| Re: By the bucketful? [message #406581 is a reply to message #406570] |
Sun, 21 March 2021 12:43   |
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Originally posted by: J. Clarke
On 21 Mar 2021 04:00:29 -0300, Mike Spencer
<mds@bogus.nodomain.nowhere> wrote:
>
> Charlie Gibbs <cgibbs@kltpzyxm.invalid> writes:
>
>> On 2021-03-20, Mike Spencer <mds@bogus.nodomain.nowhere> wrote:
>>
>>> And then there's the color of The Damned Thing according to Ambrose
>>> Bierce -- I suppose when you know there should be a color band just
>>>> there< but you can't see it. :-o
>>
>> And then there's octarine...
>
> Indeed.
>
> See my X-Clacks-Overhead: NNTP header, slightly updated for CoI. [1]
> Anybody who knows about octarine can use it too.
In a certain department in a certain major financial services company,
a decision made every year was what color the folders that contain
certain documents would be. When the pandemic rolled around it became
clear that there would be no physical folders for 2020. The document
specifying what is to be in these folders was called "20xx Blue (or
green or orange or whatever) Folders". It was suggested that since
for 2020 they will be imaginary folders the name of the descriptive
document should use an imaginary color--"Octarine". This was accepted
by management and is now part of that process.
> No one in truly dead while his name is still spoken.
>
> [1] Clacks over Internet
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| Re: By the bucketful? [message #406583 is a reply to message #406580] |
Sun, 21 March 2021 14:51 |
Mike Spencer
Messages: 997
Registered: January 2012
Karma: 0
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Senior Member |
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Joe Pfeiffer <pfeiffer@cs.nmsu.edu> writes:
> I know after you tell me this will have been obvious, but... what
> does "4GH" reference?
Thew go-anywhere, do-anything, leave-no-trace personal-code prefix
employed by Nick Haflinger in "Shockwave Rider".
Excessively geekish lit-crit pedants might say that a close reading of
Brunner's text would indicate that 4GH is not 100% bit-compatible with
GNU. I take a less narrow view. :-)
--
Mike Spencer Nova Scotia, Canada
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| Re: By the bucketful? [message #406586 is a reply to message #406452] |
Sun, 21 March 2021 17:16 |
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Originally posted by: Vir Campestris
On 16/03/2021 21:10, Bob Eager wrote:
> Of course! There's a UK quiz show called Only Connect, which is quite
> hard. One round has four things in a sequence - can be pictures, music,
> words, whatever. The team is shown the first item and gets 5 points if
> they can predict the fourth. They get 3 points if they ask to see the
> second item, and 1 point if they need the third (I think).
>
> I have done it twice from the first item alone. Once was a picture of (I
> think) Battersea Power Station, and I guessed (correctly) that the fourth
> was a picture of a burning man.
>
> The other was just "0=black". I immediately said "3=orange" and my wife
> looked at me as if I'd gone mad. She was amazed when I turned out to be
> right...
For those of you with Internet the Beeb think is in the UK Only connect
is at
< https://www.bbc.co.uk/iplayer/episodes/b00lskhg/only-connect>
ISTR going "Oh of course" at the answer. But then I'm software...
(... Though we're rewatching Babylon 5 at the moment, and I did a
complete doubletake when one of the characters was being killed slowly.
By a device whose controls seemed to be a desoldering tool!)
Andy
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| Re: By the bucketful? [message #406587 is a reply to message #406583] |
Sun, 21 March 2021 17:23 |
Joe Pfeiffer
Messages: 764
Registered: January 2012
Karma: 0
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Senior Member |
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Mike Spencer <mds@bogus.nodomain.nowhere> writes:
> Joe Pfeiffer <pfeiffer@cs.nmsu.edu> writes:
>
>> I know after you tell me this will have been obvious, but... what
>> does "4GH" reference?
>
> Thew go-anywhere, do-anything, leave-no-trace personal-code prefix
> employed by Nick Haflinger in "Shockwave Rider".
