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ST wins over Amiga [message #279410] Thu, 12 December 1985 10:46 Go to next message
rtb is currently offline  rtb
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Article-I.D.: ihlpm.617
Posted: Thu Dec 12 10:46:22 1985
Date-Received: Fri, 13-Dec-85 08:36:05 EST
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Xref: watmath net.micro.amiga:1080 net.micro.atari:1954



  After reading a lot of articles about this years Comdex it is
becoming more obvious that Atari has already won in the ST vs.
Amiga wars. The main complaint about the ST was that there was
no available software. There was plenty of software to be shown
at the show. Commadore did not show up. After reading articles
in many magazines about Commadore's financial woes, the speculation
that they were too broke isn't hard to believe. Also, a lot of
the touted software for the Amiga has yet to hit the shelves.
Atari has sold more than 100,000 520STs and now that the software
is available, distributors are again having a hard time keeping
up with demand for 520STs. A few calls to Atari retailers, especially
the mail order people can verify this. I predict that unless
Commadore can do something really spectacular to turn this
around that the Amiga will fade away by the middle of next
year.

A side note for ST fans:

Atari is now marketing a 1 meg ST in Germany with a built in
disk drive. Supposedly the ST is the #1 best seller in that
country.

						R.T. Bradstrum
Re: ST wins over Amiga [message #279444 is a reply to message #279410] Fri, 13 December 1985 21:19 Go to previous messageGo to next message
mwm is currently offline  mwm
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Article-I.D.: ucbjade.204
Posted: Fri Dec 13 21:19:30 1985
Date-Received: Sat, 14-Dec-85 23:54:18 EST
References: <617@ihlpm.UUCP>
Sender: network@ucbjade.BERKELEY.EDU
Reply-To: mwm@ucbopal.UUCP (Mike (I'll be mellow when I'm dead) Meyer)
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Xref: watmath net.micro.amiga:1110 net.micro.atari:1967

In article <617@ihlpm.UUCP> rtb@ihlpm.UUCP (Todd) writes:
 >   After reading a lot of articles about this years Comdex it is
 > becoming more obvious that Atari has already won in the ST vs.
 > Amiga wars.
technically 

So Atari follows in IBM's footsteps, and succeeds with a technically
inferior product :-).

Seriously, I don't own either machine. I'm probably going to be buying one
in the near future (january), and haven't decided which. However, I want a
machine for twiddling LISP, which means (to me - I want to load the editor
and MasterScope and the online help and ...) lotsa-memory. Say, 4 Meg or so.
Atari doesn't seem to want to market a machine to do that. The Amiga is
open, and there are 2Meg boards on the market.

Of course, the plaintiff cries from people trying to twiddle the mouse from
C doesn't help the ST any.

And I'm going to ignore the prospects of Commodore going under. I'll pick
the machine that best does what I want, then support the company that makes
it.

Final thought: I'd be suprised if the ST doesn't outsell the Amiga, by 2:1
or better. After all, I expect most people to look at them, see windows and
two price tags (one roughly 1/2 the other), and buy the smaller price tag.

	  

		
		
		
Re: ST wins over Amiga [message #279493 is a reply to message #279410] Mon, 16 December 1985 15:26 Go to previous messageGo to next message
tim is currently offline  tim
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Article-I.D.: ism780c.157
Posted: Mon Dec 16 15:26:08 1985
Date-Received: Wed, 18-Dec-85 04:49:11 EST
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Reply-To: tim@ism780c.UUCP (Tim Smith)
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Xref: watmath net.micro.amiga:1160 net.micro.atari:1997

There is certainly more software advertized for the Amiga in the L.A.
area.  It doesn't matter if the ST has more software at shows, if it
isn't being sold!  There are also more places advertizing themselves
as Amiga dealers in the L.A. area.

By the way, does anyone know what the Atari arcade game people have
against DEC?  I am refering to the game _Major Havoc_, where one fights
against the Evil Vaxxxian Empire, from the planet of Maynard.
-- 
Tim Smith       sdcrdcf!ism780c!tim || ima!ism780!tim || ihnp4!cithep!tim
Re: ST wins over Amiga [message #279496 is a reply to message #279410] Mon, 16 December 1985 19:47 Go to previous messageGo to next message
dave is currently offline  dave
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Article-I.D.: heurikon.145
Posted: Mon Dec 16 19:47:50 1985
Date-Received: Wed, 18-Dec-85 05:08:16 EST
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 >  
 >  
 >    After reading a lot of articles about this years Comdex it is
 >  becoming more obvious that Atari has already won in the ST vs.
 >  Amiga wars. The main complaint about the ST was that there was
 >  no available software. There was plenty of software to be shown
 >  at the show.

