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Disk II Controller [message #388102] Sat, 26 October 2019 02:00 Go to next message
Anonymous
Karma:
Originally posted by: Anthony Adverse

Hi there,
I have 2 proms sitting in front of me, 341-0028 which is a 16 sector p5? But it also has a 341-0006 which I can't find any reference to. Any ideas?

A
Re: Disk II Controller [message #388136 is a reply to message #388102] Sun, 27 October 2019 17:18 Go to previous messageGo to next message
Anonymous
Karma:
Originally posted by: awanderin

Anthony Adverse <the.ertceps@gmail.com> writes:

> Hi there,
> I have 2 proms sitting in front of me, 341-0028 which is a 16 sector
> p5? But it also has a 341-0006 which I can't find any reference
> to. Any ideas?

Any idea where it came from?

None of my ROM files nor reference materials contain 341-0006 either.

--
--
Jerry awanderin at gmail dot com
Re: Disk II Controller [message #388137 is a reply to message #388136] Sun, 27 October 2019 18:37 Go to previous messageGo to next message
Anonymous
Karma:
Originally posted by: Anthony Adverse

On Monday, October 28, 2019 at 8:18:36 AM UTC+11, awanderin wrote:
> Anthony Adverse <the.ertceps@gmail.com> writes:
>
>> Hi there,
>> I have 2 proms sitting in front of me, 341-0028 which is a 16 sector
>> p5? But it also has a 341-0006 which I can't find any reference
>> to. Any ideas?
>
> Any idea where it came from?
>
> None of my ROM files nor reference materials contain 341-0006 either.
>
> --
> --
> Jerry awanderin at gmail dot com

I have no idea what the origin is, it was in this particular card when I received it with a few others. Let me see what info I can get of it.

Its a Texas Instruments chip, bp28l22n, with the 341-0006, Apple 78-04. Thats all I have to work with.

A
Re: Disk II Controller [message #388151 is a reply to message #388137] Mon, 28 October 2019 19:58 Go to previous messageGo to next message
Anonymous
Karma:
Originally posted by: awanderin

Anthony Adverse <the.ertceps@gmail.com> writes:

> On Monday, October 28, 2019 at 8:18:36 AM UTC+11, awanderin wrote:
>> Anthony Adverse <the.ertceps@gmail.com> writes:
>>
>>> Hi there,
>>> I have 2 proms sitting in front of me, 341-0028 which is a 16 sector
>>> p5? But it also has a 341-0006 which I can't find any reference
>>> to. Any ideas?
>>
>> Any idea where it came from?
>>
>> None of my ROM files nor reference materials contain 341-0006 either.
>>
>> --
>> --
>> Jerry awanderin at gmail dot com
>
> I have no idea what the origin is, it was in this particular card when
> I received it with a few others. Let me see what info I can get of it.
>
> Its a Texas Instruments chip, bp28l22n, with the 341-0006, Apple
> 78-04. Thats all I have to work with.

Well, that's a 256 x 8bit ROM, so fits the bill for a Disk II
controller. You can read it out using the controller by placing it into
the socket for the boot ROM. If it's boot code, and it's in slot 6 for
example, you just have to read C600-C6FF to see the whole thing. If
it's actually the state-machine ROM, then what you will read at
C600-C6FF will have the bits flipped around. Jim Sather in
Understanding the Apple II describes this rearrangement in his chapter
on the Disk II controller.

If you wouldn't mind reading it and posting the hex bytes, someone here
will take a look at the contents. I will, for one.

--
--
Jerry awanderin at gmail dot com
Re: Disk II Controller [message #388153 is a reply to message #388151] Mon, 28 October 2019 22:48 Go to previous messageGo to next message
Anonymous
Karma:
Originally posted by: Anthony Adverse

>>>
>>>> Hi there,
>>>> I have 2 proms sitting in front of me, 341-0028 which is a 16 sector
>>>> p5? But it also has a 341-0006 which I can't find any reference
>>>> to. Any ideas?
>>>
>>> Any idea where it came from?
>>>
>>> None of my ROM files nor reference materials contain 341-0006 either.
>>>
>>> --
>>> --
>>> Jerry awanderin at gmail dot com
>>
>> I have no idea what the origin is, it was in this particular card when
>> I received it with a few others. Let me see what info I can get of it.
>>
>> Its a Texas Instruments chip, bp28l22n, with the 341-0006, Apple
>> 78-04. Thats all I have to work with.
>
> Well, that's a 256 x 8bit ROM, so fits the bill for a Disk II
> controller. You can read it out using the controller by placing it into
> the socket for the boot ROM. If it's boot code, and it's in slot 6 for
> example, you just have to read C600-C6FF to see the whole thing. If
> it's actually the state-machine ROM, then what you will read at
> C600-C6FF will have the bits flipped around. Jim Sather in
> Understanding the Apple II describes this rearrangement in his chapter
> on the Disk II controller.
>
> If you wouldn't mind reading it and posting the hex bytes, someone here
> will take a look at the contents. I will, for one.
>
> --
> --
> Jerry awanderin at gmail dot com

Alright, I had it in slot 5, so I've done a bsave rom,A$c500,l$ff the resulting file is at, http://tlp.zapto.org/hidden_stuff/PROM.341-0006.bin Now I haven't as yet been able to swap it into a known working card. The card it came out of is missing the ls323 I'm unsure if that invalidates the read.