>
> Excessively geekish lit-crit pedants might say that a close reading of
> Brunner's text would indicate that 4GH is not 100% bit-compatible with
> GNU. I take a less narrow view. :-)
Ah. Not one I've read.
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| Re: By the bucketful? [message #406589 is a reply to message #406587] |
Sun, 21 March 2021 18:20 |
Mike Spencer
Messages: 997
Registered: January 2012
Karma: 0
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Senior Member |
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Joe Pfeiffer <pfeiffer@cs.nmsu.edu> writes:
> Mike Spencer <mds@bogus.nodomain.nowhere> writes:
>
>> Joe Pfeiffer <pfeiffer@cs.nmsu.edu> writes:
>>
>>> I know after you tell me this will have been obvious, but... what
>>> does "4GH" reference?
>>
>> Thew go-anywhere, do-anything, leave-no-trace personal-code prefix
>> employed by Nick Haflinger in "Shockwave Rider".
>>
>> Excessively geekish lit-crit pedants might say that a close reading of
>> Brunner's text would indicate that 4GH is not 100% bit-compatible with
>> GNU. I take a less narrow view. :-)
>
> Ah. Not one I've read.
John Brunner, 1975. Arguably the first cyberpunk novel [1]. You
should hasten [2] to find a copy. Fundamental part of geekdom's
fiction canon. Anticipates much of today's technology as well as its
worrisome influence on the polity. We're almost at the stage,
f'rgzample, where someone can create a complete new identity using
only a cell phone. I predict that you'll enjoy reading it.
[1] Okay, omnes festinatio ex parte diaboli est, so not "hasten". But
better than "with deliberate speed."
[2] If you exclude Bruce Jackson's much-overlooked "The Programmer",
which is set in a 1970s contemporary context w/ modems, terminals and
other 70s tech rather than the barely-imaginable near future of
"Shockwave Rider".
--
Mike Spencer Nova Scotia, Canada
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| Re: By the bucketful? [message #406590 is a reply to message #406586] |
Sun, 21 March 2021 19:02 |
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Originally posted by: J. Clarke
On Sun, 21 Mar 2021 21:16:46 +0000, Vir Campestris
<vir.campestris@invalid.invalid> wrote:
> On 16/03/2021 21:10, Bob Eager wrote:
>> Of course! There's a UK quiz show called Only Connect, which is quite
>> hard. One round has four things in a sequence - can be pictures, music,
>> words, whatever. The team is shown the first item and gets 5 points if
>> they can predict the fourth. They get 3 points if they ask to see the
>> second item, and 1 point if they need the third (I think).
>>
>> I have done it twice from the first item alone. Once was a picture of (I
>> think) Battersea Power Station, and I guessed (correctly) that the fourth
>> was a picture of a burning man.
>>
>> The other was just "0=black". I immediately said "3=orange" and my wife
>> looked at me as if I'd gone mad. She was amazed when I turned out to be
>> right...
>
> For those of you with Internet the Beeb think is in the UK Only connect
> is at
>
> < https://www.bbc.co.uk/iplayer/episodes/b00lskhg/only-connect>
>
> ISTR going "Oh of course" at the answer. But then I'm software...
>
>
> (... Though we're rewatching Babylon 5 at the moment, and I did a
> complete doubletake when one of the characters was being killed slowly.
> By a device whose controls seemed to be a desoldering tool!)
Yep. Of course it's quite amazing the feats of surgery that Dr. McCoy
performed with a salt shaker.
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| Re: By the bucketful? [message #406593 is a reply to message #406589] |
Sun, 21 March 2021 21:01 |
Joe Pfeiffer
Messages: 764
Registered: January 2012
Karma: 0
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Senior Member |
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Mike Spencer <mds@bogus.nodomain.nowhere> writes:
> Joe Pfeiffer <pfeiffer@cs.nmsu.edu> writes:
>
>> Mike Spencer <mds@bogus.nodomain.nowhere> writes:
>>
>>> Joe Pfeiffer <pfeiffer@cs.nmsu.edu> writes:
>>>
>>>> I know after you tell me this will have been obvious, but... what
>>>> does "4GH" reference?