	Who said there was a war? Both machines have a lot to contibute to the
personal computer world. That aside, software at a show and software on the
shelves are two vastly different things. I am certain that if Commodore had
gone to the show they could have dug up at least two dozen software vendors to
come to the show and display their wares, even if the software is not ready to
ship. Electronic Arts, one of the biggest manufacturers of entertainment
software, just last week started shipping Amiga software. To the best of my
knowledge they are not even planning to produce on software for the ST. To
claim that the software is here based on a few software vendors at a show is
over-exagerating a little.

							Dave Scidmore
RE: ST wins over Amiga [message #279516 is a reply to message #279410] Tue, 17 December 1985 06:20 Go to previous messageGo to next message
jmellby%ti-eg.csnet is currently offline  jmellby%ti-eg.csnet
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Article-I.D.: caip.752
Posted: Tue Dec 17 06:20:30 1985
Date-Received: Thu, 19-Dec-85 05:58:13 EST
Sender: daemon@caip.RUTGERS.EDU
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From: John_Mellby 

Although someone said there was lots of Atari 520ST software out,
I haven't seen any in the biggest local software chain
(this is Babbages which is mainly games, utilities, educational software
mostly under $100, with a few bigger programs, selling for a
small discount under retail).

On the other hand, Amiga software appeared in Babbages in the last week.
EA's Deluxe Paint, a few other games by EA, Activision, and Infocom.


The best laid plans of mice and men
are held up in the legal department!

John Mellby                    P.O.Box 801, Mail Station 8007
Texas Instruments              McKinney Texas 75069
JMELLBY%TI-EG@CSNET-RELAY      (214) 242-9641
Re: ST wins over Amiga [message #279517 is a reply to message #279410] Mon, 16 December 1985 20:46 Go to previous messageGo to next message
freed is currently offline  freed
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Article-I.D.: aum.408
Posted: Mon Dec 16 20:46:50 1985
Date-Received: Fri, 20-Dec-85 00:43:30 EST
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 >  So Atari follows in IBM's footsteps, and succeeds with a technically
 >  inferior product :-).

I still do not understand what people think technically superior is.
Obviously if price is not part of technical achievment then I will take
a Vme based Sun-3 anyday! It seems that the ST is very close technically
and indeed for a lot of people better technically and at less than half the 
cost. If all you want is a 68000 and monochrome graphics the ST has far more
going for it. This is a large market!! So if you want the animation and the
built-in sound and you want to pay for it then do so... I would rather have
the extra money to buy a synthesizer personally. (controllable from the 
*built-in* MIDI port)

 >  Seriously, I don't own either machine. I'm probably going to be buying one
 >  in the near future (january), and haven't decided which. However, I want a
 >  machine for twiddling LISP, which means (to me - I want to load the editor
 >  and MasterScope and the online help and ...) lotsa-memory. Say, 4 Meg or so.
 >  Atari doesn't seem to want to market a machine to do that. The Amiga is
 >  open, and there are 2Meg boards on the market.

I believe that 2-meg memory expansion boards are in beta test for the ST.
These require no soldering. The price is far less than the TECMAR bullshit.

 >  Of course, the plaintiff cries from people trying to twiddle the mouse from
 >  C doesn't help the ST any.

I agree thhat the software enviroment so far is better but I will probably use
OS-9 anyway and then they both will be identical

 >  And I'm going to ignore the prospects of Commodore going under. I'll pick
 >  the machine that best does what I want, then support the company that makes
 >  it.

??????

 >  Final thought: I'd be suprised if the ST doesn't outsell the Amiga, by 2:1
 >  or better. After all, I expect most people to look at them, see windows and
 >  two price tags (one roughly 1/2 the other), and buy the smaller price tag.