A
Re: Disk II Controller [message #388158 is a reply to message #388153] Tue, 29 October 2019 04:22 Go to previous messageGo to next message
Anonymous
Karma:
Originally posted by: James Davis

On Monday, October 28, 2019 at 7:48:09 PM UTC-7, Anthony Adverse wrote:
>>>>
>>>> > Hi there,
>>>> > I have 2 proms sitting in front of me, 341-0028 which is a 16 sector
>>>> > p5? But it also has a 341-0006 which I can't find any reference
>>>> > to. Any ideas?
>>>>
>>>> Any idea where it came from?
>>>>
>>>> None of my ROM files nor reference materials contain 341-0006 either..
>>>>
>>>> --
>>>> --
>>>> Jerry awanderin at gmail dot com
>>>
>>> I have no idea what the origin is, it was in this particular card when
>>> I received it with a few others. Let me see what info I can get of it..
>>>
>>> Its a Texas Instruments chip, bp28l22n, with the 341-0006, Apple
>>> 78-04. Thats all I have to work with.
>>
>> Well, that's a 256 x 8bit ROM, so fits the bill for a Disk II
>> controller. You can read it out using the controller by placing it into
>> the socket for the boot ROM. If it's boot code, and it's in slot 6 for
>> example, you just have to read C600-C6FF to see the whole thing. If
>> it's actually the state-machine ROM, then what you will read at
>> C600-C6FF will have the bits flipped around. Jim Sather in
>> Understanding the Apple II describes this rearrangement in his chapter
>> on the Disk II controller.
>>
>> If you wouldn't mind reading it and posting the hex bytes, someone here
>> will take a look at the contents. I will, for one.
>>
>> --
>> --
>> Jerry awanderin at gmail dot com
>
> Alright, I had it in slot 5, so I've done a bsave rom,A$c500,l$ff the resulting file is at, http://tlp.zapto.org/hidden_stuff/PROM.341-0006.bin Now I haven't as yet been able to swap it into a known working card. The card it came out of is missing the ls323 I'm unsure if that invalidates the read.
>
> A

You might want to see how it compares the binary in "Apple II 5.25 Disk Boot Disassembly by Andy McFadden" <https://bigflake.com/disasm/a2-boot/>
Re: Disk II Controller [message #388160 is a reply to message #388158] Tue, 29 October 2019 05:42 Go to previous messageGo to next message
Anonymous
Karma:
Originally posted by: Anthony Adverse

On Tuesday, October 29, 2019 at 7:22:36 PM UTC+11, James Davis wrote:
> On Monday, October 28, 2019 at 7:48:09 PM UTC-7, Anthony Adverse wrote:
>>>> >
>>>> > > Hi there,
>>>> > > I have 2 proms sitting in front of me, 341-0028 which is a 16 sector
>>>> > > p5? But it also has a 341-0006 which I can't find any reference
>>>> > > to. Any ideas?
>>>> >
>>>> > Any idea where it came from?
>>>> >
>>>> > None of my ROM files nor reference materials contain 341-0006 either.
>>>> >
>>>> > --
>>>> > --
>>>> > Jerry awanderin at gmail dot com
>>>>
>>>> I have no idea what the origin is, it was in this particular card when
>>>> I received it with a few others. Let me see what info I can get of it.
>>>>
>>>> Its a Texas Instruments chip, bp28l22n, with the 341-0006, Apple
>>>> 78-04. Thats all I have to work with.
>>>
>>> Well, that's a 256 x 8bit ROM, so fits the bill for a Disk II
>>> controller. You can read it out using the controller by placing it into
>>> the socket for the boot ROM. If it's boot code, and it's in slot 6 for
>>> example, you just have to read C600-C6FF to see the whole thing. If
>>> it's actually the state-machine ROM, then what you will read at
>>> C600-C6FF will have the bits flipped around. Jim Sather in
>>> Understanding the Apple II describes this rearrangement in his chapter
>>> on the Disk II controller.
>>>
>>> If you wouldn't mind reading it and posting the hex bytes, someone here
>>> will take a look at the contents. I will, for one.
>>>
>>> --
>>> --
>>> Jerry awanderin at gmail dot com
>>
>> Alright, I had it in slot 5, so I've done a bsave rom,A$c500,l$ff the resulting file is at, http://tlp.zapto.org/hidden_stuff/PROM.341-0006.bin Now I haven't as yet been able to swap it into a known working card. The card it came out of is missing the ls323 I'm unsure if that invalidates the read.
>>
>> A
>
> You might want to see how it compares the binary in "Apple II 5.25 Disk Boot Disassembly by Andy McFadden" <https://bigflake.com/disasm/a2-boot/>

shrug, I have no idea what I'm doing
Re: Disk II Controller [message #388170 is a reply to message #388153] Tue, 29 October 2019 17:14 Go to previous messageGo to next message
Patrick Schaefer is currently offline  Patrick Schaefer
Messages: 67
Registered: October 2012
Karma: 0
Member
Am 29.10.2019 um 03:48 schrieb Anthony Adverse:

> Alright, I had it in slot 5, so I've done a bsave rom,A$c500,l$ff the
> resulting file is at,
http://tlp.zapto.org/hidden_stuff/PROM.341-0006.bin

This is definitely not a disk controller PROM. Contents does not match
P5, P6, P5A, P6A.

And it is not a P1 from the Parallel Card. I don't have images of the P8
and P8A from the Apple II Serial Interface Card (not Super Serial Card,
this one has a 2k EPROM), so someone else has to check this.


