor of the Earth? [message #378160 is a reply to message #378126] Thu, 13 December 2018 20:16 Go to previous messageGo to next message
Anonymous
Karma:
Originally posted by: J. Clarke

On Thu, 13 Dec 2018 07:41:43 +0000, AndyW <Andy@nojunqmail.com> wrote:

> On 13/12/2018 03:31, J. Clarke wrote:
>> On Wed, 12 Dec 2018 21:45:12 -0500, Dan Espen <dan1espen@gmail.com>
>> wrote:
>
>>> They mean well, which appears to be more than you can muster.
>>
>> The road to Hell is paved with good intentions.
>
> ...but almost every single person who has made a positive change to
> their energy use has started with an intention. At least they try, maybe
> they failed but at least they tried.
>
> Aphorisms mean never having to do the thinking, just recycle something
> vaguely appropriate and declare victory.

The problem is that people who make symbolic gestures and go on and on
and on about how virtuous they're being lead others to think that that
symbolic gesture is sufficient. If IPCC is right and if we're going
to keep the sky from falling we have to do a _lot_ more than what
you're describing. And we need the avant garde to actually start
showing how to do it.
Re: Is LINUX the inheritor of the Earth? [message #378162 is a reply to message #378128] Thu, 13 December 2018 20:20 Go to previous messageGo to next message
Anonymous
Karma:
Originally posted by: J. Clarke

On 13 Dec 2018 09:37:07 GMT, maus <mausg@mail.com> wrote:

> On 2018-12-13, J Clarke <jclarke.873638@gmail.com> wrote:
>> On 12 Dec 2018 09:56:29 GMT, maus <mausg@mail.com> wrote:
>>
>>> On 2018-12-12, Ahem A Rivet's Shot <steveo@eircom.net> wrote:
>>>> On Tue, 11 Dec 2018 21:28:07 -0500
>>>> J. Clarke <jclarke.873638@gmail.com> wrote:
>>>>
>>>> > So solar alone is _not_ working for him. If it was he wouldn't need
>>>> > log burners or a pelleted wood central heating system.
>>>>
>>>> Electricity alone does not work for most people, nearly everyone
>>>> burns something for heat be it wood, coal, gas or oil.
>>>>
>>>
>>> I know of two houses that were fitted with electrical underfloor
>>> heating, one gave it up after a month or so, replaced it with oil.
>>> That was years ago, when electricity was far cheaper than now.
>>
>> If you're not using electricity for heat and cooking then you're
>> making a symbolic gesture, not actually taking action to reduce CO2
>> emissions to a level the IPCC believes is survivable.
>>
>> That's the trouble with most greenies, they're all about symbolism and
>> not substance.
>
>
> Electric car parked permanently in front, civiliam humvee for to get
> places. (Actually, a Merc, I cannot imagine how anyone could drive a Humvee
> along a ordinary road)

A civilian humvee (unless you got one of the 11,000 or so H1s, about
4% of total Hummer production) is a glorified Suburban.
Re: Is LINUX the inheritor of the Earth? [message #378172 is a reply to message #378158] Fri, 14 December 2018 04:18 Go to previous messageGo to next message
mausg is currently offline  mausg
Messages: 2483
Registered: May 2013
Karma: 0
Senior Member
On 2018-12-14, J Clarke <jclarke.873638@gmail.com> wrote:
> On 13 Dec 2018 16:23:31 GMT, maus <mausg@mail.com> wrote:
>
>> On 2018-12-13, Scott Lurndal <scott@slp53.sl.home> wrote:
>>> J. Clarke <jclarke.873638@gmail.com> writes:
>>>
>>> I'd rather Peggy Lipton or maybe Susan Dey be the mascot.
>>
>> Sophia, last i saw a picture of her, still looks good. Like a
>> lot of Italian women.
>>
>> To a Wonkie, this particular thread might be homophobic. (Rock Hudson?)
>
> Just a note to the pop-culturally challenged, but:
> <https://www.imdb.com/title/tt0107050/>
> <https://www.imdb.com/title/tt0113228>
>
> Note cast.

My sister-in-law was left in charge of two dogs, while some of her family
went on holiday. The dogs were perpetually fighting, so she brought
them to the vet.