>>>
>>> Thew go-anywhere, do-anything, leave-no-trace personal-code prefix
>>> employed by Nick Haflinger in "Shockwave Rider".
>>>
>>> Excessively geekish lit-crit pedants might say that a close reading of
>>> Brunner's text would indicate that 4GH is not 100% bit-compatible with
>>> GNU. I take a less narrow view. :-)
>>
>> Ah. Not one I've read.
>
> John Brunner, 1975. Arguably the first cyberpunk novel [1]. You
> should hasten [2] to find a copy. Fundamental part of geekdom's
> fiction canon. Anticipates much of today's technology as well as its
> worrisome influence on the polity. We're almost at the stage,
> f'rgzample, where someone can create a complete new identity using
> only a cell phone. I predict that you'll enjoy reading it.
Lookie what I found!
https://vx-underground.org/archive/other/VxHeavenPdfs/The%20 Shockwave%20Rider.pdf
> [1] Okay, omnes festinatio ex parte diaboli est, so not "hasten". But
> better than "with deliberate speed."
>
> [2] If you exclude Bruce Jackson's much-overlooked "The Programmer",
> which is set in a 1970s contemporary context w/ modems, terminals and
> other 70s tech rather than the barely-imaginable near future of
> "Shockwave Rider".
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| Re: By the bucketful? [message #406606 is a reply to message #406589] |
Mon, 22 March 2021 12:10 |
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Originally posted by: JimP
On 21 Mar 2021 19:20:45 -0300, Mike Spencer
<mds@bogus.nodomain.nowhere> wrote:
>
> Joe Pfeiffer <pfeiffer@cs.nmsu.edu> writes:
>
>> Mike Spencer <mds@bogus.nodomain.nowhere> writes:
>>
>>> Joe Pfeiffer <pfeiffer@cs.nmsu.edu> writes:
>>>
>>>> I know after you tell me this will have been obvious, but... what
>>>> does "4GH" reference?
>>>
>>> Thew go-anywhere, do-anything, leave-no-trace personal-code prefix
>>> employed by Nick Haflinger in "Shockwave Rider".
>>>
>>> Excessively geekish lit-crit pedants might say that a close reading of
>>> Brunner's text would indicate that 4GH is not 100% bit-compatible with
>>> GNU. I take a less narrow view. :-)
>>
>> Ah. Not one I've read.
>
> John Brunner, 1975. Arguably the first cyberpunk novel [1]. You
> should hasten [2] to find a copy. Fundamental part of geekdom's
> fiction canon. Anticipates much of today's technology as well as its
> worrisome influence on the polity. We're almost at the stage,
> f'rgzample, where someone can create a complete new identity using
> only a cell phone. I predict that you'll enjoy reading it.
>
> [1] Okay, omnes festinatio ex parte diaboli est, so not "hasten". But
> better than "with deliberate speed."
>
> [2] If you exclude Bruce Jackson's much-overlooked "The Programmer",
> which is set in a 1970s contemporary context w/ modems, terminals and
> other 70s tech rather than the barely-imaginable near future of
> "Shockwave Rider".
While it is a game, Transhuman Space is also about the future. Much
more digital people than in Ghost in the Shell movie.
--
Jim
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| Re: By the bucketful? [message #406611 is a reply to message #406589] |
Mon, 22 March 2021 14:57 |
usenet
Messages: 556
Registered: May 2013
Karma: 0
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Senior Member |
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On 21 Mar 2021 19:20:45 -0300, Mike Spencer <mds@bogus.nodomain.nowhere> wrote:
> Joe Pfeiffer <pfeiffer@cs.nmsu.edu> writes:
>> Mike Spencer <mds@bogus.nodomain.nowhere> writes:
>>> Joe Pfeiffer <pfeiffer@cs.nmsu.edu> writes:
>>>> I know after you tell me this will have been obvious, but... what
>>>> does "4GH" reference?
>>>
>>> Thew go-anywhere, do-anything, leave-no-trace personal-code prefix
>>> employed by Nick Haflinger in "Shockwave Rider".