Patrick
Re: Disk II Controller [message #388171 is a reply to message #388170] Tue, 29 October 2019 18:33 Go to previous messageGo to next message
Anonymous
Karma:
Originally posted by: jeff.berntsen

On Tuesday, October 29, 2019 at 5:14:13 PM UTC-4, Patrick Schaefer wrote:
> Am 29.10.2019 um 03:48 schrieb Anthony Adverse:
>
>> Alright, I had it in slot 5, so I've done a bsave rom,A$c500,l$ff the
>> resulting file is at,
> http://tlp.zapto.org/hidden_stuff/PROM.341-0006.bin
>
> This is definitely not a disk controller PROM. Contents does not match
> P5, P6, P5A, P6A.
>
> And it is not a P1 from the Parallel Card. I don't have images of the P8
> and P8A from the Apple II Serial Interface Card (not Super Serial Card,
> this one has a 2k EPROM), so someone else has to check this.

I haven't had a chance to look at the .bin file yet but, if I remember correctly, the part number is for a P2 PROM which is the PROM for an Apple Communications Card. That's one of two serial cards Apple produced early on. It had a 6850 UART and could run at 110 or 300 baud.
Re: Disk II Controller [message #388172 is a reply to message #388171] Tue, 29 October 2019 19:17 Go to previous messageGo to next message
Anonymous
Karma:
Originally posted by: Anthony Adverse

On Wednesday, October 30, 2019 at 9:33:06 AM UTC+11, jeff.b...@gmail.com wrote:
> On Tuesday, October 29, 2019 at 5:14:13 PM UTC-4, Patrick Schaefer wrote:
>> Am 29.10.2019 um 03:48 schrieb Anthony Adverse:
>>
>>> Alright, I had it in slot 5, so I've done a bsave rom,A$c500,l$ff the
>>> resulting file is at,
>> http://tlp.zapto.org/hidden_stuff/PROM.341-0006.bin
>>
>> This is definitely not a disk controller PROM. Contents does not match
>> P5, P6, P5A, P6A.
>>
>> And it is not a P1 from the Parallel Card. I don't have images of the P8
>> and P8A from the Apple II Serial Interface Card (not Super Serial Card,
>> this one has a 2k EPROM), so someone else has to check this.
>
> I haven't had a chance to look at the .bin file yet but, if I remember correctly, the part number is for a P2 PROM which is the PROM for an Apple Communications Card. That's one of two serial cards Apple produced early on. It had a 6850 UART and could run at 110 or 300 baud.

I have one of those, I don't recall seeing a prom on it. Hmmm good reason for that, I have an empty p2 prom socket :) Will have another look at it manual if I can relocate it.
Re: Disk II Controller [message #388173 is a reply to message #388172] Tue, 29 October 2019 19:20 Go to previous messageGo to next message
Anonymous
Karma:
Originally posted by: Anthony Adverse

On Wednesday, October 30, 2019 at 10:17:44 AM UTC+11, Anthony Adverse wrote:
> On Wednesday, October 30, 2019 at 9:33:06 AM UTC+11, jeff.b...@gmail.com wrote:
>> On Tuesday, October 29, 2019 at 5:14:13 PM UTC-4, Patrick Schaefer wrote:
>>> Am 29.10.2019 um 03:48 schrieb Anthony Adverse:
>>>
>>>> Alright, I had it in slot 5, so I've done a bsave rom,A$c500,l$ff the
>>>> resulting file is at,
>>> http://tlp.zapto.org/hidden_stuff/PROM.341-0006.bin
>>>
>>> This is definitely not a disk controller PROM. Contents does not match
>>> P5, P6, P5A, P6A.
>>>
>>> And it is not a P1 from the Parallel Card. I don't have images of the P8
>>> and P8A from the Apple II Serial Interface Card (not Super Serial Card,
>>> this one has a 2k EPROM), so someone else has to check this.
>>
>> I haven't had a chance to look at the .bin file yet but, if I remember correctly, the part number is for a P2 PROM which is the PROM for an Apple Communications Card. That's one of two serial cards Apple produced early on. It had a 6850 UART and could run at 110 or 300 baud.
>
> I have one of those, I don't recall seeing a prom on it. Hmmm good reason for that, I have an empty p2 prom socket :) Will have another look at it manual if I can relocate it.

Looks like you could be right there... http://pineapple.zapto.org/hardware/display.php?query=251 clearly shows a 341-0006 in the prom socket. The drive controller came from the same source as the communications card. Looks like someone was playing around with them.
Re: Disk II Controller [message #388174 is a reply to message #388153] Tue, 29 October 2019 20:16 Go to previous messageGo to next message
Anonymous
Karma:
Originally posted by: awanderin

Anthony Adverse <the.ertceps@gmail.com> writes:

>>>>
>>>> > Hi there,
>>>> > I have 2 proms sitting in front of me, 341-0028 which is a 16 sector
>>>> > p5? But it also has a 341-0006 which I can't find any reference
>>>> > to. Any ideas?
>>>>
>>>> Any idea where it came from?
>>>>
>>>> None of my ROM files nor reference materials contain 341-0006 either.
>>>>
>>>> --
>>>> --
>>>> Jerry awanderin at gmail dot com
>>>
>>> I have no idea what the origin is, it was in this particular card when
>>> I received it with a few others. Let me see what info I can get of it.
>>>
>>> Its a Texas Instruments chip, bp28l22n, with the 341-0006, Apple
>>> 78-04. Thats all I have to work with.
>>
>> Well, that's a 256 x 8bit ROM, so fits the bill for a Disk II
>> controller. You can read it out using the controller by placing it into
>> the socket for the boot ROM. If it's boot code, and it's in slot 6 for
>> example, you just have to read C600-C6FF to see the whole thing. If
>> it's actually the state-machine ROM, then what you will read at
>> C600-C6FF will have the bits flipped around. Jim Sather in
>> Understanding the Apple II describes this rearrangement in his chapter
>> on the Disk II controller.
>>
>> If you wouldn't mind reading it and posting the hex bytes, someone here
>> will take a look at the contents. I will, for one.
>>
>> --
>> --
>> Jerry awanderin at gmail dot com
>
> Alright, I had it in slot 5, so I've done a bsave rom,A$c500,l$ff the
> resulting file is at,
> http://tlp.zapto.org/hidden_stuff/PROM.341-0006.bin Now I haven't as
> yet been able to swap it into a known working card. The card it came
> out of is missing the ls323 I'm unsure if that invalidates the read.