--
Maus@ireland.com
Opinions offered om any subject:
Re: Is LINUX the inheritor of the Earth? [message #378173 is a reply to message #378159] Fri, 14 December 2018 04:20 Go to previous messageGo to next message
mausg is currently offline  mausg
Messages: 2483
Registered: May 2013
Karma: 0
Senior Member
On 2018-12-14, J Clarke <jclarke.873638@gmail.com> wrote:
> On 13 Dec 2018 09:33:00 GMT, maus <mausg@mail.com> wrote:
>
>> On 2018-12-12, Andreas Kohlbach <ank@spamfence.net> wrote:
>>> On Tue, 11 Dec 2018 18:29:31 -0600, JimP wrote:
>>>>
>>>> On Sun, 09 Dec 2018 16:37:51 -0500, Andreas Kohlbach
>>>> <ank@spamfence.net> wrote:
>>>> >
>>>> >Imagine Canada and Denmark go to war. Both are parts of the NATO...
>>>>
>>>> Turkey and Greece are also part of NATO. They ave gone to war before
>>>> using ships, etc. given to them as part of their NATO gear.
>>>
>>> Okay, I should had added "democratic". While is Greece (on my opinion is)
>>> is Turkey ruled by a dictator.
>>
>> There was an election within the last year in Turkey, which the 'dictator' won.
>> Unusual for a dictator. (All I know is that there were a lot of posters up,
>> with what seemed to be differing parties names on them)
>
> In M*A*S*H Hawkey at one point comments "Syngmun Rhee was just elected
> dictator again". Stalin got elected dictator in 1937, 1946, and 1950
> (there don't appear to have been any elections in the Soviet Union
> during the Great Patriotic War).

I think that the war was a reason that Roosvelt was allowed to run
the last time.


>
>> Reported by a younger person who was on holiday there.
>>
>> The man is a little aggrivated because a US-based group tried a coup


--
Maus@ireland.com
Opinions offered om any subject:
Re: Is LINUX the inheritor of the Earth? [message #378174 is a reply to message #378162] Fri, 14 December 2018 04:25 Go to previous messageGo to next message
mausg is currently offline  mausg
Messages: 2483
Registered: May 2013
Karma: 0
Senior Member
On 2018-12-14, J Clarke <jclarke.873638@gmail.com> wrote:
> On 13 Dec 2018 09:37:07 GMT, maus <mausg@mail.com> wrote:
>
>> On 2018-12-13, J Clarke <jclarke.873638@gmail.com> wrote:
>>> On 12 Dec 2018 09:56:29 GMT, maus <mausg@mail.com> wrote:
>>>
>>>> On 2018-12-12, Ahem A Rivet's Shot <steveo@eircom.net> wrote:
>>>> > On Tue, 11 Dec 2018 21:28:07 -0500
>>>> > J. Clarke <jclarke.873638@gmail.com> wrote:
>>>> >
>>>> >> So solar alone is _not_ working for him. If it was he wouldn't need
>>>> >> log burners or a pelleted wood central heating system.
>>>> >
>>>> > Electricity alone does not work for most people, nearly everyone
>>>> > burns something for heat be it wood, coal, gas or oil.
>>>> >
>>>>
>>>> I know of two houses that were fitted with electrical underfloor
>>>> heating, one gave it up after a month or so, replaced it with oil.
>>>> That was years ago, when electricity was far cheaper than now.
>>>
>>> If you're not using electricity for heat and cooking then you're
>>> making a symbolic gesture, not actually taking action to reduce CO2
>>> emissions to a level the IPCC believes is survivable.
>>>
>>> That's the trouble with most greenies, they're all about symbolism and
>>> not substance.
>>
>>
>> Electric car parked permanently in front, civiliam humvee for to get
>> places. (Actually, a Merc, I cannot imagine how anyone could drive a Humvee
>> along a ordinary road)
>
> A civilian humvee (unless you got one of the 11,000 or so H1s, about
> 4% of total Hummer production) is a glorified Suburban.

Never seen one, just read of the stupidity of it. AFAIK, the humvee had
the same track width as an Abrams tank, so it can follow in the tanks
tracks across a minefield.

That would work, unless the mine was designed to go off after the first
heavy vehicle lassed over. I think a German mine during WWII was designed
to do that.