>>>
>>> Excessively geekish lit-crit pedants might say that a close reading of
>>> Brunner's text would indicate that 4GH is not 100% bit-compatible with
>>> GNU. I take a less narrow view. :-)
>>
>> Ah. Not one I've read.
>
> John Brunner, 1975. Arguably the first cyberpunk novel [1]. You
> should hasten [2] to find a copy. Fundamental part of geekdom's
> fiction canon. Anticipates much of today's technology as well as its
> worrisome influence on the polity. We're almost at the stage,
> f'rgzample, where someone can create a complete new identity using
> only a cell phone. I predict that you'll enjoy reading it.
Another up vote for "Shockwave Rider." If it's not the first cyberpunk novel,
then it's certainly one of the first. Other notable Brunner titles with
interesting looks into the future are "Stand on Zanzibar" and the rather grim
"The Sheep Look Up."
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| Re: By the bucketful? [message #406613 is a reply to message #406589] |
Mon, 22 March 2021 14:58 |
Peter Flass
Messages: 8375
Registered: December 2011
Karma: 0
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Senior Member |
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Mike Spencer <mds@bogus.nodomain.nowhere> wrote:
>
> Joe Pfeiffer <pfeiffer@cs.nmsu.edu> writes:
>
>> Mike Spencer <mds@bogus.nodomain.nowhere> writes:
>>
>>> Joe Pfeiffer <pfeiffer@cs.nmsu.edu> writes:
>>>
>>>> I know after you tell me this will have been obvious, but... what
>>>> does "4GH" reference?
>>>
>>> Thew go-anywhere, do-anything, leave-no-trace personal-code prefix
>>> employed by Nick Haflinger in "Shockwave Rider".
>>>
>>> Excessively geekish lit-crit pedants might say that a close reading of
>>> Brunner's text would indicate that 4GH is not 100% bit-compatible with
>>> GNU. I take a less narrow view. :-)
>>
>> Ah. Not one I've read.
>
> John Brunner, 1975. Arguably the first cyberpunk novel [1]. You
> should hasten [2] to find a copy. Fundamental part of geekdom's
> fiction canon. Anticipates much of today's technology as well as its
> worrisome influence on the polity. We're almost at the stage,
> f'rgzample, where someone can create a complete new identity using
> only a cell phone. I predict that you'll enjoy reading it.
>
> [1] Okay, omnes festinatio ex parte diaboli est, so not "hasten". But
> better than "with deliberate speed."
>
> [2] If you exclude Bruce Jackson's much-overlooked "The Programmer",
> which is set in a 1970s contemporary context w/ modems, terminals and
> other 70s tech rather than the barely-imaginable near future of
> "Shockwave Rider".
>
Second that. i read it at least twice, some years apart, and the second
time I was amazed by how much what I thought of as far out had come to
pass.
--
Pete
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| Re: By the bucketful? [message #406615 is a reply to message #406611] |
Mon, 22 March 2021 16:30 |
Mike Spencer
Messages: 997
Registered: January 2012
Karma: 0
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Senior Member |
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usenet@only.tnx (Questor) writes:
> Another up vote for "Shockwave Rider." If it's not the first
> cyberpunk novel, then it's certainly one of the first. Other
> notable Brunner titles with interesting looks into the future are
> "Stand on Zanzibar"...
Yes. From which we get the term "pattiducking", essentially what
moderny neural-net-based AI does (or, perhaps gullibly, we suppose
them to do.)
Fifty-three years on, Zanzibar is no longer big enough even for
close-order drill with only a few sq. ft. per person. Vancouver
Island, clear-cut and graded flat, would still be big enough for us
all to stand or even lie down and take a nap -- but just barely.
> ...and the rather grim "The Sheep Look Up."
Grim indeed. "We can just about...live within our means...if we
exterminate the two hundred million most extravagant and wasteful of
our species."
Opening the door, Mrs. Byrne sniffed. Smoke! And if she could
smell it with her heavy head cold, it must be a tremendous fire!
"We ought to call the brigade!" she exclaimed. "Is it a
hayrick?"