Thanks for posting that. As others have mentioned, it's not any of the
13- or 16-sector boot or state-machine PROMs. It also isn't 6502 code.
The file you posted is missing the last byte.


Here's the hex-dump for what it's worth:

00: 4c a8 ff e0 04 88 d0 c8 d8 28 1a 28 98 28 08 e8 |L........(.(.(..|
10: 40 a8 ff da dc 00 01 68 68 68 68 9a 1c f8 07 28 |@......hhhh....(|
20: 19 fe 68 58 68 5a 68 60 5c f8 07 a0 c5 28 88 90 |..hXhZh`\....(..|
30: 3d 54 44 5d 00 30 80 c5 68 08 40 46 fd 48 39 11 |=TD].0..h.@F.H9.|
40: 07 99 d8 06 d9 c8 07 9d 1e 30 e0 e6 55 c8 b0 0a |.........0..U...|
50: 34 c9 b0 06 59 07 15 c8 a0 c7 59 05 15 c6 dd 1e |4...Y.....Y.....|
60: 13 d8 54 44 d1 48 28 49 cf 09 20 91 48 76 2e b0 |..TD.H(I.. .Hv..|
70: 02 76 2f dd 1e 30 2a 90 d8 68 91 48 dd 1f 30 09 |.v/..0*..h.H..0.|
80: 98 0a 0a 0a 0a 5a 68 48 28 a0 64 d8 dd 1e 30 49 |.....ZhH(.d...0I|
90: 04 f0 89 59 40 99 c8 06 59 43 9d 1e 30 2a 99 c8 |...Y@...YC..0*..|
a0: b0 76 40 8b fd 4c a8 ff 39 98 f0 3a 5c f8 07 39 |.v@..L..9..:\..9|
b0: 16 f0 1e 29 73 39 a2 f0 15 39 e0 f0 1a 90 12 d0 |...)s9...9......|
c0: 30 49 02 f0 f9 d9 d8 06 4a 68 9d 1f 30 d0 05 08 |0I......Jh..0...|
d0: 40 f0 fd 48 e0 3e da 78 78 78 9d 00 01 a0 03 40 |@..H.>.xxx.....@|
e0: 10 39 1a f0 bd 39 94 f0 dc 39 92 f0 b4 a0 17 08 |.9...9...9......|
f0: 39 70 90 06 5c f8 07 a9 c8 06 40 7d fd 48 e0 |9p..\.....@}.H.|

If you disassembly it (say, assuming slot 6, address $c600), the first
few instructions are:

c600: 4c a8 ff jmp hffa8
c603: e0 04 cpx #$4
c605: 88 dey
c606: d0 c8 bne hc5d0

$FFA8 on the Apple II and II+ both contain a $00, or a BRK instruction.
Not promising. :) The BNE instruction at $C606 branches to another
card's ROM.

So, both of those tell me this isn't 6502 code. None of the rest of the
code looks sensible either.

However, if you apply the address and bit transformations that Jim
Sather discusses in Understanding the Apple II on page 9-16 (or that you
can see in the Disk II Interface schematic in the DOS Manual on page
145):
* Address lines A5 and A7 are swapped
* Data lines 4, 5, 6, 7 are reversed to 7, 6, 5, 4

then you get this hex-dump:

00: 2c 58 ff 70 04 18 b0 38 b8 48 8a 48 98 48 08 78 |,X.p...8.H.H.H.x|
10: 20 58 ff ba bc 00 01 68 68 68 68 9a 8c f8 07 48 | X.....hhhh....H|
20: 98 0a 0a 0a 0a aa 68 28 48 50 64 b8 bd 8e c0 29 |......h(HPd....)|
30: 04 f0 19 a9 20 99 38 06 a9 23 9d 8e c0 4a 99 38 |.... .8..#...J.8|
40: 07 99 b8 06 b9 38 07 9d 8e c0 70 76 a5 38 d0 0a |.....8....pv.8..|
50: c4 39 d0 06 a9 07 85 38 50 37 a9 05 85 36 bd 8e |.9.....8P7...6..|
60: c0 29 02 f0 f9 b9 b8 06 2a 68 9d 8f c0 b0 05 08 |.)......*h......|
70: 20 f0 fd 28 70 ce ba e8 e8 e8 9d 00 01 50 03 20 | ..(p........P. |
80: 89 fe 68 a8 68 aa 68 60 ac f8 07 50 35 48 18 90 |..h.h.h`...P5H..|
90: cd a4 24 ad 00 c0 10 35 68 08 20 26 fd 28 c9 81 |..$....5h. &.(..|
a0: d0 e6 20 1b fd 2c 58 ff c9 98 f0 ca ac f8 07 c9 |.. ..,X.........|
b0: 86 f0 8e 49 e3 c9 52 f0 85 c9 70 f0 8a 90 82 b0 |...I..R...p.....|
c0: 83 b8 a4 24 b1 28 48 29 3f 09 40 91 28 e6 4e d0 |...$.(H)?.@.(.N.|
d0: 02 e6 4f bd 8e c0 4a 90 b8 68 91 28 bd 8f c0 09 |..O...J..h.(....|
e0: 80 c9 8a f0 dd c9 94 f0 bc c9 92 f0 d4 50 87 08 |.............P..|
f0: c9 e0 90 06 ac f8 07 59 38 06 20 ed fd 28 70 |.......Y8. ..(p|