--
Maus@ireland.com
Opinions offered om any subject:
Re: Is LINUX the inheritor of the Earth? [message #378180 is a reply to message #378174] Fri, 14 December 2018 07:23 Go to previous messageGo to next message
Anonymous
Karma:
Originally posted by: J. Clarke

On 14 Dec 2018 09:25:04 GMT, maus <mausg@mail.com> wrote:

> On 2018-12-14, J Clarke <jclarke.873638@gmail.com> wrote:
>> On 13 Dec 2018 09:37:07 GMT, maus <mausg@mail.com> wrote:
>>
>>> On 2018-12-13, J Clarke <jclarke.873638@gmail.com> wrote:
>>>> On 12 Dec 2018 09:56:29 GMT, maus <mausg@mail.com> wrote:
>>>>
>>>> >On 2018-12-12, Ahem A Rivet's Shot <steveo@eircom.net> wrote:
>>>> >> On Tue, 11 Dec 2018 21:28:07 -0500
>>>> >> J. Clarke <jclarke.873638@gmail.com> wrote:
>>>> >>
>>>> >>> So solar alone is _not_ working for him. If it was he wouldn't need
>>>> >>> log burners or a pelleted wood central heating system.
>>>> >>
>>>> >> Electricity alone does not work for most people, nearly everyone
>>>> >> burns something for heat be it wood, coal, gas or oil.
>>>> >>
>>>> >
>>>> >I know of two houses that were fitted with electrical underfloor
>>>> >heating, one gave it up after a month or so, replaced it with oil.
>>>> >That was years ago, when electricity was far cheaper than now.
>>>>
>>>> If you're not using electricity for heat and cooking then you're
>>>> making a symbolic gesture, not actually taking action to reduce CO2
>>>> emissions to a level the IPCC believes is survivable.
>>>>
>>>> That's the trouble with most greenies, they're all about symbolism and
>>>> not substance.
>>>
>>>
>>> Electric car parked permanently in front, civiliam humvee for to get
>>> places. (Actually, a Merc, I cannot imagine how anyone could drive a Humvee
>>> along a ordinary road)
>>
>> A civilian humvee (unless you got one of the 11,000 or so H1s, about
>> 4% of total Hummer production) is a glorified Suburban.
>
> Never seen one, just read of the stupidity of it. AFAIK, the humvee had
> the same track width as an Abrams tank, so it can follow in the tanks
> tracks across a minefield.
>
> That would work, unless the mine was designed to go off after the first
> heavy vehicle lassed over. I think a German mine during WWII was designed
> to do that.

The Humvee 7 feet wide, about the same width as the most popular
pickup truck sold in the US. The tracks on the Abrams are about 7
feet apart and each track is more than 2 feet wide, so a Humvee fits
entirely _between_ the tracks of an Abrams. The Humvee is big and
heavy and underpowered for its size and those are the reasons that it
makes little sense as a civilian vehicle, but it isn't any less
compatible with ordinary roads than any other truck.
[OT] au-tomation [message #378181 is a reply to message #377994] Fri, 14 December 2018 08:10 Go to previous messageGo to next message
Ivan Shmakov is currently offline  Ivan Shmakov
Messages: 29
Registered: January 2013
Karma: 0
Junior Member
>>>> > maus <mausg@mail.com> writes:
>>>> > On 2018-12-11, AndyW <Andy@nojunqmail.com> wrote:
>>>> > On 10/12/2018 23:57, Joy Beeson wrote:

>>> It's been going on for decades, but I'm still gobsmacked when I see
>>> tomatoes picked by combines going to the cannery in dump trucks.

>> The downside to this is that the tomatoes have been bred for the
>> ability to survive the automated handling and flavour goes out the
>> window. Commercial tomatoes are bred for resilience and long shelf
>> life to maximise profit.

The vast majority, by weight, of the tomatoes I eat come in
glass jars, in the form where the survival of, well, form
becomes rather irrelevant. (Similarly for squashes, carrots
and, to a lesser extent, aubergines.) Makes me wonder what,
if anything, those are bred for.

[...]

> I also heard that in 'improving' the breeds of tomato, somebody bred
> one that grew into a cube.

Reminds me of that Green Acres episode...