"The brigade would have a long way to go," the doctor told he
curtly. "It's from America. The wind's blowing that way."
--
Mike Spencer Nova Scotia, Canada
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| Re: By the bucketful? [message #406619 is a reply to message #406615] |
Mon, 22 March 2021 19:27 |
Charlie Gibbs
Messages: 5313
Registered: January 2012
Karma: 0
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Senior Member |
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On 2021-03-22, Mike Spencer <mds@bogus.nodomain.nowhere> wrote:
> Fifty-three years on, Zanzibar is no longer big enough even for
> close-order drill with only a few sq. ft. per person. Vancouver
> Island, clear-cut and graded flat, would still be big enough for us
> all to stand or even lie down and take a nap -- but just barely.
According to my oft-repeated back-of-the-envelope calculation,
if the politicians get their wish and get our population back
to doubling every 40 years where it belongs, the entire planet
will be in that condition in a mere 600 years. Just be patient.
--
/~\ Charlie Gibbs | They don't understand Microsoft
\ / <cgibbs@kltpzyxm.invalid> | has stolen their car and parked
X I'm really at ac.dekanfrus | a taxi in their driveway.
/ \ if you read it the right way. | -- Mayayana
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| Re: By the bucketful? [message #406626 is a reply to message #406619] |
Tue, 23 March 2021 03:44 |
Ahem A Rivet's Shot
Messages: 4843
Registered: January 2012
Karma: 0
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Senior Member |
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On 22 Mar 2021 23:27:09 GMT
Charlie Gibbs <cgibbs@kltpzyxm.invalid> wrote:
> On 2021-03-22, Mike Spencer <mds@bogus.nodomain.nowhere> wrote:
>
>> Fifty-three years on, Zanzibar is no longer big enough even for
>> close-order drill with only a few sq. ft. per person. Vancouver
>> Island, clear-cut and graded flat, would still be big enough for us
>> all to stand or even lie down and take a nap -- but just barely.
>
> According to my oft-repeated back-of-the-envelope calculation,
> if the politicians get their wish and get our population back
> to doubling every 40 years where it belongs, the entire planet
> will be in that condition in a mere 600 years. Just be patient.
No problem, mass emigration on oversized Orion nuclear pulse jets.
Those who remain behind won't be overbreeding for a while and there will be
rampant evolution to help fill the gaps in the ecology, come back in 500
years and you won't know the old place.
--
Steve O'Hara-Smith | Directable Mirror Arrays
C:\>WIN | A better way to focus the sun
The computer obeys and wins. | licences available see
You lose and Bill collects. | http://www.sohara.org/
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| Re: By the bucketful? [message #406628 is a reply to message #406616] |
Tue, 23 March 2021 05:31 |
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Originally posted by: Bob Eager
On Mon, 22 Mar 2021 21:58:04 +0000, Vir Campestris wrote:
> On 22/03/2021 01:01, Joe Pfeiffer wrote:
>> Lookie what I found!
>> https://vx-underground.org/archive/other/VxHeavenPdfs/
The%20Shockwave%20Rider.pdf
>
> You are a very naughty person.
>
> (And so am I! - thanks)
>
> I have Stand on Zanzibar in paperback. My only Brunner.
I have:
Born Under Mars
No Future In it
No Other Gods But Me
Not Before Time
Out Of My Mind
The Stone That Never Came Down
The Telepathist
The Tides of Time
Time Jump
Times Without Number
Timescoop
Web of Everywhere
--
Using UNIX since v6 (1975)...
Use the BIG mirror service in the UK:
http://www.mirrorservice.org
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| Re: By the bucketful? [message #406632 is a reply to message #406628] |
Tue, 23 March 2021 12:02 |
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Originally posted by: maus
On 2021-03-23, Bob Eager <news0073@eager.cx> wrote:
> On Mon, 22 Mar 2021 21:58:04 +0000, Vir Campestris wrote:
>
>> On 22/03/2021 01:01, Joe Pfeiffer wrote:
>>> Lookie what I found!
>>> https://vx-underground.org/archive/other/VxHeavenPdfs/
> The%20Shockwave%20Rider.pdf
>>
>> You are a very naughty person.