Which disassembles to this code, and it looks like some type of
communications code:

0638 1 h0638 = $638
06b8 2 h06b8 = $6b8
0738 3 h0738 = $738
c08e 4 hc08e = $c08e
c08f 5 hc08f = $c08f
6
0024 7 ch equ $24
0028 8 base equ $28
0036 9 csw equ $36
0038 10 ksw equ $38
004e 11 random equ $4e
12
0100 13 stack equ $100
07f8 14 mslot equ $7f8
15
c000 16 kbd equ $c000
17
fd1b 18 keyin equ $fd1b
fd26 19 keyin3 equ $fd26 ; A --> screen at cursor
fded 20 cout equ $fded
fdf0 21 cout1 equ $fdf0
fe89 22 setkbd equ $fe89
ff58 23 knownRTS equ $ff58
24
25 org $c600
c600:2c 58 ff 26 bit knownRTS
c603:70 04 27 bvs hc609
c605:18 28 clc
c606:b0 38 29 bcs hc640
c608:b8 30 clv
c609:48 31 hc609 pha
c60a:8a 32 txa
c60b:48 33 pha
c60c:98 34 tya
c60d:48 35 pha
c60e:08 36 php
c60f:78 37 sei
c610:20 58 ff 38 jsr knownRTS
c613:ba 39 tsx
c614:bc 00 01 40 ldy stack,X
c617:68 41 pla
c618:68 42 pla
c619:68 43 pla
c61a:68 44 pla
c61b:9a 45 txs
c61c:8c f8 07 46 sty mslot
c61f:48 47 pha
c620:98 48 tya
c621:0a 49 asl
c622:0a 50 asl
c623:0a 51 asl
c624:0a 52 asl
c625:aa 53 tax
c626:68 54 pla
c627:28 55 plp
c628:48 56 pha
c629:50 64 57 bvc hc68f
c62b:b8 58 clv
c62c:bd 8e c0 59 lda hc08e,X
c62f:29 04 60 and #$4
c631:f0 19 61 beq hc64c
c633:a9 20 62 lda #$20
c635:99 38 06 63 sta h0638,Y
c638:a9 23 64 lda #$23
c63a:9d 8e c0 65 sta hc08e,X
c63d:4a 66 lsr
c640 67 hc640 = *+2
c63e:99 38 07 68 hc63e sta h0738,Y
c641:99 b8 06 69 hc641 sta h06b8,Y
c644:b9 38 07 70 hc644 lda h0738,Y
c647:9d 8e c0 71 hc647 sta hc08e,X
c64a:70 76 72 bvs hc6c2
c64c:a5 38 73 hc64c lda ksw
c64e:d0 0a 74 bne hc65a
c650:c4 39 75 cpy ksw+1
c652:d0 06 76 bne hc65a
c654:a9 07 77 lda #$7
c656:85 38 78 sta ksw
c658:50 37 79 bvc hc691
c65a:a9 05 80 hc65a lda #$5
c65c:85 36 81 sta csw
c65e:bd 8e c0 82 hc65e lda hc08e,X
c661:29 02 83 and #$2
c663:f0 f9 84 beq hc65e
c665:b9 b8 06 85 lda h06b8,Y
c668:2a 86 rol
c669:68 87 pla
c66a:9d 8f c0 88 sta hc08f,X
c66d:b0 05 89 bcs hc674
c66f:08 90 php
c670:20 f0 fd 91 jsr cout1
c673:28 92 plp
c674:70 ce 93 hc674 bvs hc644
c676:ba 94 hc676 tsx
c677:e8 95 inx
c678:e8 96 inx
c679:e8 97 inx
c67a:9d 00 01 98 sta stack,X
c67d:50 03 99 bvc hc682
c67f:20 89 fe 100 jsr setkbd
c682:68 101 hc682 pla
c683:a8 102 tay
c684:68 103 pla
c685:aa 104 tax
c686:68 105 pla
c687:60 106 rts
c688:ac f8 07 107 hc688 ldy mslot
c68b:50 35 108 bvc hc6c2
c68d:48 109 pha
c68e:18 110 clc
c68f:90 cd 111 hc68f bcc hc65e
c691:a4 24 112 hc691 ldy ch
c693:ad 00 c0 113 lda kbd
c696:10 35 114 bpl hc6cd
c698:68 115 pla
c699:08 116 php
c69a:20 26 fd 117 jsr keyin3
c69d:28 118 plp
c69e:c9 81 119 cmp #$81
c6a0:d0 e6 120 bne hc688
c6a2:20 1b fd 121 jsr keyin
c6a5:2c 58 ff 122 hc6a5 bit knownRTS ; set oVerflow
c6a8:c9 98 123 cmp #$98
c6aa:f0 ca 124 beq hc676
c6ac:ac f8 07 125 ldy mslot
c6af:c9 86 126 cmp #$86
c6b1:f0 8e 127 beq hc641
c6b3:49 e3 128 eor #$e3
c6b5:c9 52 129 cmp #$52
c6b7:f0 85 130 beq hc63e
c6b9:c9 70 131 cmp #$70
c6bb:f0 8a 132 beq hc647
c6bd:90 82 133 bcc hc641
c6bf:b0 83 134 bcs hc644
c6c1:b8 135 hc6c1 clv
c6c2:a4 24 136 hc6c2 ldy ch
c6c4:b1 28 137 lda (base),Y
c6c6:48 138 pha
c6c7:29 3f 139 and #$3f
c6c9:09 40 140 ora #$40
c6cb:91 28 141 sta (base),Y
c6cd:e6 4e 142 hc6cd inc random
c6cf:d0 02 143 bne hc6d3
c6d1:e6 4f 144 inc random+1
c6d3:bd 8e c0 145 hc6d3 lda hc08e,X
c6d6:4a 146 lsr
c6d7:90 b8 147 bcc hc691
c6d9:68 148 pla
c6da:91 28 149 sta (base),Y
c6dc:bd 8f c0 150 lda hc08f,X
c6df:09 80 151 ora #$80
c6e1:c9 8a 152 cmp #$8a
c6e3:f0 dd 153 beq hc6c2
c6e5:c9 94 154 cmp #$94
c6e7:f0 bc 155 beq hc6a5
c6e9:c9 92 156 cmp #$92
c6eb:f0 d4 157 beq hc6c1
c6ed:50 87 158 bvc hc676
c6ef:08 159 php
c6f0:c9 e0 160 cmp #$e0
c6f2:90 06 161 bcc hc6fa
c6f4:ac f8 07 162 ldy mslot
c6f7:59 38 06 163 eor h0638,Y
c6fa:20 ed fd 164 hc6fa jsr cout
c6fd:28 165 plp
c6fe:70 166 hex 70 ; bvs ???