--
FSF associate member #7257 http://am-1.org/~ivan/
Re: Is LINUX the inheritor of the Earth? [message #378183 is a reply to message #378159] Fri, 14 December 2018 09:05 Go to previous messageGo to next message
scott is currently offline  scott
Messages: 4237
Registered: February 2012
Karma: 0
Senior Member
J. Clarke <jclarke.873638@gmail.com> writes:
> On 13 Dec 2018 09:33:00 GMT, maus <mausg@mail.com> wrote:
>
>> On 2018-12-12, Andreas Kohlbach <ank@spamfence.net> wrote:
>>> On Tue, 11 Dec 2018 18:29:31 -0600, JimP wrote:
>>>>
>>>> On Sun, 09 Dec 2018 16:37:51 -0500, Andreas Kohlbach
>>>> <ank@spamfence.net> wrote:
>>>> >
>>>> >Imagine Canada and Denmark go to war. Both are parts of the NATO...
>>>>
>>>> Turkey and Greece are also part of NATO. They ave gone to war before
>>>> using ships, etc. given to them as part of their NATO gear.
>>>
>>> Okay, I should had added "democratic". While is Greece (on my opinion is)
>>> is Turkey ruled by a dictator.
>>
>> There was an election within the last year in Turkey, which the 'dictator' won.
>> Unusual for a dictator. (All I know is that there were a lot of posters up,
>> with what seemed to be differing parties names on them)
>
> In M*A*S*H Hawkey at one point comments "Syngmun Rhee was just elected
> dictator again". Stalin got elected dictator in 1937, 1946, and 1950
> (there don't appear to have been any elections in the Soviet Union
> during the Great Patriotic War).

One need not consult a fictional TV show for examples; just look
at Zimbabwe.
Re: Is LINUX the inheritor of the Earth? [message #378186 is a reply to message #378174] Fri, 14 December 2018 11:03 Go to previous messageGo to next message
Anne &amp; Lynn Wheel is currently offline  Anne &amp; Lynn Wheel
Messages: 3156
Registered: January 2012
Karma: 0
Senior Member
maus <mausg@mail.com> writes:
> Never seen one, just read of the stupidity of it. AFAIK, the humvee had
> the same track width as an Abrams tank, so it can follow in the tanks
> tracks across a minefield.
>
> That would work, unless the mine was designed to go off after the first
> heavy vehicle lassed over. I think a German mine during WWII was designed
> to do that.

there was articles about the popularity of civilian humvee in southern
cal, that it (and some other popular large truck vehicles) exceeded
weight limit of most residential streets ... so were illegal to drive in
the neighborhood.

old thread in comp.arch (weight classified as commercial vehicle
qualifying for tax break, but "illegal" on residential streets)
http://www.garlic.com/~lynn/2006s.html#13

longer discussion in a.f.c. (mentioning heavy buses allowed on
residential streets not built for such loads)
http://www.garlic.com/~lynn/2006h.html#6

more recent a.f.c. reference
http://www.garlic.com/~lynn/2017e.html#0

referencing article from 2004
http://www.slate.com/articles/news_and_politics/hey_wait_a_m inute/2004/08/californias_suv_ban.html

H1 @ 10,300 pounds and H2 at 8,600 pounds.

son-in-law was in Fallujah 2004-2005
https://www.amazon.com/Ghosts-Fallujah-Coley-D-Tyler-ebook/d p/B07J2DWWWD/
and then back again 2007-2008 in baqubah (described as worse than
fallujah). Abrams M1 flat bottom and extremely vulnerable to
IEDs (lots of armor above ground, but flat bottom and
little "blast" resistance) ... that they took to running
routes before taking Abrams out for drive.
https://www.amazon.com/Battle-Baqubah-1SG-Robert-Colella/dp/ 1469791064/

he was foot patrol in Fallujah ... but had Bradley M2A3 in Baqubah ...
talked about loosing so many Bradleys that they were eventually getting
mothballed Bradley "DS" (desert storm) as replacements ... except he
kept jerry rigging repairs for his M2A3, in part because it had more
modern communication/electronics.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/M2_Bradley#M2A3
Longer discussions
http://www.garlic.com/~lynn/2015f.html#43
http://www.garlic.com/~lynn/2015g.html#78
http://www.garlic.com/~lynn/2018d.html#96

Much of Burton's "Pentagon Wars" is about getting lots of fixes for the
original Bradley, saving large number of lives (the people he was
fighting for the fixes, got promotions and he got forced retirement).
Recent Burton reference upthread
http://www.garlic.com/~lynn/2018f.html#81
pentagon wars
https://www.amazon.com/Pentagon-Wars-Reformers-Challenge-Gua rd-ebook/dp/B00HXY969W/
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Pentagon_Wars

--
virtualization experience starting Jan1968, online at home since Mar1970
Re: Is LINUX the inheritor of the Earth? [message #378187 is a reply to message #378183] Fri, 14 December 2018 12:22 Go to previous messageGo to next message
Charlie Gibbs is currently offline  Charlie Gibbs
Messages: 5313
Registered: January 2012
Karma: 0
Senior Member
On 2018-12-14, Scott Lurndal <scott@slp53.sl.home> wrote:

> J. Clarke <jclarke.873638@gmail.com> writes:
>
>> On 13 Dec 2018 09:33:00 GMT, maus <mausg@mail.com> wrote:
>>
>>> There was an election within the last year in Turkey, which the
>>> 'dictator' won. Unusual for a dictator. (All I know is that there
>>> were a lot of posters up, with what seemed to be differing parties
>>> names on them)
>>
>> In M*A*S*H Hawkey at one point comments "Syngmun Rhee was just elected
>> dictator again". Stalin got elected dictator in 1937, 1946, and 1950
>> (there don't appear to have been any elections in the Soviet Union
>> during the Great Patriotic War).
>
> One need not consult a fictional TV show for examples; just look
> at Zimbabwe.

It's not too difficult or uncommon. All you need are ways to ensure
that the people vote "correctly".

--
/~\ cgibbs@kltpzyxm.invalid (Charlie Gibbs)
\ / I'm really at ac.dekanfrus if you read it the right way.
X Top-posted messages will probably be ignored. See RFC1855.
/ \ Fight low-contrast text in web pages! http://contrastrebellion.com
Re: Is LINUX the inheritor of the Earth? [message #378194 is a reply to message #378186] Fri, 14 December 2018 13:34 Go to previous messageGo to next message
Anonymous
Karma:
Originally posted by: J. Clarke

On Fri, 14 Dec 2018 08:03:05 -0800, Anne & Lynn Wheeler
<lynn@garlic.com> wrote:

> maus <mausg@mail.com> writes:
>> Never seen one, just read of the stupidity of it. AFAIK, the humvee had
>> the same track width as an Abrams tank, so it can follow in the tanks
>> tracks across a minefield.
>>
>> That would work, unless the mine was designed to go off after the first
>> heavy vehicle lassed over. I think a German mine during WWII was designed
>> to do that.
>
> there was articles about the popularity of civilian humvee in southern
> cal, that it (and some other popular large truck vehicles) exceeded
> weight limit of most residential streets ... so were illegal to drive in
> the neighborhood.

Check again. It weighs about the same as a good pickup truck.
Re: Is LINUX the inheritor of the Earth? [message #378195 is a reply to message #378186] Fri, 14 December 2018 13:57 Go to previous messageGo to next message
Anne &amp; Lynn Wheel is currently offline  Anne &amp; Lynn Wheel
Messages: 3156
Registered: January 2012
Karma: 0
Senior Member
Anne & Lynn Wheeler <lynn@garlic.com> writes:
> referencing article from 2004
> http://www.slate.com/articles/news_and_politics/hey_wait_a_m inute/2004/08/californias_suv_ban.html
>
> H1 @ 10,300 pounds and H2 at 8,600 pounds.

re:
http://www.garlic.com/~lynn/2018f.html#89

original hummer H1 quoted from 2004 slate article at 10,300

How Gross Vehicle Weight Rating (GVWR) Works, humvees
https://auto.howstuffworks.com/auto-parts/towing/towing-capa city/vehicle%20/gvwr13.htm

H2 still 8600, H3 reduced to 6000 from above:

2006
H1:10300
H2: 8600
H3: 5850
2007
H2: 8600
H3: 5850
2008
H2: 8600
H3: 6001
2009
H2: 8600
H3: 6001
H3T:6001

GMC GVWR 4850-9700
https://auto.howstuffworks.com/auto-parts/towing/towing-capa city/vehicle%20/gvwr11.htm
Ford GVWR 4300-14,500
https://auto.howstuffworks.com/auto-parts/towing/towing-capa city/vehicle%20/gvwr10.htm

F450 was 14,500 in 2008, reduced to 10,100 in 2009

--
virtualization experience starting Jan1968, online at home since Mar1970
Re: Is LINUX the inheritor of the Earth? [message #378196 is a reply to message #376693] Fri, 14 December 2018 14:19 Go to previous messageGo to next message
Anonymous
Karma:
Originally posted by: JimP