This could be reasonably intelligent behavior if you aren't looking for some
extraas that the Amiga has. I do not believe the majority of people really
care about amimation and fancy built-in sound, or Bus-oriented expandability.
-- 
-------------------------------------------------------------------------------
                           Erik James Freed
			   Aurora Systems
			   San Francisco, CA
			   {dual,ptsfa}!aum!freed
Re: ST wins over Amiga [message #279567 is a reply to message #279410] Thu, 19 December 1985 09:10 Go to previous messageGo to next message
srp is currently offline  srp
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Article-I.D.: houligan.235
Posted: Thu Dec 19 09:10:05 1985
Date-Received: Mon, 23-Dec-85 04:24:03 EST
References: <617@ihlpm.UUCP>
Organization: Gould Electronics, Ft. Lauderdale, Florida.
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 >>   After reading a lot of articles about this years Comdex it is
 >> becoming more obvious that Atari has already won in the ST vs.
 >> Amiga wars.
 >> Also, a lot of the touted software for the Amiga has yet to hit the shelves.

Obvious to you maybe...
I heard on the news that the Amiga is the #1 best seller this Christmas.
Amazing, considering there is so little software out there now.....But 
it's there! I've seen several different software releases by EA and 
Activision.  More coming in January.

 >> I predict that unless Commadore can do something really spectacular to 
 >> turn this around that the Amiga will fade away by the middle of next
 >> year.

Hmmmm......looking at Commodore's track record and comparing it to Atari's,
MY prediction is that you're dead wrong.  Atari's 400/800 were pretty good 
machines for their time...what SUCCESSFUL machines has Atari put out since 
then?

 >> A side note for ST fans:
 >> Atari is now marketing a 1 meg ST in Germany with a built in
 >> disk drive. Supposedly the ST is the #1 best seller in that
 >> country.
 >> 						R.T. Bradstrum

A side note for PET fans:

Commodore's PET (remember those?) was the best selling machine over in
Europe when Apples and TRS-80s were all the rage over here.  PET never 
got the kind of recognition it deserved over here.  Being a success over
there doesn't mean it will be a success here!!!  (Has Commodore even released
the Amiga to Germany?....Maybe they don't have anything else to buy but
ST's.)

Next time you want to say how great atari is, post it to net.micro.atari...
we don't want to hear it.

'Nuff said!
-- 
------
S. R. Pietrowicz   UUCP: ...!ihnp4!pur-ee!csd-gould!houligan!srp
Re: ST wins over Amiga [message #279602 is a reply to message #279410] Mon, 23 December 1985 19:21 Go to previous messageGo to next message
ravi is currently offline  ravi
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Article-I.D.: eneevax.463
Posted: Mon Dec 23 19:21:11 1985
Date-Received: Wed, 25-Dec-85 03:30:15 EST
References: <617@ihlpm.UUCP> <235@houligan.UUCP>
Reply-To: ravi@eneevax.UUCP (Ravi Kulkarni)
Organization: U of Maryland, EE Dept., College Park, MD
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In article <235@houligan.UUCP> srp@houligan.UUCP (S R Pietrowicz) writes:
 > Next time you want to say how great atari is, post it to net.micro.atari...
 > we don't want to hear it.
 > 
 > 'Nuff said!

I guess next you will be proposing that net.micro.amiga become a
moderated newsgroup run by the folks at amiga. Interesting how
you have chosen yourself as the spokesman for everybody who reads
net.micro.amiga.

-ravi



-- 
ARPA:	ravi@eneevax.umd.edu
UUCP:   [seismo,allegra]!umcp-cs!eneevax!ravi
Re: ST wins over Amiga [message #279736 is a reply to message #279410] Mon, 30 December 1985 21:04 Go to previous message
mahar is currently offline  mahar
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Article-I.D.: fear.315
Posted: Mon Dec 30 21:04:07 1985
Date-Received: Sun, 5-Jan-86 02:03:07 EST
References: <617@ihlpm.UUCP> <157@ism780c.UUCP>
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Summary: Evil Vaxxian Empire

In article <157@ism780c.UUCP>, tim@ism780c.UUCP (Tim Smith) writes:
 >  By the way, does anyone know what the Atari arcade game people have
 >  against DEC?  I am refering to the game _Major Havoc_, where one fights
 >  against the Evil Vaxxxian Empire, from the planet of Maynard.
Atari Coin-op people don't really have anything against DEC. One of the
programmers on the Mojor Hovoc project added that one day when the 780
they were running on was exceptionally slow. The higher ups didn't know
what Evil Vaxxion Empire ment so they left it in the game.
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