So we can conclude that it's not a disk-drive related PROM.


--
--
Jerry awanderin at gmail dot com
Re: Disk II Controller [message #388176 is a reply to message #388136] Tue, 29 October 2019 20:52 Go to previous messageGo to next message
Anonymous
Karma:
Originally posted by: Anthony Adverse

> Any idea where it came from?
>
> None of my ROM files nor reference materials contain 341-0006 either.
>
> --
> --
> Jerry awanderin at gmail dot com

Nice work, I can send it home to the Communications Card. Someone trying to do serial communications to their floppy? :) Maybe they were trying for a 1541 (chuckle). Actually the guy I picked these cards up from, hadn't looked at them in years and didn't remember what most of the roms were. So I'm guessing it went in by accident, or it was a safe socket to pop it in at the time for some reason.

A
Re: Disk II Controller [message #388177 is a reply to message #388176] Tue, 29 October 2019 22:04 Go to previous messageGo to next message
Anonymous
Karma:
Originally posted by: awanderin

Anthony Adverse <the.ertceps@gmail.com> writes:

>> Any idea where it came from?
>>
>> None of my ROM files nor reference materials contain 341-0006 either.
>>
>> --
>> --
>> Jerry awanderin at gmail dot com
>
> Nice work, I can send it home to the Communications Card. Someone
> trying to do serial communications to their floppy? :) Maybe they were
> trying for a 1541 (chuckle). Actually the guy I picked these cards up
> from, hadn't looked at them in years and didn't remember what most of
> the roms were. So I'm guessing it went in by accident, or it was a
> safe socket to pop it in at the time for some reason.

I was just poking through the photos of Apple II boards on Asimov and
ran across an Apple Communications Card, and yes, there is the
341-0006.

ftp.apple.asimov.net/pub/apple_II/documentation/hardware/pho tos/Apple II Series Computer Hardware Photo Collection_vol_18.zip

and the file is "photo collection 18/Apple-II-Communications-Card2.jpg"



--
Jerry awanderin at gmail dot com
Re: Disk II Controller [message #388185 is a reply to message #388174] Wed, 30 October 2019 14:56 Go to previous messageGo to next message
Patrick Schaefer is currently offline  Patrick Schaefer
Messages: 67
Registered: October 2012
Karma: 0
Member
Am 30.10.2019 um 01:16 schrieb awanderin:

> Which disassembles to this code, and it looks like some type of
> communications code:
(...)

Here is the manual of the Apple Communications Card:
http://www.computinghistory.org.uk/downloads/32502

Starting from pdf page 13 is the source listing of the P2 PROM, which
looks very similar to your disassembly. And here we learn that the
missing byte is $C2.


Patrick
Re: Disk II Controller [message #388187 is a reply to message #388185] Wed, 30 October 2019 17:33 Go to previous messageGo to next message
Anonymous
Karma:
Originally posted by: awanderin

Patrick Schaefer <pa.schaefer@web.de> writes:

> Am 30.10.2019 um 01:16 schrieb awanderin:
>
>> Which disassembles to this code, and it looks like some type of
>> communications code:
> (...)
>
> Here is the manual of the Apple Communications Card:
> http://www.computinghistory.org.uk/downloads/32502
>
> Starting from pdf page 13 is the source listing of the P2 PROM, which
> looks very similar to your disassembly. And here we learn that the
> missing byte is $C2.

That's great, Patrick! Thanks.