On Wed, 12 Dec 2018 20:57:32 -0600, Dave Garland
<dave.garland@wizinfo.com> wrote:
> On 12/12/2018 8:13 PM, J. Clarke wrote:
>> On 12 Dec 2018 09:56:29 GMT, maus <mausg@mail.com> wrote:
>>
>>> On 2018-12-12, Ahem A Rivet's Shot <steveo@eircom.net> wrote:
>>>> On Tue, 11 Dec 2018 21:28:07 -0500
>>>> J. Clarke <jclarke.873638@gmail.com> wrote:
>>>>
>>>> > So solar alone is _not_ working for him. If it was he wouldn't need
>>>> > log burners or a pelleted wood central heating system.
>>>>
>>>> Electricity alone does not work for most people, nearly everyone
>>>> burns something for heat be it wood, coal, gas or oil.
>>>>
>>>
>>> I know of two houses that were fitted with electrical underfloor
>>> heating, one gave it up after a month or so, replaced it with oil.
>>> That was years ago, when electricity was far cheaper than now.
>>
>> If you're not using electricity for heat and cooking then you're
>> making a symbolic gesture, not actually taking action to reduce CO2
>> emissions to a level the IPCC believes is survivable.
>
> Most people do not need electricity for heat or cooking (except for
> the trivial amounts used for circulation, igniters, and control
> systems, or where "heating" means a heat pump). The only people I have
> known in the last 50 years who used electricity for heat or cooking
> are people living in relatively new apartment buildings that were
> built as cheaply as possible by scumbag developers (or in the case of
> cooking, buildings intended for elderly tenants, to minimize the
> risk). Natural gas or propane are better and cheaper throughout most
> of the US, though in some circumstances wood wins for heating on cost
> grounds. (And while wood is not particularly "green", it is renewable.)
>
> It's true that there are parts of the world where gas is not a
> practical option.

Well, all of the places I have lived used electricity for heating and
cooking. The current realtive's house hasn't had gas heating and
cooking for decades. I doubt it ever did, and its not new.

--
Jim
Re: Is LINUX the inheritor of the Earth? [message #378197 is a reply to message #378158] Fri, 14 December 2018 14:28 Go to previous messageGo to next message
Bill Findlay is currently offline  Bill Findlay
Messages: 286
Registered: January 2012
Karma: 0
Senior Member
On 13 Dec 2018 16:23:31 GMT, maus <mausg@mail.com> wrote:
>
>> On 2018-12-13, Scott Lurndal <scott@slp53.sl.home> wrote:
>>> J. Clarke <jclarke.873638@gmail.com> writes:
>>>> On 12 Dec 2018 09:58:33 GMT, maus <mausg@mail.com> wrote:
>>>>
>>>> > On 2018-12-12, AndyW <Andy@nojunqmail.com> wrote:
>>>> >> On 11/12/2018 20:14, Dan Espen wrote:
>>>> >>> My bank, a credit union, recently remodeled.
>>>> >>> There are no more tellers at a counter, each person sits at a desk.
>>>> >>> More like a travel agency than a bank.
>>>> >>
>>>> >> In my bank we have a line of ATMs inside the bank and a row of desks
>>>> >> where the tellers stand.
>>>> >>
>>>> >> I prefer the ATMs over the faux sincerity and cabin crew welcome.
>>>> >> I think I am becoming a grumpy old man...
>>>> >>
>>>> >> Andy
>>>> >>
>>>> >
>>>> >
>>>> > perhaps we should form a new group?.. Alt.grumpy.oldmen... Me first!.
>>>>
>>>> Only if Sophia Loren and Ann-Margret agree to be mascots.
>>>
>>> I'd rather Peggy Lipton or maybe Susan Dey be the mascot.
>>
>> Sophia, last i saw a picture of her, still looks good. Like a
>> lot of Italian women.
>>
>> To a Wonkie, this particular thread might be homophobic. (Rock Hudson?)

Dear maus, what is a "Wonkie"?

--
Bill Findlay
Re: Is LINUX the inheritor of the Earth? [message #378198 is a reply to message #378195] Fri, 14 December 2018 14:30 Go to previous messageGo to previous message
Anne &amp; Lynn Wheel is currently offline  Anne &amp; Lynn Wheel
Messages: 3156
Registered: January 2012
Karma: 0
Senior Member
re:
http://www.garlic.com/~lynn/2018f.html#89
http://www.garlic.com/~lynn/2018f.html#90

original Hummer H1 production 1992-2006
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hummer_H1

they started doing more consumer friendly with H2 & H3

H2, 2002-2009
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hummer_H2
H3, 2006-2010
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hummer_H3

--
virtualization experience starting Jan1968, online at home since Mar1970
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