| RHML server and browser clients for the 64 and 128 [message #371523] |
Thu, 02 August 2018 02:34  |
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Originally posted by: xlar54
Hey folks, Ive been around the circuit promoting an idea Ive been working on, to allow us with wifi enabled machines to have a web-like experience on these retro machines. They will never be able to keep up with the ever demanding requirements of modern day web browsing, so I believe that we can come together with other retro enthusiasts and develop a low footprint web like protocol of our own. Hence, my project is called RHML (retro hypertext markup language).
Others have pointed out that this isnt really a language, and more of a control codes system - and they are right. But it does give us more latitude in many ways.
Anyway, I would invite you to check out my blog, pull down the code and server (requires nodejs). I cant promise a bug-free run, as this thing continues to evolve. Im working on ditching the nodejs server requirement and moving towards hosting pages directly on http servers, but at the moment, webservers dump the pages so quickly that the wifi modem and/or code cant keep up. I invite anyone interested to submit pull requests to help make this grow, especially from other platforms.
https://rhml-browser.blogspot.com/
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| Re: RHML server and browser clients for the 64 and 128 [message #371553 is a reply to message #371523] |
Thu, 02 August 2018 15:08  |
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Originally posted by: Grant Taylor
On 08/02/2018 12:34 AM, xlar54 wrote:
> at the moment, webservers dump the pages so quickly that the wifi modem
> and/or code cant keep up.
This seems like a modem / gateway / web server failing to me.
To me, there are two communication streams, one on either side of the
gateway (like the Wifi232). One is serial to the old computer. The
other is TCP/IP over some sort of network (wired or wireless).
I would expect that the serial side can be paused by (I think) dropping
DTR. (Maybe it's a different signal.) The point being for the (retro)
computer to indicate that it is not ready to receive any more data from
the other end.
I would also expect that the TCP/IP side could similarly cause the web
server to pause sending data. I'm not completely familiar with the
mechanics of how. But I am confident that the TCP/IP client can tell
the sending web server how much buffer it has available. The idea being
that the web server's sending side should not exceed said buffer.
So … I feel like this problem (as I understand it) is solved. Or at
least it should be. Hence why I feel like there is a failing somewhere,
be it a bug or lack of leveraging the existing mechanisms.
The Slowloris attack comes to mind as supporting evidence that a TCP/IP
client can cause a web server to slow down. }:-)
--
Grant. . . .
unix || die
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| Re: RHML server and browser clients for the 64 and 128 [message #371589 is a reply to message #371571] |
Fri, 03 August 2018 12:33 |
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Originally posted by: Grant Taylor
On 08/02/2018 03:30 PM, Janne Johansson wrote:
> Or ClearToSend (CTS) if you do 7-wire serial.
*nod*
> Yes, I think both 0 and 1 byte free at my end is a possible response
> to incoming packets when you have a hard time handling the incoming
> data stream.
:-)
> Telling the remote end you have only 1 byte left in the buffer is used
> for instance when tarpitting spam sending email servers, to force them
> to waste a lot of resources for every sent byte so that they are busy
> creating packets for an email your server wont accept instead of spamming
> others at that instance.
Yep.
Of course that does rely on them following the rules. Something I've
learned not to rely on. But it will make things less than graceful on
their end when the do try to break the rules. But, hey, that's their
problem. }:-)
--
Grant. . . .
unix || die
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| Re: RHML server and browser clients for the 64 and 128 [message #371810 is a reply to message #371788] |
Tue, 07 August 2018 05:14 |
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Originally posted by: xlar54
On Monday, August 6, 2018 at 10:38:14 AM UTC-5, Janne Johansson wrote:
> On 2018-08-01 22:34, xlar54 : All wrote:
>> Hey folks, Ive been around the circuit promoting an idea Ive been
>> working on, to allow us with wifi enabled machines to have a web-like
>> experience on these retro machines. They will never be able to keep up
>> with the ever demanding requirements of modern
>> day web browsing, so I believe that we can come together with other
>> retro enthusiasts and develop a low footprint web like protocol of our
>> own. Hence, my project is called RHML (retro hypertext markup language).
>>
>> Others have pointed out that this isnt really a language, and more of a
>> control codes system - and they are right. But it does give us more
>> latitude in many ways.
>>
>> Anyway, I would invite you to check out my blog, pull down the code and
>> server (requires nodejs). I cant promise a bug-free run, as this thing
>> continues to evolve. Im working on ditching the nodejs server
>> requirement and moving towards hosting pages
>> directly on http servers, but at the moment, webservers dump the pages
>> so quickly that the wifi modem and/or code cant keep up. I invite
>> anyone interested to submit pull requests to help make this grow,
>> especially from other platforms.
>>
>> https://rhml-browser.blogspot.com/
>
> For the client source builds, on unixlike OS:es instead of the BAT
> files: (hopefully the wrap will not break the long lines)
>
> $ more Makefile
>
> all: browser64.prg browser128.prg
>
> browser64.prg: browser.c userial.c nmi_trampoline.s
> cl65 -O -t c64 browser.c userial.c nmi_trampoline.s -o browser64.prg
>
> browser128.prg: browser.c userial.c
> cl65 -O -t c128 browser.c userial.c -o browser128.prg
>
> install: all
> cp browser64.prg ../client/c64/browser64.prg
> cp c64-* ../client/c64/
> cp browser128.prg ../client/c64/browser128.prg
> cp c128-* ../client/c128/
>
> clean:
> -rm -f *.prg
> -rm -f *.o
> -rm -f *.o65
> -rm -f ../client/c128/*
> -rm -f ../client/c64/*
Oh wow thank you!
Side, note: the issues with the webserver branch have been corrected. It works well, but theres a few more things I need to do to make it 100%. Stay tuned. It would be ideal for us to be able to host both html pages for web users, and rhml pages for retro users.
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