--
Jerry awanderin at gmail dot com
Re: Disk II Controller [message #388188 is a reply to message #388185] Wed, 30 October 2019 18:45 Go to previous messageGo to next message
Anonymous
Karma:
Originally posted by: Anthony Adverse

On Thursday, October 31, 2019 at 5:56:12 AM UTC+11, Patrick Schaefer wrote:
> Am 30.10.2019 um 01:16 schrieb awanderin:
>
>> Which disassembles to this code, and it looks like some type of
>> communications code:
> (...)
>
> Here is the manual of the Apple Communications Card:
> http://www.computinghistory.org.uk/downloads/32502
>
> Starting from pdf page 13 is the source listing of the P2 PROM, which
> looks very similar to your disassembly. And here we learn that the
> missing byte is $C2.
>
>
> Patrick

Oddly enough, my testing of this card, in ProTerm it seems to function without the prom in place. Although it might explain some other issues with it.

Has anyone tried playing telepong? :)

A
Re: Disk II Controller [message #388191 is a reply to message #388188] Wed, 30 October 2019 20:51 Go to previous messageGo to next message
Anonymous
Karma:
Originally posted by: awanderin

Anthony Adverse <the.ertceps@gmail.com> writes:

> On Thursday, October 31, 2019 at 5:56:12 AM UTC+11, Patrick Schaefer wrote:
>> Am 30.10.2019 um 01:16 schrieb awanderin:
>>
>>> Which disassembles to this code, and it looks like some type of
>>> communications code:
>> (...)
>>
>> Here is the manual of the Apple Communications Card:
>> http://www.computinghistory.org.uk/downloads/32502
>>
>> Starting from pdf page 13 is the source listing of the P2 PROM, which
>> looks very similar to your disassembly. And here we learn that the
>> missing byte is $C2.
>>
>>
>> Patrick
>
> Oddly enough, my testing of this card, in ProTerm it seems to function
> without the prom in place. Although it might explain some other issues
> with it.
>
> Has anyone tried playing telepong? :)

Nope. :)

ProTERM probably has its own more efficient driver and talks directly to
the hardware.

--
Jerry awanderin at gmail dot com
Re: Disk II Controller [message #388196 is a reply to message #388188] Thu, 31 October 2019 13:13 Go to previous messageGo to next message
scott is currently offline  scott
Messages: 4237
Registered: February 2012
Karma: 0
Senior Member
In article <48595e16-8aac-4582-a55a-c77d0a69713c@googlegroups.com>,
Anthony Adverse <the.ertceps@gmail.com> wrote:
> Oddly enough, my testing of this card, in ProTerm it seems to function
> without the prom in place. Although it might explain some other issues
> with it.

It probably talks directly to the communications chip. I suspect you could
pull the ROM off a Super Serial Card and still use it with ProTERM, too.

_/_
/ v \ Scott Alfter (remove the obvious to send mail)
(IIGS( https://alfter.us/ Top-posting!
\_^_/ >What's the most annoying thing on Usenet?
Re: Disk II Controller [message #388198 is a reply to message #388196] Thu, 31 October 2019 18:17 Go to previous messageGo to next message
roughana is currently offline  roughana
Messages: 219
Registered: November 2012
Karma: 0
Senior Member
Scott Alfter <scott@alfter.diespammersdie.us> wrote:
> In article <48595e16-8aac-4582-a55a-c77d0a69713c@googlegroups.com>,
> Anthony Adverse <the.ertceps@gmail.com> wrote:
>> Oddly enough, my testing of this card, in ProTerm it seems to function
>> without the prom in place.
>
> It probably talks directly to the communications chip. I suspect you could
> pull the ROM off a Super Serial Card and still use it with ProTERM, too.

How does this work? Is the comms chip mapped into specific $Cxyy addresses
that is a standard for serial cards?

Regards
Andrew
Re: Disk II Controller [message #388201 is a reply to message #388198] Fri, 01 November 2019 00:40 Go to previous messageGo to next message
Anonymous
Karma:
Originally posted by: awanderin

Andrew Roughan <andrew.roughan@writeme.com> writes:

> Scott Alfter <scott@alfter.diespammersdie.us> wrote:
>> In article <48595e16-8aac-4582-a55a-c77d0a69713c@googlegroups.com>,
>> Anthony Adverse <the.ertceps@gmail.com> wrote:
>>> Oddly enough, my testing of this card, in ProTerm it seems to function
>>> without the prom in place.
>>
>> It probably talks directly to the communications chip. I suspect you could
>> pull the ROM off a Super Serial Card and still use it with ProTERM, too.
>
> How does this work? Is the comms chip mapped into specific $Cxyy addresses
> that is a standard for serial cards?

Yes, each card decodes its hardware registers into the $C0sx range,
where s=Slot + 8, and x=0...f.

However, without the ROM mapped into $Cn00-CnFF, the program cannot know
what card is installed unless the user tells it so. Lots of programs
did just this.

--
--
Jerry awanderin at gmail dot com
Re: Disk II Controller [message #388205 is a reply to message #388198] Fri, 01 November 2019 13:39 Go to previous messageGo to next message
scott is currently offline  scott
Messages: 4237
Registered: February 2012
Karma: 0
Senior Member
In article <qpfmhb$814$1@dont-email.me>,
Andrew Roughan <andrew.roughan@writeme.com> wrote:
> Scott Alfter <scott@alfter.diespammersdie.us> wrote:
>> In article <48595e16-8aac-4582-a55a-c77d0a69713c@googlegroups.com>,
>> Anthony Adverse <the.ertceps@gmail.com> wrote:
>>> Oddly enough, my testing of this card, in ProTerm it seems to function
>>> without the prom in place.
>>
>> It probably talks directly to the communications chip. I suspect you could
>> pull the ROM off a Super Serial Card and still use it with ProTERM, too.
>
> How does this work? Is the comms chip mapped into specific $Cxyy addresses
> that is a standard for serial cards?