>>
>> (And so am I! - thanks)
>>
>> I have Stand on Zanzibar in paperback. My only Brunner.
>
> I have:
>
> Born Under Mars
> No Future In it
> No Other Gods But Me
> Not Before Time
> Out Of My Mind
> The Stone That Never Came Down
> The Telepathist
> The Tides of Time
> Time Jump
> Times Without Number
> Timescoop
> Web of Everywhere
>
>
>
>
Not many people notice the old thesis on Interplanity travel, the war of
the worlds, HG Well, on what can go wrong when alien species mix. We
shoulld be very careful when bringing back material from Mars.
--
greymausg@mail.com
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| Re: By the bucketful? [message #406633 is a reply to message #406619] |
Tue, 23 March 2021 12:05 |
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Originally posted by: Kerr-Mudd,John
On Mon, 22 Mar 2021 23:27:09 GMT, Charlie Gibbs <cgibbs@kltpzyxm.invalid>
wrote:
> On 2021-03-22, Mike Spencer <mds@bogus.nodomain.nowhere> wrote:
>
>> Fifty-three years on, Zanzibar is no longer big enough even for
>> close-order drill with only a few sq. ft. per person. Vancouver
>> Island, clear-cut and graded flat, would still be big enough for us
>> all to stand or even lie down and take a nap -- but just barely.
>
> According to my oft-repeated back-of-the-envelope calculation,
> if the politicians get their wish and get our population back
> to doubling every 40 years where it belongs, the entire planet
> will be in that condition in a mere 600 years. Just be patient.
>
Biggest Ponzi-scheme Ever.
--
Bah, and indeed, Humbug.
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| Re: By the bucketful? [message #406638 is a reply to message #406636] |
Tue, 23 March 2021 15:35 |
Ahem A Rivet's Shot
Messages: 4843
Registered: January 2012
Karma: 0
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Senior Member |
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On Tue, 23 Mar 2021 11:53:33 -0500
JimP <chucktheouch@gmail.com> wrote:
> I remember Stand... To me it looked like paragraphs were tossed into
> air, and then placed into a book in whatever sequence they were picked
> up.
New Wave, I always found that crowd hard and unrewarding to read.
--
Steve O'Hara-Smith | Directable Mirror Arrays
C:\>WIN | A better way to focus the sun
The computer obeys and wins. | licences available see
You lose and Bill collects. | http://www.sohara.org/
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| Re: By the bucketful? [message #406639 is a reply to message #406638] |
Tue, 23 March 2021 16:24 |
Mike Spencer
Messages: 997
Registered: January 2012
Karma: 0
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Senior Member |
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Ahem A Rivet's Shot <steveo@eircom.net> writes:
> On Tue, 23 Mar 2021 11:53:33 -0500
> JimP <chucktheouch@gmail.com> wrote:
>
>> I remember Stand [on Zanzibar]... To me it looked like paragraphs
>> were tossed into air, and then placed into a book in whatever
>> sequence they were picked up.
>
> New Wave...
I'm not into Deeper LitCrit so bits I've seen about Brunner creating
or embodying a new [wave?] literary style have drifted by without much
attention.
But the fragmented style of SoZ seemed to me exactly consonant with
the future-shock, media-blitz, mind-boggling-complexity aspects of his
contemporary and near-future society that he was experiencing and
anticipating. .
I personally like best fully coherent and literate writing. Neal
Stephenson's Cryptonomicon and Baroque Cycle (which I think of as a
single huge magnum opus) come to mind as examples -- the best book,
collectively, I've read in 60 years. But when Brunner does what he
does in SoZ, I get it.
> ...I always found that crowd hard and unrewarding to read.
Does Pynchon fall in the New Wave camp? I loved The Crying of Lot 49,
struggled unrewardingly through V. and have tried three time to read
Gravity's Rainbow, running aground early on in each case.
ObAFC: Shockwave Rider had remarkably good depictions of tech
developments over the next and then as yet un-happened 50 years.
--
Mike Spencer Nova Scotia, Canada
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