The registers on the chip are mapped into the slot I/O space. For instance,
a Super Serial Card in slot 1 will have the 6551's registers mapped to
$C098-$C09B. By manipulating the registers as described in the 6551's
datasheet, you can talk to the outside world without going through the ROM
routines.

Registers for the older serial cards are almost certainly different, but
they should be documented somewhere.

(For the SSC, you want the older (1981) edition of the manual; the newer
(1985) edition leaves out lots of technical details. The older manual is
available at
https://archive.org/details/a2_Super_Serial_Card_installatio n_and_operating_Manual.)

_/_
/ v \ Scott Alfter (remove the obvious to send mail)
(IIGS( https://alfter.us/ Top-posting!
\_^_/ >What's the most annoying thing on Usenet?
Re: Disk II Controller [message #388206 is a reply to message #388205] Fri, 01 November 2019 17:31 Go to previous messageGo to next message
Anonymous
Karma:
Originally posted by: Anthony Adverse

On Saturday, November 2, 2019 at 4:39:59 AM UTC+11, Scott Alfter wrote:
> In article <qpfmhb$814$1@dont-email.me>,
> Andrew Roughan <andrew.roughan@writeme.com> wrote:
>> Scott Alfter <scott@alfter.diespammersdie.us> wrote:
>>> In article <48595e16-8aac-4582-a55a-c77d0a69713c@googlegroups.com>,
>>> Anthony Adverse <the.ertceps@gmail.com> wrote:
>>>> Oddly enough, my testing of this card, in ProTerm it seems to function
>>>> without the prom in place.
>>>
>>> It probably talks directly to the communications chip. I suspect you could
>>> pull the ROM off a Super Serial Card and still use it with ProTERM, too.
>>
>> How does this work? Is the comms chip mapped into specific $Cxyy addresses
>> that is a standard for serial cards?
>
> The registers on the chip are mapped into the slot I/O space. For instance,
> a Super Serial Card in slot 1 will have the 6551's registers mapped to
> $C098-$C09B. By manipulating the registers as described in the 6551's
> datasheet, you can talk to the outside world without going through the ROM
> routines.
>
> Registers for the older serial cards are almost certainly different, but
> they should be documented somewhere.
>
> (For the SSC, you want the older (1981) edition of the manual; the newer
> (1985) edition leaves out lots of technical details. The older manual is
> available at
> https://archive.org/details/a2_Super_Serial_Card_installatio n_and_operating_Manual.)
>
> _/_
> / v \ Scott Alfter (remove the obvious to send mail)
> (IIGS( https://alfter.us/ Top-posting!
> \_^_/ >What's the most annoying thing on Usenet?

The other interesting thing I've found... Is the 6850 based cards seem to be pretty similar to each other. The same driver for the CCS7710 will run the Apple Communications Card which doesn't have a driver listed.

A
Re: Disk II Controller [message #388222 is a reply to message #388206] Sat, 02 November 2019 00:28 Go to previous message
Michael J. Mahon is currently offline  Michael J. Mahon
Messages: 1767
Registered: October 2012
Karma: 0
Senior Member
Anthony Adverse <the.ertceps@gmail.com> wrote:
> On Saturday, November 2, 2019 at 4:39:59 AM UTC+11, Scott Alfter wrote:
>> In article <qpfmhb$814$1@dont-email.me>,
>> Andrew Roughan <andrew.roughan@writeme.com> wrote:
>>> Scott Alfter <scott@alfter.diespammersdie.us> wrote:
>>>> In article <48595e16-8aac-4582-a55a-c77d0a69713c@googlegroups.com>,
>>>> Anthony Adverse <the.ertceps@gmail.com> wrote:
>>>> > Oddly enough, my testing of this card, in ProTerm it seems to function
>>>> > without the prom in place.
>>>>
>>>> It probably talks directly to the communications chip. I suspect you could
>>>> pull the ROM off a Super Serial Card and still use it with ProTERM, too.
>>>
>>> How does this work? Is the comms chip mapped into specific $Cxyy addresses
>>> that is a standard for serial cards?
>>
>> The registers on the chip are mapped into the slot I/O space. For instance,
>> a Super Serial Card in slot 1 will have the 6551's registers mapped to
>> $C098-$C09B. By manipulating the registers as described in the 6551's
>> datasheet, you can talk to the outside world without going through the ROM
>> routines.
>>
>> Registers for the older serial cards are almost certainly different, but
>> they should be documented somewhere.
>>
>> (For the SSC, you want the older (1981) edition of the manual; the newer
>> (1985) edition leaves out lots of technical details. The older manual is
>> available at
>> https://archive.org/details/a2_Super_Serial_Card_installatio n_and_operating_Manual.)
>>
>> _/_
>> / v \ Scott Alfter (remove the obvious to send mail)
>> (IIGS( https://alfter.us/ Top-posting!
>> \_^_/ >What's the most annoying thing on Usenet?
>
> The other interesting thing I've found... Is the 6850 based cards seem to
> be pretty similar to each other. The same driver for the CCS7710 will
> run the Apple Communications Card which doesn't have a driver listed.
>
> A
>

There is a competitive advantage (or the absence of a disadvantage) in
mapping your hardware in the same way as predecessors. Your card is
immediately compatible with the prior cards’ (non-ROM) drivers.

--
-michael - NadaNet 3.1 and AppleCrate II: http://michaeljmahon.com
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